I don't like to say this but UNC is the current bell of the ball and they would be looking to the B1G. Both them and UVA might join the SEC but they would be holding their noses. Any podcast that doesn't mention that doesn't get those two schools. And the same goes for the B1G if they take FSU.
Stanford, Cal, and SMU - Welcome to the ACC
- Thread starter killerleft
- Start date
I don't like to say this but UNC is the current bell of the ball and they would be looking to the B1G. Both them and UVA might join the SEC but they would be holding their noses. Any podcast that doesn't mention that doesn't get those two schools. And the same goes for the B1G if they take FSU.
Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15
Member
Is there another conference that features four schools from one state, like the ACC does currently (and historically)? Feels like an anarchronism in this day and age.
The Big 12 - Texas, Texas Tech, TCU, Baylor, Houston
The MAC - Ohio, Bowling Green, Akron, Kent State, Miami (OH), Toledo.
HereBeforeCoachK
Member
Agreed, and also pretty darned funny....
They could try and nibble at maybe 4 of the 5 avenues there...and I think FSU as an arm of the State Government of Florida, as you mentioned, might help them in this. Not knowing Florida State law, I cannot speak to the specifics here...but I'm betting they're out with their fine tooth combs....
There is also the doctrine of commercial impracticability - it is for highly unusual situations far from what the parties could have reasonably expected would happen. NIL and the portal, and all that has happened as a result, would seem to fit this.
cato
Member
It is exceedingly difficult for a sophisticated party that is represented by counsel to invalidate an agreement they willingly entered into. This is particularly true where the agreement has been in place for a long time and all of the parties have enjoyed the benefit of their bargain.
And while I’m not knowledgeable about the specifics of applicable law re the ability of the Florida legislature to do anything relevant here, my guess is that it is clear, settled law that once the state agreed to be bound by an agreement like the GOR it waived any sovereign rights and now cannot un-ring that bell. Otherwise counterparties wouldn’t contract with instrumentalities of the state.
This is all why I was hoping for some well-thought-out rationale for *how* FSU or any other school would get out of the ACC. Nothing springs to mind, but then again, I’m not spending a lot of time analyzing it.
Unfortunately, we are not going to hear from the people in best position to analyze these issues (the lawyers getting paid to come up with arguments for or against) unless and until someone makes a move and folks are willing to go on record with their arguments (in court or otherwise).
JasonEvans
Host, The Duke Basketball Roundup
One more thing to add to all this... there is no fixed amount of money that allows you to break the GOR. Sure, there are sums where it becomes impractical for Duke, Wake, BC, Pitt and others who may be left in the cold in all this to not "take the deal" but it is not like there is some fixed amount enumerated in the contract that allows a team to get out of it.
The GOR gave broadcast rights from each school to the ACC for the duration of the GOR. Period, end of story. If the ACC teams who are being left out want to hold up FSU, Clemson, UNC, and others for more than what the ACC deal with ESPN calls for each school to get over the next 12 years (the GOR runs through 2036), they are perfectly in their right to do so. One could make a very solid argument that rather than "divide by 15" to determine what each team's contribution to the ESPN payout each year might be, that FSU/Clemson/UNC are worth considerably more than other ACC teams. Heck, one could even use FSU's arguments about staggered payouts that they have been making in recent months as proof that this is the case.
I think my $300 mil estimate may be low... perhaps staggeringly low for what it could cost to buy your way out of the GOR. When one considers the implosion of the ACC that will happen and the harm that would come to the athletic programs of the schools left behind, the buyout number likely starts with a 4 or a 5.
The GOR gave broadcast rights from each school to the ACC for the duration of the GOR. Period, end of story. If the ACC teams who are being left out want to hold up FSU, Clemson, UNC, and others for more than what the ACC deal with ESPN calls for each school to get over the next 12 years (the GOR runs through 2036), they are perfectly in their right to do so. One could make a very solid argument that rather than "divide by 15" to determine what each team's contribution to the ESPN payout each year might be, that FSU/Clemson/UNC are worth considerably more than other ACC teams. Heck, one could even use FSU's arguments about staggered payouts that they have been making in recent months as proof that this is the case.
I think my $300 mil estimate may be low... perhaps staggeringly low for what it could cost to buy your way out of the GOR. When one considers the implosion of the ACC that will happen and the harm that would come to the athletic programs of the schools left behind, the buyout number likely starts with a 4 or a 5.
hallcity
Member
It's not just the uncertainty for the departing school. It's also the uncertainty for a new conference they might hope to join. This isn't happening. It's wildly impractical.
Well, the PAC-12 in California, at least for one final season.
And the AAC in Texas: UTSA, Rice, SMU, North Texas. So that's another one that ends after this season, at least as a four-way.
And the Big 12: Texas, TCU, Baylor, Texas Tech. Another sunset.
In the Big West, 10 of the 11 teams are from California. Break 'em up!
AustinDevil
Member
I agree there is a clear Tier 1 of SEC/B1G, but there is no doubt that when the Big 12 loses Texas and OU at the end of the current academic year, the ACC is its own Tier 2, and the Big 12 is Tier 3.
As noted above, there were five this year (Houston) and will still be four next year without Texas. The real historical leader here was of course the Southwest Conference, which from the mid-1920s when OU and what became Oklahoma State left was made up entirely (1990-95) or almost entirely (1920s until 1990, when Arkansas left) of Texas schools. Of course, Texas is far bigger than North Carolina, as any Texan will tell you.
sagegrouse
Member
Been looked at by many teams of lawyers.
CameronBornAndBred
Well-known member
Has FSU's law school created a course around it yet?
I can speak for the State of Florida. Our legislature will spend our tax dollars on any lawsuits they feel like, regardless of chances for success. And they can obviously outspend the conferences.
RoseBowl1942
Member
Any rational actors in Tallahassee and Clemson will wait to see how the auto-bids for the top 4 conference champions plays out, UNLESS there is real fear that players get a cut of TV revenue over the short term. Then there is such a competitive disadvantage that they have to leave. But if that doesn’t happen (i.e., it’s just NIL money) then no one is leaving for another 2-3 years to see how this all plays out
RoseBowl1942
Member
For the record, they will leave eventually. But I think they stay until the GOR ends as they will see a path to the playoff that’s not crazy challenging
RoseBowl1942
Member
Also I still think if they can make the money work, it’s beneficial to stay in the ACC. If you win the conference, you get a first round bye. And you don’t get beaten up with injuries in the SEC or B10. It’s not a bad gig if the dollars like up
Bay Area Duke Fan
Member
Seven of the nine members of the West Coast Conference are in California.
