The saga of Daniel Jones thread (latest update: Released by Giants)

I didn't follow him at Duke but is there any reason to think he can thrive in that offense, especially if they still have such a terrible line? I know he's getting paid a lot but every time I see him get crushed... You see guys in their 40s and 50s who are only quasi ambulatory who say the money wasn't worth it.
Heard Phil Simms say that there is a lot more explosive talent on the offense this year, and that explosive talent gets open quicker so that should help the line and DJ. So can he thrive in this years' version of the Giants offense? IDK....he's gonna have to learn to step UP into the pocket and not just back out all the time...and hopefully there really is upgraded talent at WR. Like to see him rip off another long run or two also.
 
Whether or not Daniel can stay healthy is one of the biggest questions facing the Giants this off-season. There is a clause in DJ's contract that guarantees him an extra $25 mil in 2025 if he gets injured in 2024. If the Giants do not start out well and Danny Dimes is only throwing nickels, they might bench him so as to prevent him from getting hurt and having that injury guarantee kick in.

Obviously, the best situation is that the Giants and Danny play well and then no one cares, but if either of them struggle a bit, there is some extra incentive for the Giants to bench Daniel. It is strange and you can read more about how complicated this is here-- https://gmenhq.com/posts/why-daniel-jones-contract-even-more-complicated-2024-01hs9842979g
 
Whether or not Daniel can stay healthy is one of the biggest questions facing the Giants this off-season. There is a clause in DJ's contract that guarantees him an extra $25 mil in 2025 if he gets injured in 2024. If the Giants do not start out well and Danny Dimes is only throwing nickels, they might bench him so as to prevent him from getting hurt and having that injury guarantee kick in.

Obviously, the best situation is that the Giants and Danny play well and then no one cares, but if either of them struggle a bit, there is some extra incentive for the Giants to bench Daniel. It is strange and you can read more about how complicated this is here-- https://gmenhq.com/posts/why-daniel-jones-contract-even-more-complicated-2024-01hs9842979g
Dang...is it just me, or does this put Jones and the Giants in the potential position of being absolute adversaries? What an absurd contract provision. This is a poison pill that may doom Jones' career. Among the obvious pitfalls, one less obvious one may be that the Giants won't let him run with this hanging over their heads, and taking that weapon away further reduces the chance DJ will be successful.

The article talks about this provision being "sneaky." Hmm.
 
Dang...is it just me, or does this put Jones and the Giants in the potential position of being absolute adversaries? What an absurd contract provision. This is a poison pill that may doom Jones' career. Among the obvious pitfalls, one less obvious one may be that the Giants won't let him run with this hanging over their heads, and taking that weapon away further reduces the chance DJ will be successful.

The article talks about this provision being "sneaky." Hmm.
I mean, a contract is a conventual agreement between two parties. I guarantee you more lawyers have looked at that document than I've met in my lifetime. The Giants chose to pay DJ's contract. He chose to accept the terms.

I'd suggest the "poison pill" was being drafted by a floundering Giants organization.
 
I mean, a contract is a conventual agreement between two parties. I guarantee you more lawyers have looked at that document than I've met in my lifetime. The Giants chose to pay DJ's contract. He chose to accept the terms.

I'd suggest the "poison pill" was being drafted by a floundering Giants organization.
All of that is true. None of that changes the potential that it will lead to some negative unintended consequences for one or both parties. Keep in mind, I assume the person writing that story is somewhat of an expert on NFL contracts, and they called it bizarre and very unusual - and "sneaky" was their term. That a bunch of lawyers looked at it is of no comfort. It was the awkward game of "gotcha" between parties that ultimately have their interests aligned in real life. Those attorneys are already well paid for their efforts. If it bombs on DJ and or the Giants, they will not have to return their fees.

Common sense tells us DJ will be on a very short leash regarding his health, and that's not going to increase his chances of playing free and loose - ie - letting his powerful legs and arms do what they do. I don't need a lawyer to weigh in on that.
 
I am a Giants ticket holder and fan for 60 years. While I suffer with the poor teams, the 3 Super Bowls are awfully sweet memories.

A large part of the Giants' (or giant?) failures have been the inertia of the owners to do things the old fashioned way, to stick with people too long out of loyalty, and fail to embrace the future. Regrettably, drafting Daniel may have been part of that mold. I mean, Daniel does look the part of a 1960's quarterback and his lack of awareness in the pocket doesn't help his cause.

However, I'd like to think that my friends and family who accompany me to games, and the fans I speak with and see on a daily basis and at games, are a better indicator of how Giants fans really feel about Jones than a message board of fair weather fans and the NY Post headlines. Giants fans generally don't feel Jones has gotten a chance to show what he can do and are hoping with better receivers and O line that we can finally see if the playoff win was an illusion or a preview of what Daniel can do. This will certainly be the last year Daniel gets to show his stuff and we are hoping for the best.
 
All of that is true. None of that changes the potential that it will lead to some negative unintended consequences for one or both parties. Keep in mind, I assume the person writing that story is somewhat of an expert on NFL contracts, and they called it bizarre and very unusual - and "sneaky" was their term. That a bunch of lawyers looked at it is of no comfort. It was the awkward game of "gotcha" between parties that ultimately have their interests aligned in real life. Those attorneys are already well paid for their efforts. If it bombs on DJ and or the Giants, they will not have to return their fees.

Common sense tells us DJ will be on a very short leash regarding his health, and that's not going to increase his chances of playing free and loose - ie - letting his powerful legs and arms do what they do. I don't need a lawyer to weigh in on that.
Yeah, that's the opposite of what the typical "stay in good health" bonus language says. But I think it's smart his agent inserted the provision. Either protect Daniel / get him weapons so that he can (hopefully) stay healthy, or just bench him which protects his health and he tries to get a fresh start someplace else. My guess is that it will be the latter situation and the Giants will look to bench him ASAP this coming season. Which unfortunately will endear him even less to the fans.
 
I don't get all the silliness about the fans liking or disliking Jones. They are fans like all fans, they love him when they win (which is rare), hate him when they lose...what they think is completely whimsical and inconsequential.
 
I don't get all the silliness about the fans liking or disliking Jones. They are fans like all fans, they love him when they win (which is rare), hate him when they lose...what they think is completely whimsical and inconsequential.
yeah who cares about fans. All they do is pay all the bills...
 
If that were literally true the Charlotte Hornets would not exist.
Wrong conclusion. The Hornets exist because they are in a league with a LOT of fans. So yes, it is literally true, the way its true for Duke football or Cincinnati Reds baseball and many other teams in many leagues. The only reason the entire operation exists is for the fans - even if some "branch offices" of that operation do not have many fans.

Otherwise, we call in intramural.
 
Wrong conclusion. The Hornets exist because they are in a league with a LOT of fans. So yes, it is literally true, the way its true for Duke football or Cincinnati Reds baseball and many other teams in many leagues. The only reason the entire operation exists is for the fans - even if some "branch offices" of that operation do not have many fans.

Otherwise, we call in intramural.
Then why is it different for the NYG? Surely football is even more popular than basketball. New York is a big branch office. So why do Giants fans pay the bills and Hornets fans not? Please educate me, since it seems so very clear to you.
 
Then why is it different for the NYG? Surely football is even more popular than basketball. New York is a big branch office. So why do Giants fans pay the bills and Hornets fans not? Please educate me, since it seems so very clear to you.
Uh, maybe because it's easier to sell out in a city of 15 million than it is in a city of one million? Maybe it's easier to sell out when you have a storied franchise in the nation's top media market than it is when you have a franchise who's history is largely filled with failure? Not sure where you're going with this. A league must have more than one team.

Are you really advocating the position that any of these leagues would exist without fans. By the way, in this context, fans are CUSTOMERS.
 
Uh, maybe because it's easier to sell out in a city of 15 million than it is in a city of one million? Maybe it's easier to sell out when you have a storied franchise in the nation's top media market than it is when you have a franchise who's history is largely filled with failure? Not sure where you're going with this. A league must have more than one team.

Are you really advocating the position that any of these leagues would exist without fans. By the way, in this context, fans are CUSTOMERS.
I don't think I'm quite as stupid as you seem to be assuming.

I don't understand why you are suggesting that the love of fans is more important in a city the size of NYC instead of Charlotte.

Very few people care about the Hornets. You could easily find more people who are die hard Giants fans who will never turn their back on Jones or any other Giants player than you can find people who have ever been to a Hornets game.

This being the case, wouldn't it be FAR more important from a financial survival point for Hornets coaches/players/GMs to ingratiated themselves to the few fans they have than for Daniel Jones to leave money on the table and make some fans happy?

Yes, teams need people to show up and tune in. That's clear. I don't understand why you are suggesting that the metrics are so decidedly different for the Giants than the Hornets. It appears to me that NYG has huge advantages:

More popular sport
More popular league
More popular team
More successful franchise

Seems the Giants have earned the benefit of the doubt. The Hornets have none of these and ought to be the ones actively courting fans.

Please show me my logical errors. For extra points, please be as condescending as possible and say that it's "obvious" or "logical."
 
Now it all comes together for me. You're a Giants exec, right? That checks all the boxes...
Setting aside the Giants per se - are you really arguing that the fans (ie, CUSTOMERS) are not important? I would venture a guess that in the Fuqua School of bidness.......customers are considered integral to any and all business pursuits. As in, without customers (in this case fans), the pursuit would not even exist.
 
Setting aside the Giants per se - are you really arguing that the fans (ie, CUSTOMERS) are not important? I would venture a guess that in the Fuqua School of bidness.......customers are considered integral to any and all business pursuits. As in, without customers (in this case fans), the pursuit would not even exist.
Do you think Daniel Jones' contract will mean a significant number of Giants fans will walk away from the sport? If so, your argument holds some water.
 
Do you think Daniel Jones' contract will mean a significant number of Giants fans will walk away from the sport? If so, your argument holds some water.
No, not arguing that per se.....but his contract has made a lot of fans walk away from liking Daniel Jones.........so read into that implications on his future earnings......from endorsements......read into that how much leeway he'll get from coaches.........read into that what you will on whether other GMs and owners will take a chance on him if the Giants thing blows up.
 
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