Jay Bilas talk to basketball team

sagegrouse said:
He is clearly loyal to Duke -- it's his team and teammates, Coach K, his daughter's enrollment at Duke, etc. A lot of people here don't get it.
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Sporkz. The bashing gets very tiresome. I don’t know if it is one of Throaty’s list of eternal subjects that is short-handed but it should be.
 
Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15 said:
How would you characterize the giant chasm of attitudes towards Bilas on this board? Seems to me there are those of us who give him the benefit of the doubt and those who look for nits to pick.

He's absolutely in the "most-trashed former Duke starter" with Jalen Johnson, Kyrie, and Rasheed Sulaimon. He's certainly one of the most visible post-basketball-career Blue Devils, with Jay Williams a distant second.
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Sure, happy to unpack. Though I'll note that you've moved the goalposts versus what the original poster said: "benefit of the doubt" versus "nits to pick" is less egregious but still biased framing--his defense of Carolina's decades of cheating is Not. A. Nit. (And phrasing matters: "Baylor folks have some things to feel bad about" is *not* the same as "Baylor folks should hate their school forever.")

Anyway, the original post literally characterized those who don't just love everything about Bilas' commenting career as "question[ing] Jay's allegiance." It later concludes by saying Jay's commenting is great because he "acts appropriately by showing no bias." That last comment absolutely baits those who do see bias to jump in and disagree. It wasn't necessary in a "Jay gave a great rah-rah speech to the team" post and it ensured the responses that came. The "allegiance" point also isn't really right: lots of people have lots of individual views, but if anything I'd say the majority of folks who are annoyed by Bilas don't see him as some sort of disloyal traitor but rather as a guy who is bending over so far backward to avoid pro-Duke bias that he goes all the way around the bend. Vanishingly few, if any, have ever said on this board that Jay thinking every out of bounds ball goes to Carolina means he is disloyal, versus tryharding.

So yeah, what followed was already baked in there with the first post.
 
AustinDevil said:
Sure, happy to unpack. Though I'll note that you've moved the goalposts versus what the original poster said: "benefit of the doubt" versus "nits to pick" is less egregious but still biased framing--his defense of Carolina's decades of cheating is Not. A. Nit. (And phrasing matters: "Baylor folks have some things to feel bad about" is *not* the same as "Baylor folks should hate their school forever.")

Anyway, the original post literally characterized those who don't just love everything about Bilas' commenting career as "question[ing] Jay's allegiance." It later concludes by saying Jay's commenting is great because he "acts appropriately by showing no bias." That last comment absolutely baits those who do see bias to jump in and disagree. It wasn't necessary in a "Jay gave a great rah-rah speech to the team" post and it ensured the responses that came. The "allegiance" point also isn't really right: lots of people have lots of individual views, but if anything I'd say the majority of folks who are annoyed by Bilas don't see him as some sort of disloyal traitor but rather as a guy who is bending over so far backward to avoid pro-Duke bias that he goes all the way around the bend. Vanishingly few, if any, have ever said on this board that Jay thinking every out of bounds ball goes to Carolina means he is disloyal, versus tryharding.

So yeah, what followed was already baked in there with the first post.
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Impressive! You even found a way to bring back up our last huge argument from when Roach transfered.

I'm done here. Have fun dunking of Bilas.
 
AustinDevil said:
Sure, happy to unpack. Though I'll note that you've moved the goalposts versus what the original poster said: "benefit of the doubt" versus "nits to pick" is less egregious but still biased framing--his defense of Carolina's decades of cheating is Not. A. Nit. (And phrasing matters: "Baylor folks have some things to feel bad about" is *not* the same as "Baylor folks should hate their school forever.")

Anyway, the original post literally characterized those who don't just love everything about Bilas' commenting career as "question[ing] Jay's allegiance." It later concludes by saying Jay's commenting is great because he "acts appropriately by showing no bias." That last comment absolutely baits those who do see bias to jump in and disagree. It wasn't necessary in a "Jay gave a great rah-rah speech to the team" post and it ensured the responses that came. The "allegiance" point also isn't really right: lots of people have lots of individual views, but if anything I'd say the majority of folks who are annoyed by Bilas don't see him as some sort of disloyal traitor but rather as a guy who is bending over so far backward to avoid pro-Duke bias that he goes all the way around the bend. Vanishingly few, if any, have ever said on this board that Jay thinking every out of bounds ball goes to Carolina means he is disloyal, versus tryharding.

So yeah, what followed was already baked in there with the first post.
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“Leading the witness, Your Honor!” So, I think the board consensus is Bilas = good Duke alumn & analyst. GREAT speech. Some fandom skeptical/touchy, when doing his job, which is to try and be unbiased in reporting, understanding that this may be difficult for many of you who get the gag reflex trying to say anything good about UNC (a la Jim Carrey not being able to tell a lie in Liar Liar). Maybe… stop projecting? In all seriousness, Bilas has always come across as an advocate for the college basketball athlete regardless of the name on their jersey and was ahead of his time on NIL and countering bad NCAA policy so he deserves a lot of credit for his inroads there.
 
AZLA said:
“Leading the witness, Your Honor!” So, I think the board consensus is Bilas = good Duke alumn & analyst. GREAT speech. Some fandom skeptical/touchy, when doing his job, which is to try and be unbiased in reporting, understanding that this may be difficult for many of you who get the gag reflex trying to say anything good about UNC (a la Jim Carrey not being able to tell a lie in Liar Liar). Maybe… stop projecting? In all seriousness, Bilas has always come across as an advocate for the college basketball athlete regardless of the name on their jersey and was ahead of his time on NIL and countering bad NCAA policy so he deserves a lot of credit for his inroads there.
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Not sure why every pro-Bilas person in this thread is intent on just stifling disagreement, but how about you start by defending Bilas’ numerous takes downplaying and even misrepresenting the biggest academic fraud scandal in modern NCAA history?
 
It's funny how people lament the loss of moderation in politics, but can't even seem to find moderation in something as easy as Jay Bilas! You can disagree with a few things he says without hating the guy. You can also agree with many of the things he says and does without worshiping at his altar. There actually is a middle ground somewhere in there.
 
Phredd3 said:
It's funny how people lament the loss of moderation in politics, but can't even seem to find moderation in something as easy as Jay Bilas! You can disagree with a few things he says without hating the guy. You can also agree with many of the things he says and does without worshiping at his altar. There actually is a middle ground somewhere in there.
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What? No! Polarization is our new reality! You're either with us or against us.
 
AustinDevil said:
Not sure why every pro-Bilas person in this thread is intent on just stifling disagreement, but how about you start by defending Bilas’ numerous takes downplaying and even misrepresenting the biggest academic fraud scandal in modern NCAA history?
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It is perhaps time to move on.
 
AustinDevil said:
Not sure why every pro-Bilas person in this thread is intent on just stifling disagreement, but how about you start by defending Bilas’ numerous takes downplaying and even misrepresenting the biggest academic fraud scandal in modern NCAA history?
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Oh, I dunno. It wasn't under the jurisdiction of the NCAA, the admin law judge types declared, and Emmert was roundly criticized for bringing an unwinnable case.

The UNC actions were, it seems to me, the worst academic violations in SACSOC history committed by a founding member (IIRC, there were six, including Trinity College). They were punished severely and heads rolled, but it didn't affect athletics.
 
sagegrouse said:
Oh, I dunno. It wasn't under the jurisdiction of the NCAA, the admin law judge types declared, and Emmert was roundly criticized for bringing an unwinnable case.

The UNC actions were, it seems to me, the worst academic violations in SACSOC history committed by a founding member (IIRC, there were six, including Trinity College). They were punished severely and heads rolled, but it didn't affect athletics.
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I'm finding it difficult to understand this position. I would like to say more ... but I am struggling to figure out how to do it without going down a sinkhole. Let's just say, I don't understand how you can say it did not affect athletics when the academic violations were committed SOLELY for athletic program participants.
 
My understanding of the unc debacle was that the NCAA said that academic eligibility for student-athletes were solely determined by the school... which are held to their own academic standards such as SACSOC, and is not with the NCAA. So then the SACSOC determined that some of their academic programs were deficient and thus handed down their suspension. I'm not sure how the athletes were responsible for the school which allowed such deficient academic programs (except for choosing to go to that school), and so I wasn't sure the athletes and their sports programs should suffer. The problem was the school, not the athletic programs. I think I have the right. So I generally gave Bilas a pass on this.

I'm sure there was an argument that the athletic department "forced" the academics programs to allow athletes an "easy pass" to remain eligible. I don't know how to argue that... I don't think that as much as the athletic department knew this was going on, I don't think this was ever fleshed out. completely. So again, I gave Bilas a pass on this.
 
75Crazie said:
I'm finding it difficult to understand this position. I would like to say more ... but I am struggling to figure out how to do it without going down a sinkhole. Let's just say, I don't understand how you can say it did not affect athletics when the academic violations were committed SOLELY for athletic program participants.
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I meant that the penalties from SACSOC did not punish athletics.
 
To be perfectly clear, the early years were all or mostly athletes taking fake classes. But, when the complaint by the NCAA was lodged, too much time had passed (statute of limitations, e.g.), and by then the majority taking fake classes were not athletes. Technicality, which was unfortunate.
 
That was one of the best motivational speeches that I have ever seen. It was broad in scope, while also being pragmatic and personal. Better than many of the graduation speeches that I have attended
 
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