Draft of the best Duke players for the half-decade

JasonEvans

JasonEvans

Host, The Duke Basketball Roundup
On the latest episode of the podcast...

Fast-forward to the 25:20 mark for the start of the conversation

Donald and I conduct a draft of the best players of the first half of the decade of the 2020s (players on teams from 2019-20 to 2023-24 are eligible). We leave it to all of you to tell us which team is best. Here are our teams--

PGSGSFPFC6th Man
JasonTre JonesCassisus StanleyWendell MooreVernon CareyMark WilliamsDerek Lively
DonaldJeremy RoachJared McCainAJ GriffinPaolo BancheroKyle FilipowskiMatthew Hurt

I need to figure out how to post polls... until then, just post your thoughts.
 
So basically defense vs offense? I like the players on Jason’s team more individually but that team may just simply get outscored by all those shooters.
 
AGDukesky said:
So basically defense vs offense? I like the players on Jason’s team more individually but that team may just simply get outscored by all those shooters.
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Guess who has the highest PP40 (points per 40 mins) of all the players listed above... at close to 29 PP40?

And it ain't even close, no one else has even 23 PP40.
 
JasonEvans said:
Guess who has the highest PP40 (points per 40 mins) of all the players listed above... at close to 29 PP40?

And it ain't even close, no one else has even 23 PP40.
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I'd guess Carey, but your team is going to have a heck of a spacing problem. You've got basically no threats from outside the paint. Your strongest perimeter shooter is Wendell Moore, which doesn't give me confidence. Carey isn't going to have a lot of room to operate playing alongside Williams and Lively 100% of the time with no shooters. If you team had just one of Griffin or McCain, I'd feel a lot better about the offensive side of the ball. Your team will be dominant defensively, though.

Sorry, your team will keep the score close defensively, but I have to give the nod to Donald here. I think Paolo and Kyle are occasionally be able to get the ball to Jared or AJ for an open look, and it won't take too many of those to outscore you.
 
For those of us who listen on YouTube:


I listened to this podcast earlier today. Here was the draft order:

1. Tre Jones (Jason)
2. Paolo Banchero (Donald)
3. Kyle Filipowski (Donald)
4. Wendell Moore Jr (Jason)
5. Mark Williams (Jason)
6. Jeremy Roach (Donald)
7. Jared McCain (Donald)
8. Vernon Carey Jr (Jason)
9. Cassius Stanley (Jason)
10. AJ Griffin (Donald)
11. Matthew Hurt (Donald)
12. Dereck Lively II (Jason)

I think Jason is right -- within the criteria given, there's a clear advantage to picking Tre Jones first. I agree with Donald choosing Paolo Banchero second, but I'm not sure what he was going for by picking Kyle Filipowski third (arguably out of position, and ahead of Vernon Carey and Mark Williams). This allowed Jason to take Wendell Moore, another clear pick when compared to other small forwards.

I have no idea how hypothetical teams play against each other, but as a matter of drafting strategy, I think Jason wins this. The only thing Jason could have done better was pick Jared McCain fifth instead of Mark Williams, having already established that Donald saw Filipowski as his center.
 
Jason, he already had his center. You could have grabbed McCain at 5 and picked up Williams later!

Good offense vs good defense. I'll have to go with Paolo's team.
 
SkyBrickey said:
Jason, he already had his center. You could have grabbed McCain at 5 and picked up Williams later!

Good offense vs good defense. I'll have to go with Paolo's team.
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At that point, Jason probably decided he had to get Mark in case I decided to grab him as my 6th man. Which I might have done until I realized he couldn't take Matthew Hurt. I decided to go for size, inside scoring, and the ability to neutralize Jason's team on defense by drawing the big guys out beyond the arc where Hurt is...hurting them. :ROFLMAO:
 
I'm disappointed Donald didn't take Lively at some point to balance out the size disadvantage inside for his team. Paolo and Flip are skilled playmaking bigs, but Mark, D Live, and Vernon are massive human beings.

That said, I don't see Jason's team being much of a threat to hit 3s, and Donald's guys can just pack the paint defensively. All of those guys can hit 3s, so IMO Donald wins.
 
There must be some mistake; I think I'd remember if someone named "Cassius Stanley" had played for Duke in the recent past.
 
Decades from now, I think we're going to look back and realize how much the abrupt ending to the 2019-20 season influenced how we view Vernon Carey and Cassius Stanley historically. Carey had a chance to be remembered as one of the great Duke OADs if he finished the season with a strong March. Stanley was one of the more pleasant instant-impact freshman surprises (he was outside ESPN's Top 25 recruits) we've had (and a guy I think would've stuck around in the NIL era, which is a tantalizing and heartbreaking thought experiment). I think Jason getting those guys so late in the draft is a sleeper reason why he might have the edge here, but I'd have to think about it more before placing my bet.
 
scottdude8 said:
Decades from now, I think we're going to look back and realize how much the abrupt ending to the 2019-20 season influenced how we view Vernon Carey and Cassius Stanley historically. Carey had a chance to be remembered as one of the great Duke OADs if he finished the season with a strong March. Stanley was one of the more pleasant instant-impact freshman surprises (he was outside ESPN's Top 25 recruits) we've had (and a guy I think would've stuck around in the NIL era, which is a tantalizing and heartbreaking thought experiment). I think Jason getting those guys so late in the draft is a sleeper reason why he might have the edge here, but I'd have to think about it more before placing my bet.
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I have said for a long time that Vernon Carey is the most criminally underrated player at Duke in a long, long time.

His stats are absurd: 17.8ppg, 8.8rpg, 1.6bpg in just 24.9 minutes played per game. That gives him the highest points per minute average of anyone not named Zion Williamson to play at Duke since JJ Redick's senior season (and JJ only beats Vern by just a tiny little bit). He was a credible threat from the perimeter hitting 38% of his 3s (he only took 21 threes on the season, but I bet that if he was playing today that number would be in the 40s).

For some reason, his pro career never took off. I don't really get why -- I guess his footspeed didn't work defensively at the next level. If he had properly judged his draft stock and had been in the NIL era, he would have stayed in school for 3 or 4 years and gone down as a Bacot-like ACC legend. Sigh...
 
scottdude8 said:
Decades from now, I think we're going to look back and realize how much the abrupt ending to the 2019-20 season influenced how we view Vernon Carey and Cassius Stanley historically. Carey had a chance to be remembered as one of the great Duke OADs if he finished the season with a strong March. Stanley was one of the more pleasant instant-impact freshman surprises (he was outside ESPN's Top 25 recruits) we've had (and a guy I think would've stuck around in the NIL era, which is a tantalizing and heartbreaking thought experiment). I think Jason getting those guys so late in the draft is a sleeper reason why he might have the edge here, but I'd have to think about it more before placing my bet.
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One of the great Duke might have beens. I'm not sure Cassius sticks around though even with NIL. Didn't he play his entire freshman year at age 20? NBA was pretty ruthless on older prospects back then.
 
I think the two teams are a reasonable list of the 12 best Duke players over the last 5 years. Among the undrafted players, I'd peg the "best available" as:

Jalen Johnson (I know, I know)
Trevor Keels
DJ Steward
Theo John
Dariq Whitehead (drafting on potential!)
Caleb Foster
Tyrese Proctor

The weakest link on the two teams is probably Cassius Stanley (no offense to him). There's a reasonable debate for any of the above listed guards (Keels, Steward, Foster, Proctor) over him, but knee jerk reaction I'm probably taking Cassius. It might depend on how you value the two guys still playing for Duke. I don't think there is a case to bump any of the other 11 guys for someone else from the field.

azzefkram said:
One of the great Duke might have beens. I'm not sure Cassius sticks around though even with NIL. Didn't he play his entire freshman year at age 20? NBA was pretty ruthless on older prospects back then.
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Yep. One reason Cassius was such an impact freshman is that he was old for his class. He was almost a full calendar year older than Zion despite being a freshman a year later. I understand why he left.
 
SkyBrickey said:
Jason, he already had his center. You could have grabbed McCain at 5 and picked up Williams later!
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That was Jason's biggest mistake. There was no reason to take a big as his third pick because Donald had already locked in his 4 and 5. Save those for later and take the best shooter (McCain) to fill your biggest need.

With that said, I like the balance on Jason's team much better so he gets my vote. Donald's team is just a disaster defensively.
 
UrinalCake said:
That was Jason's biggest mistake. There was no reason to take a big as his third pick because Donald had already locked in his 4 and 5. Save those for later and take the best shooter (McCain) to fill your biggest need.

With that said, I like the balance on Jason's team much better so he gets my vote. Donald's team is just a disaster defensively.
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Someone (like me, haha) is in fantasy football draft mode ;)
 
I'd say Jason by a country mile. Donald has 3 of the worst defenders I can remember while Jason has three of the best in recent memory. Offense is closer than many think. I'd say it's a push with Vern/Paolo and Wendell/AJ. Cassius/Jared is interesting in that they are both really good at what the other isn't. In the spots where Donald's team has a clear offensive advantage, Jason's team has the ideal player to counteract them.
 
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