2024 Presidential Election -- new thread for the final week

[jipops]

You may be right. Maybe he does care more about the zeros on his bank account than gaining absolute power as America's Putin (who he very openly admires). A lot will depend on who is advising him too and what their visions are for the country.

Jerome Powell’s tenure ends in 2026. Will the Fed be independent of the executive branch after then? Will it even exist?

 

[richardjackson199]

I am thankful to the mods for allowing us to have this discussion. It has given me a lot of angst but also a lot of joy. It has strengthened some friendships and made me lose a lot of respect for some people who I previously thought were rational.

I am very fearful for the future of this country. I love America more than most of the self-proclaimed patriots. I also spend a lot of money on therapy to help with my anxiety and my obsessive compulsive need for order, rules, and decency. Pardon me for being a nice guy - apparently that is no longer considered "cool" by the angry young men who decided this election. And I have children who have similar challenges. The first Trump administration was extremely difficult for me. Fortunately my kids were young enough at the time to not focus too much. My older child will be eligible to vote in 2028. It is going to be a long four years for him. I want him to be a civically engaged person, but I don't see how this is possible with the daily non-sense coming from Trump.

I still find it impossible to understand how anyone is OK with all of this. Your financial difficulties or one person having an abortion at 40 weeks (OMG - and mods, I am just responding to someone else on this who had the chutzpah to bring it up so not my fault) or one person getting gender surgery in prison is not an excuse to vote for hate, vindictiveness, nastiness, racism, selfishness, and the likely destruction of American democracy. "He doesn't mean what he says" doesn't fly for me. I am unwilling to accept that. And those who lean on religion to defend their opinions are completely misinterpreting what every major religion preaches. It is sad that organized religions that are supposed to support decency and kindness are OK with their worshippers supporting someone who supports none of this.

I don't have the stomach to go to Deeber or wherever else and read them giggling about what a bunch of snowflakes people like me are. Particularly those who really should know better. I'm glad I amuse them.

Back to other topics.

OldPhiKap, or Phredd or many others on Deeber can tell you that no one there has ever called you or anyone else a snowflake. I have never heard that word used on Deeber. No one on Deeber has ever giggled about you. Deeber is a very friendly, welcoming community just like DBR. Most of the posters on Deeber are the same ones on DBR. ie I would guess the majority of posters on Deeber voted for Harris just like they did here. We actually don't talk politics at all on Deeber. We tried it for about a week, but it didn't go well.

I'm also going to defend the church here. My church did not tell us who to vote for. I know my pastor well and he voted for Harris. I understand you're really worried about the next 4 years. I just said a prayer for you, your family, and our country. I don't say that flippantly - I believe that helps. You are a super smart, successful, skilled, passionate, and fundamentally good person. Your kids are so lucky to have you to raise them.

You don't have to take my advice, but I'll tell you what works for me. Control what you can control. Try to let go of what you can't. I love what Harris said in her last speech - if you're worried about darkness, be a bright light for others one day at a time. I'm going to try to do that too. I love @jipops post about how he is doing that. I think it helps. I will try not to assume anything about you except the wonderful attributes that I have seen from your posts on DBR that I mentioned. Try hard to accept that many of the 75 million of us who didn't vote like you did were trying to vote for peace, love, and prosperity too. Maybe we were dead wrong. If so, I'm sorry. I'm wrong all the time. Regardless, I believe trying not to make assumptions, listening, and loving others is the best any of us can do.

 

[richardjackson199]

Thank you for the kind words, Richard. And I hope you enjoy the pie.

I’ll be in your town next week; maybe we could get together for lunch or something. And I really want a slice of that pie; it looks delicious on the website photos!

In any case, I wish all the best to you and yours.

I've had that pie before (I've won it occassionally), and it's even much better than it looks. As @JasonEvans pointed out, when you shove all in with lots of coin flips you win some and you lose some. I would be delighted to share a piece with you.

I can't do lunch. In addition to my own, I'm also covering for another physician's entire case load for 3 months because she is on maternity leave. I'm happy to do it to help her start her family, but I'm pretty overwhelmed at work right now. During lunch I'm just responding to as many patient messages as I can. But as soon as we get that pie, we can tell you when we're going to enjoy it with Mattman (formerly of DBR) and we'd be honored for you to join us for a slice.

DM me your cell phone number before they delete my account and I'll make sure to reach out when we get it. I got your voicemail, but last week was such a blur after not sleeping Tues. night I have no clue if I even still have it.

And I loved your confident bet. I had absolutely no clue when I picked that poll. I saw so many more Harris signs in Winston-Salem than 4 years ago that I honestly thought you were right with the enthusiasm. I thought she would take NC along with Michigan and Wisconsin at minimum.

Cheers!

 

[Jeffrey]

Jerome Powell’s tenure ends in 2026. Will the Fed be independent of the executive branch after then? Will it even exist?

I quickly read End the Fed. It did a solid job finding many faults in the Fed. However, it didn’t offer any alternative solutions. End the Fed’s programs, without any well established alternatives for service, IMO, will End the USA. It’s not realistically possible.

 

[acdevil]

Thanks to the mods and posters for keeping this thread alive. Hopefully we have another one in 4 years.

My daughter is a freshman in high school. My Duke grad wife and I had a conversation on Wednesday that we really need to consider not looking at schools in red states because of the potential healthcare concerns for our daughter. Having to even consider that pisses me off.

You’re late to the game

I’ve had that conversation with my sophomore already as have most of my friends that are girl dads.

And, as sad as that is, it’s infuriating that my Jewish friends with sons are doing the opposite and dissuading their boys from going to certain places (ie Columbia, etc) where anti-semitism has been allowed to fester and grow out of what was originally a good cause.

This is the world we live in.

 

[acdevil]

I quickly read End the Fed. It did a solid job finding many faults in the Fed. However, it didn’t offer any alternative solutions. End the Fed’s programs, without any well established alternatives for service, IMO, will End the USA. It’s not realistically possible.

A bright light - I honestly didn’t think that we’d agree on anything, but I’m with you on this one.

 

[Jeffrey]

I don't have the stomach to go to Deeber or wherever else and read them giggling about what a bunch of snowflakes people like me are. Particularly those who really should know better. I'm glad I amuse them.

I just signed up on Deeber last night and saw absolutely none of that. The second I do, I’m gone!

I prefer sites which are not judgmental and openly invite all opinions and beliefs. My constant complaint was this thread ran off the majority of American voices and that’s not cool! While I don’t agree with them, I do strongly support their constitutional rights.

 

[Jeffrey]

A bright light - I honestly didn’t think that we’d agree on anything, but I’m with you on this one.

I’d guess the exact opposite!

Sometimes you can get shown the light,
in the strangest of places,
if you look at it right!

 

[bundabergdevil]

I just signed up on Deeber last night and saw absolutely none of that. The second I do, I’m gone!

I prefer sites which are not judgmental and openly invite all opinions and beliefs. My constant complaint was this thread ran off the majority of American voices and that’s not cool! While I don’t agree with them, I do strongly support their constitutional rights.

Last I checked , feeber had to shut down a few contentious threads. Grass is always greener or some bs.

 

[richardjackson199]

Last I checked , feeber had to shut down a few contentious threads. Grass is always greener or some bs.

We locked the politics thread.

 

[bundabergdevil]

We locked the politics thread.

Thanks. Just what I was saying, deeply held beliefs are incredibly difficult. Understand why folks wouldn’t like the DBR conversation but any community oriented around a common love (duke) is going to run into tension when it expands beyond that common love.

 

[SkyBrickey]

I just signed up on Deeber last night and saw absolutely none of that. The second I do, I’m gone!

I prefer sites which are not judgmental and openly invite all opinions and beliefs. My constant complaint was this thread ran off the majority of American voices and that’s not cool! While I don’t agree with them, I do strongly support their constitutional rights.

I'm waiting for that one conservative to show up and make an honest case like the following:

I understand that he lies constantly, that he's a convicted felon, that he's openly bragged about sexually assaulting women, that he vilifies minority groups, that he led an insurrection against the results of the last election, that he's publicly sided with Putin over our intelligence agencies, and that lot of the senior people that worked for him have warned that he's a grave threat to our country.

But as much as I don't like these things and don't like the man's character, I don't want the Democrats woke agenda because I feel like it devalues normal white people. I believe Trump will remove a lot of the immigrants in this country which I think will be a good thing. I think Trump's tax plan is better for my family. And I think all this talk about Trump ending democracy is nonsense.

I would respect an opinion or argument like this because it's clear someone is weighing all the facts to reach a conclusion. I might not agree with them, but I would respect their position. The problem is that very, very few Americans have a clear-eyed view of all the facts because they live in their little bubbles where truth and facts are masked and are malleable.

And it's also the reason why so many well-educated and clear-eyed conservatives who do see all the facts have made the decision to leave the Republican Party and are in this purgatory of never-Trumpers.

Doesn't matter now. Trump and friends have all the power. Whatever comes next for our country - the good, the bad, or the ugly - will all fall on them.

 

[-jk]

Guys, please take the deeber discussion to deeber.

-jk

 

[Jeffrey]

I'm waiting for that one conservative to show up and make an honest case like the following:

I understand that he lies constantly, that he's a convicted felon, that he's openly bragged about sexually assaulting women, that he vilifies minority groups, that he led an insurrection against the results of the last election, that he's publicly sided with Putin over our intelligence agencies, and that lot of the senior people that worked for him have warned that he's a grave threat to our country.

But as much as I don't like these things and don't like the man's character, I don't want the Democrats woke agenda because I feel like it devalues normal white people. I believe Trump will remove a lot of the immigrants in this country which I think will be a good thing. I think Trump's tax plan is better for my family. And I think all this talk about Trump ending democracy is nonsense.

I would respect an opinion or argument like this because it's clear someone is weighing all the facts to reach a conclusion. I might not agree with them, but I would respect their position.

So, you would “respect an opinion or argument” that’s worded exactly the way you desire?

 

[FosterCoachK82]

I'm waiting for that one conservative to show up and make an honest case like the following:

I understand that he lies constantly, that he's a convicted felon, that he's openly bragged about sexually assaulting women, that he vilifies minority groups, that he led an insurrection against the results of the last election, that he's publicly sided with Putin over our intelligence agencies, and that lot of the senior people that worked for him have warned that he's a grave threat to our country.

But as much as I don't like these things and don't like the man's character, I don't want the Democrats woke agenda because I feel like it devalues normal white people. I believe Trump will remove a lot of the immigrants in this country which I think will be a good thing. I think Trump's tax plan is better for my family. And I think all this talk about Trump ending democracy is nonsense.

I would respect an opinion or argument like this because it's clear someone is weighing all the facts to reach a conclusion. I might not agree with them, but I would respect their position. The problem is that very, very few Americans have a clear-eyed view of all the facts because they live in their little bubbles where truth and facts are masked and are malleable.

And it's also the reason why so many well-educated and clear-eyed conservatives who do see all the facts have made the decision to leave the Republican Party and are in this purgatory of never-Trumpers.

Doesn't matter now. Trump and friends have all the power. Whatever comes next for our country - the good, the bad, or the ugly - will all fall on them.

To make that argument they would have to follow politics. I don’t think most people do. They are ignorant of the issues you raise. Maybe they have heard of them but they haven’t formed an opinion because they don’t take the time to learn the truth. I’m a bit of a political junkie, as I know you are too. I think there is a good case to be made that being a political junkie is not healthy. Politics is toxic. It is the worst of human discourse. I know some say that everything is politics and I am sure there is some truth to that. But I believe that what we let enter into our consciousness is who we are. I worry about letting too much of this into mine. There is so much more in the world. I am trying to figure out how I can let go of the politics but also still be involved in the world in a useful way. Please don’t take this as a criticism, Sky, your posts have been so important and I feel like we have similar world views. This thing about how to engage with politics is something I am struggling with.

 

[PackMan97]

I'm waiting for that one conservative to show up and make an honest case like the following:

Contrary opinions on this thread are treated with hostility. Y'all don't want to hear it, but most folks that aren't part of the echo chamber just quit trying.

I don't know what the next four years will bring, but I've been thinking the end of America is just around the corner ever since (checks calendar) 1992 or thereabout. Maybe it's here, maybe it's not. What I do know is the people that most impact how my family does are myself, my wife and my kids. We will focus on doing our best most days and reserve the other days for when we kick four FGs in the red zone.

 

[CDu]

Thanks. Just what I was saying, deeply held beliefs are incredibly difficult. Understand why folks wouldn’t like the DBR conversation but any community oriented around a common love (duke) is going to run into tension when it expands beyond that common love.

Heck, there is often tension even on the MBB discussion.

We are a politically divided country, with deep-held beliefs. And unfortunately media proliferation has opened the door for disinformation to make things worse. I don’t know how we will avoid disaster moving forward, or if we even can.

My closing thoughts on the thread are great concern. One of the greatest dangers with a non-politician, cult of personality president is the threat that our institutions fail to hold. I fear we will need to be very vigilant these next 2-4 years. I hope I am wrong and that Trump doesn’t do some of the things he has said he is going to do, or that Project 2025 outlines. But that remains to be seen. Hopefully we all make it through ok.

Thanks to all who participated in mostly civil discussion of a contentious subject, and to the mods for allowing it and guiding us through it. I am sorry RichardJackson will be leaving, but if it is best for your well-being I wish you the best.

Love to all, and here’s hoping for the best!

 

[SouthernDukie]

Gonna make this my last post. I've been plugging Prof Scott Galloway when it comes to one of the big problems the Dems ran into this election cycle. If I could, I'd make every Democrat watch this 10 minute segment from earlier today:

Oh, and he's NOT a Republican, so don't shut him off if you think that's why he's saying what he's saying.

 

[SkyBrickey]

So, you would “respect an opinion or argument” that’s worded exactly the way you desire?

I'd respect anyone who makes the case for Trump who has all the facts and has thought it through.

I have a friend who voted for Trump who did not know what Kelly and Milley have said about him. Friend is very smart. But he doesn't follow politics much and when he watches TV it's Fox News. Kelly and Milley's views on Trump didn't get much play there.

In the world that we lived in 20-30 years ago, a former Chief of staff and chairman of the joint chiefs saying those things about their former boss would have been the biggest story of an election.

 

[Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15]

Contrary opinions on this thread are treated with hostility. Y'all don't want to hear it, but most folks that aren't part of the echo chamber just quit trying.

I don't know what the next four years will bring, but I've been thinking the end of America is just around the corner ever since (checks calendar) 1992 or thereabout. Maybe it's here, maybe it's not. What I do know is the people that most impact how my family does are myself, my wife and my kids. We will focus on doing our best most days and reserve the other days for when we kick four FGs in the red zone.

Again, some of us are worried about people beyond the four walls of our own home and vote accordingly.