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  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by rsvman View Post
    Coincidentally, he is also first in 'most passes thrown to 60-year-old women seated in the second row.'
    Freshman year Bobby Hurley says hi.
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  2. #22
    Here's another early mock draft from SI's Jeremy Woo. Woo is one of the better NBA Draft writers, in my view, and not just because he has Paolo Banchero at #1.

    Other players of note:

    #9 AJ Griffin
    #30 Mark Williams

    https://www.si.com/nba/2021/09/02/20...arly-big-board

  3. #23
    scottdude8's Avatar
    scottdude8 is offline Moderator, Contributor, Zoubek disciple, and resident Wolverine
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    Quote Originally Posted by DavidBenAkiva View Post
    Here's another early mock draft from SI's Jeremy Woo. Woo is one of the better NBA Draft writers, in my view, and not just because he has Paolo Banchero at #1.

    Other players of note:

    #9 AJ Griffin
    #30 Mark Williams

    https://www.si.com/nba/2021/09/02/20...arly-big-board
    In a world where we return a majority of our backcourt contributors along with this incoming class, especially if it adds Lively, that could be an almost ideal mix of old and young that many here have been clamoring for during the OAD era.

    Lots will change over the course of the season on these big boards, and the early entry process next season will be more unpredictable thanks to the new NIL landscape. But there's plenty of reason for optimism about Coach Scheyer's first season.
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  4. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by scottdude8 View Post
    In a world where we return a majority of our backcourt contributors along with this incoming class, especially if it adds Lively, that could be an almost ideal mix of old and young that many here have been clamoring for during the OAD era.

    Lots will change over the course of the season on these big boards, and the early entry process next season will be more unpredictable thanks to the new NIL landscape. But there's plenty of reason for optimism about Coach Scheyer's first season.
    If HCIW Scheyer can hold onto Roach, Keels, Blakes, and one or both of Moore and Baker, that would be a pretty incredible amount of experience for Duke to pair with Whitehead and Schutt (and maybe Starling?) in the backcourt next season. Even if you have just Roach, Keels, and Blakes, that's still a good amount of experience for some of the most important positions. Given how many players have gone pro or transfers, it's not that likely. But I can dream...

  5. #25

    HoopsHype Aggregate Draft 1.0

    One of my favorite sources of NBA Mock Draft content is the HoopsHype aggregate draft versions (1.0, 2.0, etc.). They typically update these a half dozen times throughout the college basketball season and include mocks from the most notable sources, including ESPN, NBADraft.net, and The Athletic. The HoopsHype people put out their first mock draft over the weekend.

    https://hoopshype.com/lists/2022-nba...aolo-banchero/

    1. Paolo Banchero - He's #1 or #2 in all the polls, splitting some with Chet Holmgren. Chet is #3 in Sam Vecenie's Big Board for The Athletic, which proved to be the difference this early.
    5. AJ Griffin - Griffin is the first player with a pretty wide margin of rankings, appearing as high as #3 and as low as #20.
    22. Mark Williams - Big Mark appears as high as 11 and as low as 41 (some mocks only included 1st rounds and left him out entirely).

    After appearing in a couple of mock drafts this time last year, Wendell Moore is absent this time around. I think there's a world in which Moore gets back onto draft boards this season. It starts with his jumper. If he ever translates that smooth free throw stroke to consistently hitting catch-and-shoot 3's while displaying crafty moves around the rim, then the combination of size and length for his position could be intriguing as a potential second rounder or maybe even late 1st round draft pick. He would have to be leading scorer in several games this winter and consistently hitting shots to do that. I don't think it would be crazy to see slight improvements across the board and then the occasional big game. Unlikely, but not out of the question is how I put it. Anyway, just something to track throughout the season.

    Also of note, the HoopsHype people list Trevor Keels as a potential one-and-done even though he also doesn't appear in the top 100 at this point in time.

  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by DavidBenAkiva View Post
    Also of note, the HoopsHype people list Trevor Keels as a potential one-and-done even though he also doesn't appear in the top 100 at this point in time.
    Look, obviously kids ca do what they want and I get that the lure of pro money is strong, but seeing a kid like DJ struggle in Summer League and not even seeming like a likely 2-way contract kid is really painful. I don't know who is advising these kids but far too many of them are making mistakes for my taste. If Trevor is not a certain draft pick then coming out would be quite foolish, IMO.
    Why are you wasting time here when you could be wasting it by listening to the latest episode of the DBR Podcast?

  7. #27
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    scottdude8 is offline Moderator, Contributor, Zoubek disciple, and resident Wolverine
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    Quote Originally Posted by JasonEvans View Post
    Look, obviously kids ca do what they want and I get that the lure of pro money is strong, but seeing a kid like DJ struggle in Summer League and not even seeming like a likely 2-way contract kid is really painful. I don't know who is advising these kids but far too many of them are making mistakes for my taste. If Trevor is not a certain draft pick then coming out would be quite foolish, IMO.
    And, you would have to think NIL would change the decision making process for someone in this type of situation. I still wouldn't be surprised if, in an alternative universe where NIL was announced before draft 2021 draft decisions, DJ is still in a Duke uniform this fall. As someone who was gregarious and seemingly adept on social media, he'd be a prime target for NIL endorsements, IMHO, and could certainly make money approaching what he would as a G-Leaguer as a star at Duke. If Keels finds himself in a similar situation as to his draft status next year, the recruiting pitch of "you'll be the star of the team next year and be in line for major NIL money" could be the difference in luring him back to campus.
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  8. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by JasonEvans View Post
    Look, obviously kids ca do what they want and I get that the lure of pro money is strong, but seeing a kid like DJ struggle in Summer League and not even seeming like a likely 2-way contract kid is really painful. I don't know who is advising these kids but far too many of them are making mistakes for my taste. If Trevor is not a certain draft pick then coming out would be quite foolish, IMO.
    I'm not going to disagree with you on that, but they are different players in different situations. DJ is an undersized scoring guard that didn't really demonstrate that he could be a primary scorer. Nor did he demonstrate that he could be a primary ballhandler. If he couldn't do either at a high level in college, the likelihood that he can in the NBA is slim. On the other hand, he's really young. Some players take a few years to develop. I wish he had stuck around to develop at Duke. Oh well.

    Trevor has ideal size for the SG position in college and the NBA. If you see him in practice videos, he's nearly as big and tall as Wendell Moore. From what I've seen, Keels looks a step too slow to be a true NBA Draft pick. We'll see if his skillset and defensive abilities can compensate for the lack of high-end athleticism. I think he has the chance to be an NBA player one day. It just might take a couple of years, like Luke Kennard or Grayson Allen.

  9. #29
    Jonathan Wasserman over at Bleacher Report has a Top 5 players at every position preview. I like this format as it gives you a sense of the other players in competition for the NBA draft. There are a few listings here that stick out to me, such as Nolan Hickman at #2 among lead ball handlers. First off, he's going to get like the 3rd most touches on the team as lead ball handler behind Andrew Nembhard and Hunter Sallis. Saying that he's the 2nd best prospect at his position in all of college basketball seems pretty wild to me. Also, at 6'2" and 185, he's not particularly big for his position, either. A very optimistic ranking in my view.

    Wasserman has AJ Griffin listed #1 among the category of "interchangeable forwards" (Caleb Houstan is #1 at "traditional small forwards" while Patrick Baldwin, Jr., is #2 in the interchangeable forward category, if that sheds any light on the categorization). Here's the brief scouting report:

    A knee injury and the pandemic have kept Griffin from playing much this past year, but his physical tools and skill set have always screamed NBA potential. The 6'6", 220-pound combo forward pops off the screen/floor with his strong frame, shot-making, defensive playmaking and flashes of self-creation. Consistency will be the key to his draft stock at Duke, but the eye test sees a potential top-five talent.
    Among Hybrid Bigs, Paolo Banchero edges out Chet Holmgren for the top spot and has this write-up:

    Banchero's game has evolved over the past year, with the 6'10" power forward now a threat to initiate fast breaks, create off the dribble and separate into step-back and fallaway jumpers. We're still waiting to see how far along his three-point shooting has come, but for an athletic big with his physical tools, Banchero's presence around the basket and expanding scoring versatility scream All-Star potential. Looking comfortable from three could give him an edge over Holmgren as the nation's top prospect.
    Meanwhile, Mark Williams checked in at #3 in the "traditional bigs" behind Memphis freshman Jalen Duren and Congolese 7-footer (playing in Spain this year) Yannick Nzosa. Williams appears two spots ahead of Walker Kessler, in case you were wondering.

    Williams' physical tools (7'0" size, 7'5" wingspan) for finishing (66.4 pct. FG) and shot-blocking (9.6 BLK pct.) are the draw for NBA teams. He's limited offensively and away from the basket, but averaging 16.7 points over Duke's final six games helped create breakout expectations for 2021-22.
    For Williams, I wonder if added lower-body strength this offseason will help him unlock a little more offensive skills. The other exciting thing reading this is seeing how high people are outside of the program on Duke's frontcourt. It has as much potential as any in the country.

  10. #30
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    ^ do we get to keep the extra two inches he gives to Griffin, who appears at 6-6 on the roster?

  11. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by budwom View Post
    ^ do we get to keep the extra two inches he gives to Griffin, who appears at 6-6 on the roster?
    I don't see him listed as 6'8" in the article?

  12. #32
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    Introducing, Your Orlando Pacers (LOL)

    According to the front page, one mock draft has Paolo Banchero going #3 to . . . . . <wait for it> the "Orlando Pacers."

    Will this guy be giving out the hat on stage?

    586850084.jpg.0.jpg
    "Amazing what a minute can do."

  13. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tripping William View Post
    According to the front page, one mock draft has Paolo Banchero going #3 to . . . . . <wait for it> the "Orlando Pacers."

    Will this guy be giving out the hat on stage?

    586850084.jpg.0.jpg
    I've had wibbly wobbly timey wimey stuff explained to me, but not the spacey wacey part.

    This seems to fit there.

  14. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by DavidBenAkiva View Post
    Jonathan Wasserman over at Bleacher Report has a Top 5 players at every position preview. I like this format as it gives you a sense of the other players in competition for the NBA draft. There are a few listings here that stick out to me, such as Nolan Hickman at #2 among lead ball handlers. First off, he's going to get like the 3rd most touches on the team as lead ball handler behind Andrew Nembhard and Hunter Sallis. Saying that he's the 2nd best prospect at his position in all of college basketball seems pretty wild to me. Also, at 6'2" and 185, he's not particularly big for his position, either. A very optimistic ranking in my view.

    Wasserman has AJ Griffin listed #1 among the category of "interchangeable forwards" (Caleb Houstan is #1 at "traditional small forwards" while Patrick Baldwin, Jr., is #2 in the interchangeable forward category, if that sheds any light on the categorization). Here's the brief scouting report:

    Among Hybrid Bigs, Paolo Banchero edges out Chet Holmgren for the top spot and has this write-up:

    Meanwhile, Mark Williams checked in at #3 in the "traditional bigs" behind Memphis freshman Jalen Duren and Congolese 7-footer (playing in Spain this year) Yannick Nzosa. Williams appears two spots ahead of Walker Kessler, in case you were wondering.

    For Williams, I wonder if added lower-body strength this offseason will help him unlock a little more offensive skills. The other exciting thing reading this is seeing how high people are outside of the program on Duke's frontcourt. It has as much potential as any in the country.
    The progress of Griffin is going to be an interesting follow this year. On the one hand, he has a very nice international play pedigree and is fairly well thought of in draftnik circles (generally considered a lottery pick). On the other, his recruiting ranks and preseason buzz have lagged. That dichotomy will be interesting to see play out. My guess is he struggles with consistency early in the season. The hope would be that in the second half of the year things click for him. If they do, his size and athleticism offer truly game-changing potential. If things don't click, well, he is probably something like a repeat of Wendell Moore's freshman year: flashes of talent but an overall blah season.

    Everyone who has seen Williams practice/play in person has had really good reviews so far. I'm interested to see what he looks like in real game situations. I do like that we appear to have more guys who can draw gravity away from him, and more willing passers as well. That should lead to more easy lobs and mopup buckets. I don't know what to expect from his offensive game, but I also don't think we'll emphasize dumping it down to the low blocks to him either so it may not matter. Ultimately, the big thing I want to see is him at least repeating his second half of last year but with a 25-30mpg role instead of a 20-25 mpg role. If he can do at least that, I like our chances. If he is substantially better than he was last year, look out.

  15. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by DavidBenAkiva View Post
    The day after the 2021 NBA Draft is the first official day of the 2022 NBA Draft speculation. It's like waking up to a big mess in your kitchen after having guests over the night before.

    Sam Vecenie of The Athletic posted his way-too-early 2022 NBA Mock Draft this morning and it includes a number of items relevant to Duke fans.

    A few news and notes:
    - Vecenie starts by saying he likes Paolo Banchero and Chet Holmgren a lot, but he would put them below the top 4 taken in the 2021 NBA Draft. That seems reasonable to me given that we haven't seen either play college ball yet. There's still a lot of time to reevaluate them and the entire class. It also is an indication that the draft class for 2022 is not as well-regarded as the 2021 crop.
    - Paolo Banchero is #1 with Vecenie praising his basketball IQ, his perimeter skills and ability to take players off the dribble, and his improved jumper. He does have a slight concern about Banchero's lateral quickness, but obviously thinks very highly of the Duke freshman.
    - AJ Griffin is #10 and Vecenie notes that he is a tough evaluation at the moment. Griffin physically looks the part at 6'6-7" and a 7'+ wingspan with a good-looking jumper and is athletic and nifty around the rim. But he hasn't played organized basketball for most of the pandemic. He could be a top 5 guy or a late 1st rounder depending on how things go for him this year in an organized team setting.
    - Mark Williams is at #38

    The ACC as a whole is under-represented. There are no players from UNC, Virginia, Florida State, Syracuse, Louisville, or any other program besides Duke in the top 50. I am a little surprised that Keve Aluma isn't in the Top 50. Aluma is a pretty good shooter at 6'9" and does a lot of little things well. I suppose that he's older and isn't a great shooter or great at any one thing.

    As far as talent relative to the rest of the conference, Duke is head and shoulders ahead of the pack.
    Sam Vecenie has an updated mock draft with the NBA and college basketball seasons about to commence.

    - Paolo is still #1 and I get the sense the Vecenie is developing a man-crush.
    - AJ Griffin is up to #7 but Vecenie notes that Griffin is a wild card that could be a top-3 caliber draft pick or something very different.
    - Mark Williams is now up to #21 with Vecenie noting that scouts that have watched Williams in practices have come away impressed. He's noted a post-only player, but he's really really good there as a rim protector and finisher. On a personal note, I think it will be interesting to see if Williams gets as many steals this year as blocks. With his length and ability to move his feet, he should be able to get his long arms on passes nearly as often as he deflects shots.

    Trevor Keels and Wendell Moore do not appear in the second round at this point.

  16. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by DavidBenAkiva View Post
    Sam Vecenie has an updated mock draft with the NBA and college basketball seasons about to commence.

    - Paolo is still #1 and I get the sense the Vecenie is developing a man-crush.
    - AJ Griffin is up to #7 but Vecenie notes that Griffin is a wild card that could be a top-3 caliber draft pick or something very different.
    - Mark Williams is now up to #21 with Vecenie noting that scouts that have watched Williams in practices have come away impressed. He's noted a post-only player, but he's really really good there as a rim protector and finisher. On a personal note, I think it will be interesting to see if Williams gets as many steals this year as blocks. With his length and ability to move his feet, he should be able to get his long arms on passes nearly as often as he deflects shots.

    Trevor Keels and Wendell Moore do not appear in the second round at this point.
    This will certainly carry over to other thread topics as the season goes on, but I have to wonder if AJ Griffin can be best used as a super sub for this Duke team?

    With what we are seeing from Trevor Keels especially, a lineup of Williams, Paolo, Moore, Roach, and Keels seems to check all the boxes.

  17. #37
    Quote Originally Posted by roywhite View Post
    This will certainly carry over to other thread topics as the season goes on, but I have to wonder if AJ Griffin can be best used as a super sub for this Duke team?

    With what we are seeing from Trevor Keels especially, a lineup of Williams, Paolo, Moore, Roach, and Keels seems to check all the boxes.
    FSU has had a bench player (Patrick Williams and Scottie Barnes) drafted in the lottery each of the past two years. Perhaps it is Duke's turn?

  18. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by roywhite View Post
    This will certainly carry over to other thread topics as the season goes on, but I have to wonder if AJ Griffin can be best used as a super sub for this Duke team?

    With what we are seeing from Trevor Keels especially, a lineup of Williams, Paolo, Moore, Roach, and Keels seems to check all the boxes.
    Yeah, I'm liking this scenario a lot. I love that as a starting lineup and since Griffin can be used all over the floor we can be super adaptable to whatever the situation is just by selecting who he goes in for.

  19. #39
    scottdude8's Avatar
    scottdude8 is offline Moderator, Contributor, Zoubek disciple, and resident Wolverine
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    Quote Originally Posted by roywhite View Post
    This will certainly carry over to other thread topics as the season goes on, but I have to wonder if AJ Griffin can be best used as a super sub for this Duke team?

    With what we are seeing from Trevor Keels especially, a lineup of Williams, Paolo, Moore, Roach, and Keels seems to check all the boxes.
    I thought that might be a good strategy even before his injury, considering Keels is more of a traditional "2" and also has been very impressive in camp. I also think that the proof-of-principle with a guy like Scottie Barnes filling that role for FSU last year but still getting big minutes and going top 5 in the draft could go a long way in convincing AJ to take that role.

    All that said, I've got a feeling this will sort itself out. If AJ misses time early in the season and we start strong, I would think K would want to keep that momentum going. If we struggle early without AJ, then using his return to spur some change in the starting group would make a ton of sense. We'll see in a few weeks.
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  20. #40
    Quote Originally Posted by DavidBenAkiva View Post
    Jonathan Wasserman over at Bleacher Report has a Top 5 players at every position preview. I like this format as it gives you a sense of the other players in competition for the NBA draft. There are a few listings here that stick out to me, such as Nolan Hickman at #2 among lead ball handlers. First off, he's going to get like the 3rd most touches on the team as lead ball handler behind Andrew Nembhard and Hunter Sallis. Saying that he's the 2nd best prospect at his position in all of college basketball seems pretty wild to me. Also, at 6'2" and 185, he's not particularly big for his position, either. A very optimistic ranking in my view.
    Jonathan Wasserman released his first Mock Draft for Bleacher Nation and, uh, yeah, he's buying Duke's talent this season.

    2. Paolo Banchero

    One of two No. 1 overall favorites with Chet Holmgren, Banchero should have a featured role at Duke to showcase his expanding scoring versatility. His 6'10", 250-pound frame and athletic/physical finishes will help the freshman feel like a safe pick for NBA scouts. But they'll see All-Star upside thanks to his coast-to-coast takes, face-up drives and playmaking, shot-making flashes and defensive movement. Looking competent from three while Holmgren struggles with physicality could ultimately lead to Banchero separating himself at No. 1.
    9. AJ Griffin

    Rising to the top five seems achievable for AJ Griffin, a 6'6", 222-pound wing scorer with three-point range, creation potential and one-on-one shot-making skill. Griffin recently sprained his knee in practice, which could lead to a slower start and questions about his durability after he sat out most of last year with an ankle injury. But at full strength, Griffin immediately jumps out for his physical profile and skill set to face up and attack, finish drives with muscle or touch and comfortably hit jumpers out to the arc. Sequences of him guarding smaller wings or bigs and blocking shots also scream defensive upside. Inconsistency and debatable shot selection could possibly hurt Griffin. But his size, power and scoring versatility could also make scouts see All-Star upside.
    18. Mark Williams

    Williams' finish last season set up breakout expectations that could lead to NBA interest in his paint presence at both ends. His 7'7" wingspan and mobility for finishing and shot-blocking will remain appealing, but flashes of post skill and touch around the key—plus a consistent motor —could significantly elevate Williams' draft stock.
    20. Trevor Keels

    With AJ Griffin already injured, Keels should have a chance to receive more touches and establish his value in practice and early games. NBA teams will see role-player potential tied to the 6'4" guard's shooting and feel for the game.
    https://bleacherreport.com/articles/...or-this-season

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