2020 Presidential Election

[YmoBeThere]

I wonder if there are security cameras that recorded these "reconnaissance tours" and if would-be rioters can be identified from those recordings.

Yes, it is already happening.

[Skydog]

Now that the President has been impeached by the House, I want to add one analysis I read (sorry can't find the ink right now) that crystalized to me the point of Impeachment.

This is a political process and will need 17 senators to vote for it and then only a majority of senators (a given in a 50/50 Senate) to vote to take away Trump's pension, privileges as an Ex-president and the ability to run for office in the future. That of course has been pointed out already.

The key analysis is what happens between now and Jan 20. Trump has less leverage on Republican senators. If Trump wants to pressure a senator with the perceived political power of his base or wants to have a rally where he steps over the line and appears to incite violence...adios to the best retirement package in the world. This is a protection that now exists for the next 7 days (and to the end of the trial) that was just created by Impeachment. In fact, this makes me think the Senate should take as much time as possible to hold the trial. Take care of the new Cabinet, Covid, stimulus checks, vaccines and take half days to hold the trial.

I had the exact same thought earlier. The impending Senate trial will be a big disincentive for him acting out too much over the next 7 days. Unless he's ok with a Senate conviction, which I don't think he is. He's got to be worried about his brand as well as future criminal trials - being impeached and convicted won't be helpful for either.

[bundabergdevil]

Yes, it is already happening.

It is so hard for me to imagine that this happened with the specific foreknowledge that the mob was going to try to take Capitol Hill, kill police officers and, if they had succeeded, the Vice President and Speaker of the House. But if it did, wow, those are some Civil War era machinations.

[sagegrouse]

It is so hard for me to imagine that this happened with the specific foreknowledge that the mob was going to try to take Capitol Hill, kill police officers and, if they had succeeded, the Vice President and Speaker of the House. But if it did, wow, those are some Civil War era machinations.

The "inciter-in-chief" retired to his quarters to watch on TV. Must have known something might happen.

[wavedukefan70s]

Greybeard, is that you??

No but unfortunately i could qualify as a substituteif i dont shave or converse .

[Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15]

Here's an example of illegal voting. Is this what the GOP think happened 11,000 times in Georgia?

https://www.ksat.com/news/local/2021...lated-charges/

[Bluedog]

Well, not to end the fun about voter ID laws, but one thing I find interesting about the impeachment is that from a legal perspective, one could easily argue that soliciting interference in a US election to undermine your opponent from a foreign entity is a far more "direct crime" than his rhetoric which certainly encouraged an insurrection but I would think would be more of an "indirect" act that perhaps doesn't as clearly run afoul of laws. The major difference this time though - the people that vote on it are part of Congress and THEY were the ones in danger. So, this time it's PERSONAL.

Similarly, one could argue his direct phone call to an election official in Georgia to "find votes" abd undermine democracy seems like a more clear violation of law than his Twitter rants. But I could be wrong. (I acknowledge that his phone call to change votes was noted in today's impeachment but wasn't the focus). Of course, loss of life is a bigger event undoubtedly and thus the impact may be larger even if Trump's direct linkage isn't as clear. (Note that I'm not trying to argue that he didn't incite the masses, simply that he wasn't the one who was part of the mob. Conversely, he WAS the person talking to the Ukrainian president and Georgia officials and thus his involvement is more direct).


But I could be wrong...

[CameronBornAndBred]

I had the exact same thought earlier. The impending Senate trial will be a big disincentive for him acting out too much over the next 7 days. Unless he's ok with a Senate conviction, which I don't think he is. He's got to be worried about his brand as well as future criminal trials - being impeached and convicted won't be helpful for either.

Thankfully, his channels to act out in have been greatly diminished. For whatever reason, when given a legit outlet like a press conference, he is always way more subdued.

[sagegrouse]

Well, not to end the fun about voter ID laws, but one thing I find interesting about the impeachment is that from a legal perspective, one could easily argue that soliciting interference in a US election to undermine your opponent from a foreign entity is a far more "direct crime" than his rhetoric which certainly encouraged an insurrection but I would think would be more of an "indirect" act that perhaps doesn't as clearly run afoul of laws. The major difference this time though - the people that vote on it are part of Congress and THEY were the ones in danger. So, this time it's PERSONAL.

Similarly, one could argue his direct phone call to an election official in Georgia to "find votes" abd undermine democracy seems like a more clear violation of law than his Twitter rants. But I could be wrong. (I acknowledge that his phone call to change votes was noted in today's impeachment but wasn't the focus). Of course, loss of life is a bigger event undoubtedly and thus the impact may be larger even if Trump's direct linkage isn't as clear. (Note that I'm not trying to argue that he didn't incite the masses, simply that he wasn't the one who was part of the mob. Conversely, he WAS the person talking to the Ukrainian president and Georgia officials and thus his involvement is more direct).


But I could be wrong...

Wasn't the Georgia call was in the impeachment bill?

[mkirsh]

Thankfully, his channels to act out in have been greatly diminished. For whatever reason, when given a legit outlet like a press conference, he is always way more subdued.

Imagine what the world would have been like if the media had not covered Trump’s tweets for the past 5 years? And treated them as musings to be ignored vs official POTUS proclamations? I would bet the national temperate would be a lot lower but could be wrong.

[OldPhiKap]

From the Inevitable File — Trump to stiff Rudy on his fees:

https://twitter.com/mrwaltershapiro/...971528705?s=21

[Bluedog]

Wasn't the Georgia call was in the impeachment bill?

Yes I did acknowledge that but didn't seem to be the focus with the representative speeches of the ones I watched at least.

[CameronBornAndBred]

From the Inevitable File — Trump to stiff Rudy on his fees:

https://twitter.com/mrwaltershapiro/...971528705?s=21

How much is a pardon worth? Equivalent I'd guess.

[CrazyNotCrazie]

From the Inevitable File — Trump to stiff Rudy on his fees:

https://twitter.com/mrwaltershapiro/...971528705?s=21

If Rudy was dumb enough to do work for Trump without some kind of a retainer, then, well, bless his heart.

The question is whether Rudy squeals. I'm not sure how well his brain is working these days, but he theoretically knows a lot.

[bundabergdevil]

From the Inevitable File — Trump to stiff Rudy on his fees:

https://twitter.com/mrwaltershapiro/...971528705?s=21

I believe Giuliani misspoke. Instead of "trial by combat", he meant to say "I will dance in my monkey suit but get no bananas".

[DukeBlueDevil]

https://www.washingtontimes.com/news...charges-filed/

Not exactly the most impartial of sources, but it does raise an interesting point. Thoughts on Trump potentially fleeing the country post-inauguration?

[MarkD83]

Imagine what the world would have been like if the media had not covered Trump’s tweets for the past 5 years? And treated them as musings to be ignored vs official POTUS proclamations? I would bet the national temperate would be a lot lower but could be wrong.

Bu then we would not have known who he fired and who was in the administration.

[MarkD83]

https://www.washingtontimes.com/news...charges-filed/

Not exactly the most impartial of sources, but it does raise an interesting point. Thoughts on Trump potentially fleeing the country post-inauguration?

That would work just fine...he could not run for office and he would not get all of the privileges of an ex-President.

[CameronBornAndBred]

Imagine what the world would have been like if the media had not covered Trump’s tweets for the past 5 years? And treated them as musings to be ignored vs official POTUS proclamations? I would bet the national temperate would be a lot lower but could be wrong.

I think that they tried, briefly. But Trump quickly blurred the lines between what was simply his musings and what was official, so everything he posted had to be paid attention to, unfortunately. He used it as a matter of convenience and to his benefit.

[rasputin]

Bu then we would not have known who he fired and who was in the administration.

Great people.