Star Wars: Rise of Skywalker (SPOILER THREAD!)

[OldPhiKap]

And when does anyone ever eat dinner?
.

All your questions answered — Some language NSFW though:

https://youtu.be/7p5KpjR93SE

[BD80]

…

Last weekend I also saw a taped performance of Shakespeare's The Winter's Tale with Kenneth Branagh in a theater. It's a wonderful play, one of my favorites, but so full of plot holes, ludicrous co-incidences, and nonsensical behavior that I put its narrative on par with Rise of Skywalker's (but by a far, far better screenwriter, of course, with language that makes Rise of Skywalker seem like a kindergartener's effort, which essentially it is). ... Shakespeare... now that's worth going back to see.

I am reasonably sure that no other forum in this, or any other, galaxy bears a comparison of "The Winter's Tale" and "Rise of Skywalker."


The dialogue of this last trilogy is SO far superior to the dialogue written by Lucas for the first two trilogies. The actors absolutely HATED trying to "act" while spewing the pablum that Lucas forced into their mouths. Harrison Ford in particular has make less than complimentary comments.

That said, RoS dialogue was a few steps below a Branagh interpretation of Shakespeare.

[OldPhiKap]

I am reasonably sure that no other forum in this, or any other, galaxy bears a comparison of "The Winter's Tale" and "Rise of Skywalker."


The dialogue of this last trilogy is SO far superior to the dialogue written by Lucas for the first two trilogies. The actors absolutely HATED trying to "act" while spewing the pablum that Lucas forced into their mouths. Harrison Ford in particular has make less than complimentary comments.

That said, RoS dialogue was a few steps below a Branagh interpretation of Shakespeare.

Which is why the next trilogy should be directed by either the Coen Brothers or Vince Gilligan. Only half-joking about that.

[Stray Gator]

Which is why the next trilogy should be directed by either the Coen Brothers or Vince Gilligan. Only half-joking about that.

Wouldn't it be great to see a version of the Star Wars saga directed by Cecil B. DeMille and narrated by Sir Laurence Olivier? Truly epic.

[BD80]

Wouldn't it be great to see a version of the Star Wars saga directed by Cecil B. DeMille and narrated by Sir Laurence Olivier? Truly epic.

Cecil B. DeMille with the technology to destroy multiple planets simultaneously?


shudder

[BD80]

An alleged peak into the direction the original director of Episode 9 was headed.

https://www.yahoo.com/entertainment/...102353427.html

I like much of the direction of the "alleged" Duel of the Fates, including adding Tor Valum to make Kylo the epitome of evil, and avoiding the Exogel plot line.

Still, I appreciate JJ in place of RJ. We'll never know what Trevorrow would have done - or maybe we can get an animated version of his vision?

[fuse]

Finally saw Rise for the second time.

It would be easy for me to say the first time, I was overcome with emotion.

This go round, I was able to more thoroughly enjoy the movie,
The feelings of poignancy and nostalgia were not nearly as intense, although I definitely had my moments.

Perfect film? No.

Still immensely, immensely entertaining.

[brevity]

I finally got around to seeing Episode IX earlier today. I avoided both DBR threads for the past month because I was trying to stay spoiler-free. That worked fine on DBR, but I still managed to get a little ruined just by the people elsewhere on the Internet who write too-revealing headlines of articles: Leia and Rose are barely in it, Lando has a creepy vibe, there is a same-sex kiss, Palpatine is some kind of grandparent...

So I've read this thread for the first time today, and I cannot understand for the life of me why JasonEvans (or anyone else, but mostly JasonEvans) expected JJ Abrams to be capable of resolving anything to satisfaction. Isn't that the definition of insanity? He's an idea guy: present the mystery box, involve the viewer, offer no answers. Do I really need to pull up the old DBR threads about TV's Lost?

On balance, I liked all three individual movies in the VII-VIII-IX trilogy, but man, they do not go together. Sometime later this year people are going to sit down and watch the trilogy on DVD or Disney+ and discover the same thing. And if the conclusion they draw is that the trilogy mostly exists for Disney to make a cash grab from unsuspecting nostalgic moviegoers, well, I can't disagree. Marvel aside -- for now -- it seems like every big movie they make is mostly about the box office, and not about prestige or awards or continuity or even repeat viewing. I had similar problems with the three (!) live action remakes they released in theaters last year, as well as Toy Story 4. Usually well-made and largely pointless.

I will chime in with others who have called this film overstuffed. When I watched, it was so dense with content that it didn't feel too long. But as I think about it more, every supporting element became a little less important. When thinking about this film for the past two years, I wondered who was left to help the principal young cast finish the story. Leia's use would have to be limited. Luke could appear as a Force ghost, but maybe only in a few scenes. Lando was still an option. But as it turns out, the film kept the principal young cast together for a very long period of time -- Rey does not split off into her own story for a while -- and everyone else was just fan service and window dressing. Luke and Lando showed up but did not push the story forward in any meaningful way. They could have been used better, but they weren't. (The Han cameo did at least serve a purpose, and offered a nice parallel to VII.)

The explanation of Rey's parentage was so simple I wouldn't have come up with it. While it makes sense -- why would anyone know that Palpatine had a son? -- I was hoping for something different. I've mentioned this before, but I thought after Episode VII (and Episode VIII supports this) that Snoke and Rey were clones: him, a rough, early model of Palpatine, powerful but malformed; her, a later model of Luke, in a perfected process with the kinks worked out. What made the theory even more interesting was the potential Force contrast between the naturally born Skywalker (Ben Solo) and the genetically made Skywalker (Rey). Who was more powerful? Who was a better legacy? (It's a theme embedded in the whole saga: what's better, a Stormtrooper army of clones or stolen children trained to adulthood? Why do the Jedi require no attachments when Force babies can be so powerful?) But that's not what happened.

I agree that Abrams does a bad job of explaining Palpatine's presence -- the opening crawl tried to establish a lot more than usual -- but I would take the criticism further: why is he there at all? Rey can be a Palpatine, and that's enough of a reveal without her grandfather sort of being around. (Her use of Force lightning was surprising and effective.) I think Rey and Kylo Ren can confront each other and compromise their allegiances to the Jedi and the Sith without a third party. But whatever. I won't turn down another appearance by Ian McDiarmid, even as the undead Emperor, but I thought that draining the Force out of others should have made him look younger.

I have nothing more structured to say here. Abrams couldn't even commit to a relationship. Was Finn with Rey? Or Poe? Or both? I was pleasantly surprised to see Jodie Comer from Killing Eve pop up as Rey's mother, and the split-second return of Wedge Antilles. I want to see a subtitled/closed captioned version of all the Jedi voices in Rey's head.

[JasonEvans]

I just wanted to chime in to note that while critics and audience scores are a good way to judge a movie, there is one more metric that can tell us something about how successful a film is at connecting to its target audience... boxoffice.

Now, to be clear, I am not saying that boxoffice is the ultimate measure. Roland Emmerich's Midway is going to make more money at the boxoffice than Parasite and Jojo Rabbit combined, but no one on the planet (not even Emmerich, I suspect) would say that Midway is even half the film that those two wonderful works of art are.

But, when we are talking about films that have a similar base audience, films that get a similar marketing campaign and have similar global awareness, it can been illuminating to see how people vote when they have to actually fork over cash in their wallet.

So, I think it is worth noting that Rise of Skywalker is going to be the worst performing film of any in the main Star Wars storyline (adjusted for inflation). It is currently at $491 million after making $8 mil over the MLK holiday weekend. It left 1200 theaters over the weekend and while it looks like this film will get to $500 million, it is pretty hard to see it reaching the $532 mil of Rogue One. There is no chance it will come anywhere close to the $620 mil of The Last Jedi. In fact, it would appear that the only Star Wars film it will surpass is Solo: A Star Wars Story. While some of this may be a degree of Star Wars fatigue, it is hard to see this film as anything but a pretty significant box office disappointment.

-Jason "as for Brevity's comments about JJ not being able to bring this home... I did not have confidence in it, but I still really hoped it might happen. Lost was not his fault, he had little to do with anything after season one" Evans

[crimsondevil]

But, when we are talking about films that have a similar base audience, films that get a similar marketing campaign and have similar global awareness, it can been illuminating to see how people vote when they have to actually fork over cash in their wallet.

Bumblebee is by far the best of the Transformers movies, and it had the lowest box office. Never mind that you could make the same argument about Rogue One.

[CameronBornAndBred]

Bumblebee is by far the best of the Transformers movies, and it had the lowest box office. Never mind that you could make the same argument about Rogue One.

Bumblebee is up next on my streaming movie list. It's been there for a while. The only reason that I haven't pulled the trigger is that I'd like to watch it with my gf, but I know she'll be rolling her eyes AND protesting at the thought. (Yes, both rolling/protesting).
But I've heard wonderful comments, and with her being a child therapist, I'm hoping it's a movie she'll enjoy and also be able to relate to with her kids. (Her being a child therapist is why I'm more than understandable on her aversion to many movies; she deals with enough real life violence and horror during her working hours.)

[BD80]

Bumblebee is up next on my streaming movie list. It's been there for a while. The only reason that I haven't pulled the trigger is that I'd like to watch it with my gf, but I know she'll be rolling her eyes AND protesting at the thought. (Yes, both rolling/protesting).
But I've heard wonderful comments, and with her being a child therapist, I'm hoping it's a movie she'll enjoy and also be able to relate to with her kids. (Her being a child therapist is why I'm more than understandable on her aversion to many movies; she deals with enough real life violence and horror during her working hours.)

A gf who is a child therapist. That is a combination that would likely have worked out well for me ...

[Acymetric]

I just wanted to chime in to note that while critics and audience scores are a good way to judge a movie, there is one more metric that can tell us something about how successful a film is at connecting to its target audience... boxoffice.

Now, to be clear, I am not saying that boxoffice is the ultimate measure. Roland Emmerich's Midway is going to make more money at the boxoffice than Parasite and Jojo Rabbit combined, but no one on the planet (not even Emmerich, I suspect) would say that Midway is even half the film that those two wonderful works of art are.

But, when we are talking about films that have a similar base audience, films that get a similar marketing campaign and have similar global awareness, it can been illuminating to see how people vote when they have to actually fork over cash in their wallet.

So, I think it is worth noting that Rise of Skywalker is going to be the worst performing film of any in the main Star Wars storyline (adjusted for inflation). It is currently at $491 million after making $8 mil over the MLK holiday weekend. It left 1200 theaters over the weekend and while it looks like this film will get to $500 million, it is pretty hard to see it reaching the $532 mil of Rogue One. There is no chance it will come anywhere close to the $620 mil of The Last Jedi. In fact, it would appear that the only Star Wars film it will surpass is Solo: A Star Wars Story. While some of this may be a degree of Star Wars fatigue, it is hard to see this film as anything but a pretty significant box office disappointment.

-Jason "as for Brevity's comments about JJ not being able to bring this home... I did not have confidence in it, but I still really hoped it might happen. Lost was not his fault, he had little to do with anything after season one" Evans

Not to re-hash, but how much of that is people who paid to see TLJ and then swore off paying to see Star Wars in theaters?

[brevity]

A gf who is a child therapist. That is a combination that would likely have worked out well for me ...

Her: "You're acting like a child!"
Him: "Quit bringing your work home!"

I've had a couple of days to think about Episode IX more, and I don't feel any better or worse about it. I feel unmotivated to nitpick further, mostly because this trilogy was so mismanaged that I had extremely low expectations for it, and while I'm sure it could have been improved, the experience wasn't awful like I feared. So, relieved that it was fine at some superficial level, glad that it's over.

Star Wars used to be special among franchises because the films were few and far between, and they arrived at a formative age. I'm older now, and the films are more common. I know that I don't have any ownership in Star Wars, and I relate less and less to people who think they do.

[YmoBeThere]

Apparently, stay at home has given some more time to pursue various activities.

All 9 movies played at the same time:

[Acymetric]

Apparently, stay at home has given some more time to pursue various activities.

All 9 movies played at the same time:

This makes May 4th a whole lot easier!

[BD80]

This makes May 4th a whole lot easier!

Seemed Forced to me.