Midterm Elections 2018

[Acymetric]

Broward County recounts its ballots — but turns in the results two minutes late. So the recount doesn’t count.

https://www.cnn.com/2018/11/15/polit...unt/index.html

That is so damn crazy to me. I understand having a deadline (you can't just let people re-count forever) but invalidating it for two minutes? Pure insanity. Not even partisan insanity...just the kind of insanity that comes from large organizations (private or state).

Incidentally, this kind of thing is exactly why I love working at my current small company after 6 years at a large multinational corporation.

[JasonEvans]

That is so damn crazy to me. I understand having a deadline (you can't just let people re-count forever) but invalidating it for two minutes? Pure insanity. Not even partisan insanity...just the kind of insanity that comes from large organizations (private or state).

Incidentally, this kind of thing is exactly why I love working at my current small company after 6 years at a large multinational corporation.

Well, but here is the problem. This is a legal process and you have to have some kind of deadline.

To which some may say, "Ok, fine, but 2 minutes of wiggle room should be allowed."

To which I would reply: "What about 5 minutes? What about 10? What about a half hour? What about 2 hours? What about 16 hours?"

Let's say Broward was allowed to report 2 minutes to late. What if Pinelass then came in 20 minutes too late. And then Seminole came in 4 hours too late.

If there is a legal deadline it must be adhered to. Once you allow the deadline to not be a deadline, it throws the whole process into chaos.

-Jason "if Nelson ends up losing by less than 700 votes, the lost votes from the 2 minute too late Broward recount will become the stuff of legend" Evans

[OldPhiKap]

Well, but here is the problem. This is a legal process and you have to have some kind of deadline.

To which some may say, "Ok, fine, but 2 minutes of wiggle room should be allowed."

To which I would reply: "What about 5 minutes? What about 10? What about a half hour? What about 2 hours? What about 16 hours?"

Let's say Broward was allowed to report 2 minutes to late. What if Pinelass then came in 20 minutes too late. And then Seminole came in 4 hours too late.

If there is a legal deadline it must be adhered to. Once you allow the deadline to not be a deadline, it throws the whole process into chaos.

-Jason "if Nelson ends up losing by less than 700 votes, the lost votes from the 2 minute too late Broward recount will become the stuff of legend" Evans

Yeah, but I cannot see a judge throwing out legally-cast votes because a beaurocrat screwed up.

[Indoor66]

Well, but here is the problem. This is a legal process and you have to have some kind of deadline.

To which some may say, "Ok, fine, but 2 minutes of wiggle room should be allowed."

To which I would reply: "What about 5 minutes? What about 10? What about a half hour? What about 2 hours? What about 16 hours?"

Let's say Broward was allowed to report 2 minutes to late. What if Pinelass then came in 20 minutes too late. And then Seminole came in 4 hours too late.

If there is a legal deadline it must be adhered to. Once you allow the deadline to not be a deadline, it throws the whole process into chaos.

-Jason "if Nelson ends up losing by less than 700 votes, the lost votes from the 2 minute too late Broward recount will become the stuff of legend" Evans

You either follow the law as written or you have no law. It is a simple reality. There is no "wiggle room" in a clearly stated deadline. If you don't like it, go to the Legislature which set the rule. It is not for others to create "wiggle room" on their own. We have the same problem administering other law as well.

[Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15]

I am a stickler for the letter of the law and for timeliness and deadlines. However, when people are disenfranchised due to bureaucratic ineptitude, something has gone horribly wrong, either intentionally, or unintentionally.

[OldPhiKap]

I am a stickler for the letter of the law and for timeliness and deadlines. However, when people are disenfranchised due to bureaucratic ineptitude, something has gone horribly wrong, either intentionally, or unintentionally.

See, that’s the thing.

There are consequences when you miss deadlines. But if the consequences are felt by innocent parties and not you, equity finds a remedy.

If I show up to vote two mi utes after they close the line, I am out of luck. If the counter misses the deadline by two minutes, I cannot imagine the court will discount legally-cast votes because of a government clerk’s dalliance.

[JasonEvans]

See, that’s the thing.

There are consequences when you miss deadlines. But if the consequences are felt by innocent parties and not you, equity finds a remedy.

If I show up to vote two mi utes after they close the line, I am out of luck. If the counter misses the deadline by two minutes, I cannot imagine the court will discount legally-cast votes because of a government clerk’s dalliance.

I am a stickler for the letter of the law and for timeliness and deadlines. However, when people are disenfranchised due to bureaucratic ineptitude, something has gone horribly wrong, either intentionally, or unintentionally.

I completely agree and I would expect Nelson or someone to file suit to get those votes counted. I would hope the judge would count them.

But, from the standpoint of the Sec of State's office, once the report was late, it had to be rejected. The SoS deadline must be an absolute (until a court rules otherwise).

[OldPhiKap]

I completely agree and I would expect Nelson or someone to file suit to get those votes counted. I would hope the judge would count them.

But, from the standpoint of the Sec of State's office, once the report was late, it had to be rejected. The SoS deadline must be an absolute (until a court rules otherwise).

I agree with both of these statements.

[budwom]

worth mentioning for a couple of reasons: as the country took a blueward turn this time around, the lone Republican from New England was purged, Peloquin of Maine...noteworthy also
because he got more votes than his Demo foe, but he did not get 50% of the vote, so ranked voting kicked in, and the Demo won...(as many had suspected would happen).

[Mike Corey]

See, that’s the thing.

There are consequences when you miss deadlines. But if the consequences are felt by innocent parties and not you, equity finds a remedy.

If I show up to vote two mi utes after they close the line, I am out of luck. If the counter misses the deadline by two minutes, I cannot imagine the court will discount legally-cast votes because of a government clerk’s dalliance.

Yup.

All the voters did the right stuff.

The recounted votes missing a two-minute deadline isn't their fault.

Votes should be counted.

I'm generally on board with "the rules are the rules for a reason." But the rules were followed here by the people. The government missing a government deadline by a nominal amount of time should not result in the people's good behavior being tossed out.

[El_Diablo]

On the Senate side at least, the overall machine recount in Florida is within the margin for a hand recount, so it will proceed to a hand recount either way, and the numbers that come out of that will prevail at the end of the day. So Broward's missed deadline for turning in the machine recount numbers is kind of irrelevant. Same with Palm Beach County, which never even finished the machine recount (they had to run the ballots separately for each race because the counting software is so outdated, and the machines broke down so they never even finished recounting the one race they started with).

It kind of puts the nail in the coffin for the governor's race though, as that one is outside the hand recount threshold.

[BandAlum83]

This feels like a horror movie. Or maybe it was Jaws the book when the first woman was eaten:

"Oh God! Just let it be over!"

[CrazyNotCrazie]

Here is a helpful summary of outstanding races, though as others have noted, I think the Florida governor's race is pretty much done. Excluding that one, there are six House races, two senate and one governor.

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/...led-races.html

[BandAlum83]

In the meantime, did the rapture happen and the only ones taken were "The Caravan" migrants?

I haven't seen hide nor hair since election day.

Maybe it's like the new TV show Manifest. They will reappear out of nowhere in 2 years.

[Bostondevil]

On the Senate side at least, the overall machine recount in Florida is within the margin for a hand recount, so it will proceed to a hand recount either way, and the numbers that come out of that will prevail at the end of the day. So Broward's missed deadline for turning in the machine recount numbers is kind of irrelevant. Same with Palm Beach County, which never even finished the machine recount (they had to run the ballots separately for each race because the counting software is so outdated, and the machines broke down so they never even finished recounting the one race they started with).

It kind of puts the nail in the coffin for the governor's race though, as that one is outside the hand recount threshold.

I wish there were a bipartisan effort to invest in election infrastructure. It's needed everywhere, not just Florida.

[OldPhiKap]

I wish there were a bipartisan effort to invest in election infrastructure. It's needed everywhere, not just Florida.

Yup. Both parties should see the shambolic mess we have right now, and both may arguably be stung by it.

("Shambolic" being stolen from Jeremy Corbyn's attack on Brexit during Prime Minister's Questions Wednesday -- great word)

[CameronBornAndBred]

In the meantime, did the rapture happen and the only ones taken were "The Caravan" migrants?

I haven't seen hide nor hair since election day.

Maybe it's like the new TV show Manifest. They will reappear out of nowhere in 2 years.

My guess is that they will be in the limelight again very soon. This will be interesting to watch, although I don't see how there will be a good outcome for anyone involved. People from all sides will likely be pegged as "the bad guys". For right now, the burden appears to be on Mexico.

Hundreds of people who arrived in Tijuana with the first wave of the migrant caravan planned to spend Wednesday night in a makeshift camp by the Pacific Ocean, steps from the tall border fence that separates Mexico and the United States. But those plans shifted in the evening, after local and state officials opened a temporary shelter – and about 300 local residents gathered by the encampment to demand the migrants leave the upscale Playas de Tijuana neighborhood and go to the facility.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world...y3D?li=BBnb7Kz

[OldPhiKap]

In Georgia, Abrams preparing for possible court challenge to the election:

https://www.apnews.com/7985be43fa4c4422bfece25cb0204307

Take that, Florida. We'll see your recount, and raise you a do-over.

(it's a joke, not a comment on the merits)

[CrazyNotCrazie]

In Georgia, Abrams preparing for possible court challenge to the election:

https://www.apnews.com/7985be43fa4c4422bfece25cb0204307

Take that, Florida. We'll see your recount, and raise you a do-over.

(it's a joke, not a comment on the merits)

I recently was introduced to a neighbor who is a prominent constitutional law professor, specializing in election laws (ironically, it was the night before the election). I do not anticipate seeing him around very much for the next few months - I expect him to be spending a lot of time in the south.

[mattman91]

Make it end already!