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  1. #21
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Wilmington
    Quote Originally Posted by chrishoke View Post
    Need a photo of him showing his famous over the head shooting motion that all us kids at the time tried to emulate
    LOL, He ruined more 4th graders shooting motion for years , trying to emulate it lol..

  2. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by Rogue View Post
    LOL, He ruined more 4th graders shooting motion for years , trying to emulate it lol..
    Pretty unique. Don't remember anyone else shooting like Bob. But, hey it worked, right?

  3. #23

    1966 Bob Verga final four game

    OK, so now that it's championship game time, time to think back again on what would have happened in '66
    if Verga hadn't been sick and Duke had played Texas Western in the championship game. Check it out in
    my book, "The Bob Verga Shift", on my web site. https://michaelblayden.com/ Yeah, I know I mentioned this
    a few weeks ago, but now that it's the finals, it's worth one more look.

  4. #24
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Durham, within a couple of miles of Cameron
    Quote Originally Posted by Verga4ever View Post
    OK, so now that it's championship game time, time to think back again on what would have happened in '66
    if Verga hadn't been sick and Duke had played Texas Western in the championship game. Check it out in
    my book, "The Bob Verga Shift", on my web site. https://michaelblayden.com/ Yeah, I know I mentioned this
    a few weeks ago, but now that it's the finals, it's worth one more look.
    Great to see this topic, and plan to read this book. Took me a while, but I uncovered a thread that got comments from the great Al Featherston (Olympic Fan). I can't find in the archives his full review of 'Glory Road', but halfway down the second page of this thread is a good distillation from Big Al..

    https://forums.dukebasketballreport...ht=Featherston

    Mods, if someone can find Al's formal review of 'Glory Road'. I'd be grateful. I think it was a front page article, and the TV movie came out in 2006, I think.

  5. #25
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Washington, DC area
    Quote Originally Posted by JStuart View Post
    Great to see this topic, and plan to read this book. Took me a while, but I uncovered a thread that got comments from the great Al Featherston (Olympic Fan). I can't find in the archives his full review of 'Glory Road', but halfway down the second page of this thread is a good distillation from Big Al..

    https://forums.dukebasketballreport...ht=Featherston

    Mods, if someone can find Al's formal review of 'Glory Road'. I'd be grateful. I think it was a front page article, and the TV movie came out in 2006, I think.
    This one?

    Quote Originally Posted by Olympic Fan View Post
    Regarding Glory Road ... I went in wanting to love that story, but I hated the way they twisted basketball history. Just some of the key points:

    (1) That was not Haskins first Texas Western team -- it was his fifth. And he had made a run to the NCAA Elite Eight in 1964 with Jim "Bad News" Barnes

    (2) Haskins did not integrate the Texas Western program. The school used black players throughout the 1950s. He inherited three black scholarship players in the summer of 1961. One of them was Nolan Richardson, who later cached Arkansas to the 1994 national title (barely edging Duke).

    (3) Haskins said he never met any resistance from the school or the El Paso community when it came to playing black players.

    (4) As Wsb 3 said, having black dominated teams in the Final Four was no shock. CCNY started three blacks in the 1950 title game. San Francisco started three blacks in the 1955 title game. Cincinnati started three blacks in both the 1962 and 1963 title games ... and Loyola, the 1963 champion, started four blacks. That meant that seven of the 10 starters in the 1963 title game were black. And six of the 10 starters in the 1966 NBA All-Star game were black, including Russell, Chamberlain, Baylor and Oscar. Contrary to the movie, NOBODY was questioning the ability of blacks to play basketball in 1966.

    (5) The worst thing the movie did was misrepresent the struggle between Haskins and his team as to style of play. In the film, Haskins wanted to hold them back and make them play a slow, structured game. It was only when he turned them loose and let them play street ball that the team prospered. That's the EXACT opposite of what happened. They did struggle with style of play, but it was only when they accepted Haskins slow, defensive-oriented style (learned in college from Hank Iba) that the team took off. That, more than the five blacks starting, was the import of the '66 title game. It shattered the prejudice that blacks might be great athletes and great basketball players, but that thy weren't smart enough to win without some white leadership on the flour. What we saw in 1966 was an all-white Kentucky team that was wild and undisciplined and an all-black Texas Western team that played under control and with real smarts.

    Would Duke have fared better than Kentucky? Fair question and one we can never answer. But let me suggest a couple of things. Having Mike Lewis in the middle gave Duke something that Kentucky (remember, these were Rupp's Runts) didn't have -- a big strong center to battle David Lattin in the middle. Also, Duke might have handled Texas Western's pressure better -- this was a great ballhandling Duke team that had demolished UCLA's famed zone press in back to back games in December. Marin was superb as a press buster.

    While I don't know if Duke would have won or not, I do think playing Duke might have changed the historic story. Forward Harry Flournoy was hurt and only made a token start, replaced by Nevil Shed. But Flournoy was the team's defensive stopper at forward, a role that Shed couldn't play. As it was, Jack Marin destroyed Kentucky and would have presented major problems for the Miners' on defense. Haskins would have had to do what he did in the semifinal game, when Utah's Jerry Chambers was killing them -- he would have had to use Jerry Armstrong, a white forward who was the team's second best defender. Armstrong didn't play against Kentucky, which kept Texas Western all-black, but he almost certainly would have played a huge role against Duke.

    PS In my earlier post, I did mistype 1965 for 1964. 1965 was a great team -- one that Bubas thought could have been a Final Four team -- but losing to NC State in the ACC Tournament cost them a chance to compete. It's worth noting that '65 was part of a streak of six straight top 10 AP finishes for Duke in that era -- 10 in 1961, 10 in 1962, 2 in 1963, 3 in 1964, 10 in 1965 and 2 in 1966. Bubas also coached teams that were 18 in 1960 and 10 in 1968. And while the 1967 team was not ranked by AP (that was a brief period when the poll ranked just 10 teams), it was ranked No. 19 by the Coaches. So that was a pretty good run for Duke basketball -- the best before K's program took off in the mid-1980s.
    https://forums.dukebasketballreport...482#post951482

    -jk

  6. #26
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Durham, within a couple of miles of Cameron
    Quote Originally Posted by -jk View Post
    Thanks, -jk, I think this is it; my few remaining little grey cells thought it had been a 'major' front page review, but this sounds right. Plus, there are some really good references of Steve Vacendak getting Tom Butters to look into K as a Foster replacement!
    Happy Final Four Eclipse night...appreciate your research skills.
    JStuart

  7. #27
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
    Location
    Farmingdale, New Jersey
    Verga’s shot was a little flatter than “normal”. He and Mitchell both put on their pants one leg at a time. Any other comparison between the two of them is ludicrous.

  8. #28
    In response to what Olympic fan wrote about Mike Lewis. Yes, Lewis DID match up with David Lattin down low,
    so Duke indeed could have competed with Texas Western. But that's EXACTLY what the problem was. What
    the country was actually going to see was an All White Duke team playing an All black Texas Western team,
    so what the game was going to do was to cause a huge amount of racial troublemaking. And that's why I
    decided to write the book; to show what the real impact of the game would have been on all the participants.
    Being "The team that played Texas Western" would NOT have helped Duke recruiting.

  9. #29
    I thought this was going to be a BBQ discussion.

  10. #30

    Verga Jump Shot and More

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bg0Fu3JLg4U

    Hope the link works...

    This is an instructional film featuring Bubas and the starting 5 from 1966.
    The production and narration has not aged well.

    But it was fun to see my favorite childhood Duke squad on film.

    And Verga's jump shot is shown midway through the film.

  11. #31
    Thanks for the post, Scotty! Hope you had a chance to have a look at the book;
    I think I got the Duke Durham parts about right. Also shows how hard it would
    have been to get Dawkins and Banks if we had played the '66 game.. Never forgot
    how you and I went out and did the player intros in September '77 for Banks and
    Dennard over at Cameron before I left town.

  12. #32
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Greensboro, NC
    Quote Originally Posted by Atldukie79 View Post
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bg0Fu3JLg4U

    Hope the link works...

    This is an instructional film featuring Bubas and the starting 5 from 1966.
    The production and narration has not aged well.

    But it was fun to see my favorite childhood Duke squad on film.

    And Verga's jump shot is shown midway through the film.
    That's the Duke team that I first saw live at Duke Indoor Stadium. What a magical place to watch your first ACC game. No wonder I became a Duke fan!
    Man, if your Mom made you wear that color when you were a baby, and you're still wearing it, it's time to grow up!

  13. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by killerleft View Post
    That's the Duke team that I first saw live at Duke Indoor Stadium. What a magical place to watch your first ACC game. No wonder I became a Duke fan!
    Yeah, we all got hooked on Duke B-ball back then when we were kids. That's what made the Dark Ages of the 70s so hard
    to handle; watching that rascally Deano win all the time with his 4 corner stall drove me absolutely batty!

  14. #34

    1966 Game

    I was a senior at Duke and won one of the 50 students tickets available in a lottery. One of my best friends' father who lived in Maryland had secured two tickets so with another very good friend the three of us went to the game. I still have the program.

    I remember seeing Verga with a towel wrapped around his neck as the team left College Park.

    KY vs Texas Western got billed as white verses black. It would have had the same billing had Duke reached the finals.

    Looking forward to the book.

    SoCal

  15. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by SoCalDukeFan View Post
    I was a senior at Duke and won one of the 50 students tickets available in a lottery. One of my best friends' father who lived in Maryland had secured two tickets so with another very good friend the three of us went to the game. I still have the program.

    I remember seeing Verga with a towel wrapped around his neck as the team left College Park.

    KY vs Texas Western got billed as white verses black. It would have had the same billing had Duke reached the finals.

    Looking forward to the book.

    SoCal
    Yes, it would have, which as it turns out, would have been a MAJOR problem for Duke; it would NOT have
    endeared them to the (40% of Durham) local black population.

  16. #36
    Quote Originally Posted by Atldukie79 View Post
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bg0Fu3JLg4U

    Hope the link works...

    This is an instructional film featuring Bubas and the starting 5 from 1966.
    The production and narration has not aged well.

    But it was fun to see my favorite childhood Duke squad on film.

    And Verga's jump shot is shown midway through the film.
    That was fantastic. If only Mitchell had watched the first few minutes and understood the importance of a high trajectory shot.

  17. #37

    Has anyone read the book

    The reviews on Amazon are not very good.

    SoCal

  18. #38
    They're kind of lukewarm; I tried to be thorough, but actually wound up being
    a little repetitive. But they all agreed I did my research. I think the book provides
    some pretty good answers to some questions which have bothered generations
    of Duke fans.

  19. #39
    I had great seats for the 1966 Final Four. Five yards from where the Kentucky team sat. I think the notion that an all Black American team won the NCAA championship is way over done. The Harlem GlobeTrotters beat the Minneapolis Lakers, the NBA champions, twice in 1949. If you watched the NBA in the Sixties you knew it was a racial stereotype to think a team needed white players to win .
    I think the game only showed that big time Southern teams needed to start recruiting Black American players.

  20. #40
    So you got to see history. I'm sure at the time you didn't recognize the actual
    significance of the Kentucky Texas Western game; it only became clear a year
    or two later. Don't think I could have handled seeing Duke lose the semitnal
    game in person when I was seven.

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