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  1. #61
    Reminder: women face Cheats today at 3:00 p.m. Eastern. Game is on ESPNU.

  2. #62
    DeSimone is out. Pronti, her replacement, gets the game’s first goal on an FP.

  3. #63
    Duke went down by four early, but bounced back nicely to trail by only one at the half. Turnovers are hurting, but being partially offset by Nease going 10-17.

    Bernstein picking up for DeSimone with afirst-half hat trick.

  4. #64
    First, let me say that I admire the women on this team. In every game I have seen, they have given it their all and managed to win tight games through grit. They are a team that deserves our respect and admiration.

    However, the program overall is not where it should be. This is another losing ACC season. Since 2017, the team has not been a player in the ACC. They have had six losing seasons and one winning season (2020, they were 1-1 when the season was called). They have gone 22-37 against the ACC. Worse, the gap between Duke and the top echelon of ACC women's lacrosse has widened (thank god for Louisville, Virginia Tech, and Pitt, which represent most of our wins).

    We haven't been a strong national player except for 2022. We are missing more NCAA tournaments than we make.

    Recruiting has also declined over this period. We don't have the firepower required to compete for winning ACC seasons and nationally. During this period, Stanford has established themselves from nowhere as a more consistent program and is out recruiting us.

    Others have mentioned the changing landscape of women's lacrosse, implying Duke is in a difficult spot. I am unsure what those issues could be and would love color from anyone. But Duke should be better than they are (and they used to be). Perhaps we don't have the resources to invest in this sport. We do have to make trade-offs. But I hope Nina looks at what can be done to give the incredible women in this program (past and present) a chance to excel and for the program to meet its potential.

  5. #65
    16-11 is your final. A 6-2 third quarter put Duke in a hole it couldn’t climb out of.

    The loss of DeSimone hurt. Seventeen turnovers hurt. An off day from Everson hurt. The combined effect was too much.

    If Cuse beats BC, we will face UVa in the quarterfinals next Wednesday in Charlotte.

  6. #66
    BC’s overtime win over Cuse means we get the Eagles in the quarterfinals. ACC tournament is set.

    First round: Clemson vs. Pitt and VaTech vs. Louisville

    Quarterfinals: (1) Cuse vs. VaTech - Louisville winner
    (4) UVa vs. (5) UNC
    (3) BC vs. (6) Duke
    (2) ND vs. Clemson - Pitt winner

  7. #67
    Quote Originally Posted by pamtelp View Post
    First, let me say that I admire the women on this team. In every game I have seen, they have given it their all and managed to win tight games through grit. They are a team that deserves our respect and admiration.

    However, the program overall is not where it should be. This is another losing ACC season. Since 2017, the team has not been a player in the ACC. They have had six losing seasons and one winning season (2020, they were 1-1 when the season was called). They have gone 22-37 against the ACC. Worse, the gap between Duke and the top echelon of ACC women's lacrosse has widened (thank god for Louisville, Virginia Tech, and Pitt, which represent most of our wins).

    We haven't been a strong national player except for 2022. We are missing more NCAA tournaments than we make.

    Recruiting has also declined over this period. We don't have the firepower required to compete for winning ACC seasons and nationally. During this period, Stanford has established themselves from nowhere as a more consistent program and is out recruiting us.

    Others have mentioned the changing landscape of women's lacrosse, implying Duke is in a difficult spot. I am unsure what those issues could be and would love color from anyone. But Duke should be better than they are (and they used to be). Perhaps we don't have the resources to invest in this sport. We do have to make trade-offs. But I hope Nina looks at what can be done to give the incredible women in this program (past and present) a chance to excel and for the program to meet its potential.
    Preaching to the choir

  8. #68
    The time for change is in the rear view mirror. This season is nothing new. It’s become boring to talk about frankly.

    Will there be change this off-season? I don’t know. But you will find out this off-season whether Nina particularly cares about Duke being a competitive women’s lacrosse program, or not.

  9. #69
    BC won 19-5 in the ACC quarters last night and I would guess put an end to the Duke Women’s lacrosse season.

    It was 4-2 after the 1st quarter and I think was tied at 2-2, but too many Blue Devil turnovers coupled with BC being really good led to this one being over early.

  10. #70
    Quote Originally Posted by DangerDevil View Post
    and I would guess put an end to the Duke Women’s lacrosse season.
    Not necessarily. Duke is number 30 in the RPI, but if you compare them to the schools right above them—Colorado, UMass, and Holy Cross—they have a far superior SOS (number six vs. 25, 46, and 63), and they’re the only team with an RPI over 20 that has an RPI top ten win (and that could be a top five win depending on the results of tomorrow’s semifinals). Squarely on the bubble, maybe more bubble-out than bubble-in, but it’s premature to write them off.

  11. #71
    Quote Originally Posted by burnspbesq View Post
    Not necessarily. Duke is number 30 in the RPI, but if you compare them to the schools right above them—Colorado, UMass, and Holy Cross—they have a far superior SOS (number six vs. 25, 46, and 63), and they’re the only team with an RPI over 20 that has an RPI top ten win (and that could be a top five win depending on the results of tomorrow’s semifinals). Squarely on the bubble, maybe more bubble-out than bubble-in, but it’s premature to write them off.
    I don’t want that to be the case but even before any bids are stolen I think the deck is stacked against them making the field.

    https://www.usalacrosse.com/magazine...alky-seed-line

    “At 10-8 and with an RPI of 30, is Duke’s win over Virginia enough to get the Devils in? This will be the toughest decision the committee has to make two Sundays from now.”

    “A more confusing situation exists for the final three at-large spaces.

    It’s a continual conversation every week, but what will the committee do with a team like Duke (10-8), which has a poor RPI (30th), one very notable win (Virginia) and a string of really lopsided losses (last six losses have been by an average of 10.3 goals)? With no more games to play, Duke looks like it will be among the first teams left out.”

  12. #72
    Quote Originally Posted by burnspbesq View Post
    Not necessarily. Duke is number 30 in the RPI, but if you compare them to the schools right above them—Colorado, UMass, and Holy Cross—they have a far superior SOS (number six vs. 25, 46, and 63), and they’re the only team with an RPI over 20 that has an RPI top ten win (and that could be a top five win depending on the results of tomorrow’s semifinals). Squarely on the bubble, maybe more bubble-out than bubble-in, but it’s premature to write them off.
    Odd that you note that women’s lacrosse has changed implying it has gotten more competitive yet this Duke squad which has 1 legit win all season is on the bubble for the tourney. Seems like it must be easier than ever to make the tourney. Duke men didn’t make it 2 years ago with top 10 RPI.

    Wlax at Duke should make tourney nearly every year.

  13. #73
    Quote Originally Posted by Deke1990 View Post
    Odd that you note that women’s lacrosse has changed implying it has gotten more competitive yet this Duke squad which has 1 legit win all season is on the bubble for the tourney. Seems like it must be easier than ever to make the tourney. Duke men didn’t make it 2 years ago with top 10 RPI.

    Wlax at Duke should make tourney nearly every year.
    For openers, the women’s filed is 29 (15. AQs, 14 at large) for 127 schools in D1, vs. 17 (nine AQ, ten at large) for 75 men’s programs.

    If you look back 20 years, to the last season before the first round of ACC expansion, there were only about 60 schools playing D1 women’s lacrosse, and the ACC was a four-team league, vs. ten this year and 12 next year (welcome, Stanford and Cal). Louisville, Pitt, and Clemson didn’t exist, and ND, BC, Cuse, and VaTech were glorified club teams. There are five programs currently in the RPI top 20 that didn’t even exist then, including four (Michigan, Florida, Stanford, and USC) that compete directly with Duke in recruiting.

    In microcosm, I can track the change by looking at where all-State players from my high school (Ridgewood, NJ) have gone. Duke used to get them; the most notable example was Leigh Jester T ‘07, a second-team All-American midfielder. The turning point was in 2012: yes, Duke got Kelci Smesko, who was ACC freshman of the year before her career went off the rails, but Courtney Tarleton was part of Lindsey Munday’s first recruiting class at USC, where she was a four-year captain and first-team All-American. More recently, the Devir sisters chose BC and Stanford, and the best player on this year’s team has verballed to Clemson.

    Did first Joe Alleva and then Kevin White fiddle while Durham burned? Maybe. Hindsight is always 20:20. Do we need new leadership? Again, maybe. If I were Duke AD and I decided to pull that trigger, my shortlist would be pretty short: the aforementioned Munday, Harvard DC Becca Block, and maybe one or two others. But there are no guarantees that either of them, or anyone else you could name, can be a Kara Lawson-type transformational hire.. It would be nice if Duke could match what Clemson has done in terms of facilities, but that’s probably not happening in the near term barring a major contribution, and I haven’t won PowerBall yet. And when Nina thinks about this, there’s a counterfactual right over on East Campus. At the end of the 2022 season, there were very similar conversations around the state of Duke field hockey, but staying the course and one generational recruit got Duke back to the final four.


    None of this is easy.
    Last edited by burnspbesq; 04-27-2024 at 08:52 AM.

  14. #74
    "Kara Lawson-type transformational hire"?

    I'm not sure exactly what you're arguing in your post, but it lacks insight .
    Last edited by Dukegrid; 04-27-2024 at 04:16 PM.

  15. #75
    Quote Originally Posted by burnspbesq View Post
    For openers, the women’s filed is 29 (15. AQs, 14 at large) for 127 schools in D1, vs. 17 (nine AQ, ten at large) for 75 men’s programs.

    If you look back 20 years, to the last season before the first round of ACC expansion, there were only about 60 schools playing D1 women’s lacrosse, and the ACC was a four-team league, vs. ten this year and 12 next year (welcome, Stanford and Cal). Louisville, Pitt, and Clemson didn’t exist, and ND, BC, Cuse, and VaTech were glorified club teams. There are five programs currently in the RPI top 20 that didn’t even exist then, including four (Michigan, Florida, Stanford, and USC) that compete directly with Duke in recruiting.

    In microcosm, I can track the change by looking at where all-State players from my high school (Ridgewood, NJ) have gone. Duke used to get them; the most notable example was Leigh Jester T ‘07, a second-team All-American midfielder. The turning point was in 2012: yes, Duke got Kelci Smesko, who was ACC freshman of the year before her career went off the rails, but Courtney Tarleton was part of Lindsey Munday’s first recruiting class at USC, where she was a four-year captain and first-team All-American. More recently, the Devir sisters chose BC and Stanford, and the best player on this year’s team has verballed to Clemson.

    Did first Joe Alleva and then Kevin White fiddle while Durham burned? Maybe. Hindsight is always 20:20. Do we need new leadership? Again, maybe. If I were Duke AD and I decided to pull that trigger, my shortlist would be pretty short: the aforementioned Munday, Harvard DC Becca Block, and maybe one or two others. But there are no guarantees that either of them, or anyone else you could name, can be a Kara Lawson-type transformational hire.. It would be nice if Duke could match what Clemson has done in terms of facilities, but that’s probably not happening in the near term barring a major contribution, and I haven’t won PowerBall yet. And when Nina thinks about this, there’s a counterfactual right over on East Campus. At the end of the 2022 season, there were very similar conversations around the state of Duke field hockey, but staying the course and one generational recruit got Duke back to the final four.


    None of this is easy.
    We had the generational recruit - Charlotte North and she left Duke because she wanted to win a national title. Nuff said.

    And the fact the recruits from NJ are not picking Duke but rather USC and BC points to the HC. Why are those schools more attractive than Duke? HC is the issue. And if you spend any time talking to people in Wlax world you will hear that she is not good on the recruiting trail. Not sure what Joe Alleva has to do with this but results started going south in 2017 (after Alleva left) - she earned the right to turn it around. It is now 2024 and she hasn’t.

  16. #76
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    New Bern, NC unless it's a home football game then I'm grilling on Devil's Alley
    Quote Originally Posted by burnspbesq View Post
    For openers, the women’s filed is 29 (15. AQs, 14 at large) for 127 schools in D1, vs. 17 (nine AQ, ten at large) for 75 men’s programs.

    If you look back 20 years, to the last season before the first round of ACC expansion, there were only about 60 schools playing D1 women’s lacrosse, and the ACC was a four-team league, vs. ten this year and 12 next year (welcome, Stanford and Cal). Louisville, Pitt, and Clemson didn’t exist, and ND, BC, Cuse, and VaTech were glorified club teams. There are five programs currently in the RPI top 20 that didn’t even exist then, including four (Michigan, Florida, Stanford, and USC) that compete directly with Duke in recruiting.

    In microcosm, I can track the change by looking at where all-State players from my high school (Ridgewood, NJ) have gone. Duke used to get them; the most notable example was Leigh Jester T ‘07, a second-team All-American midfielder. The turning point was in 2012: yes, Duke got Kelci Smesko, who was ACC freshman of the year before her career went off the rails, but Courtney Tarleton was part of Lindsey Munday’s first recruiting class at USC, where she was a four-year captain and first-team All-American. More recently, the Devir sisters chose BC and Stanford, and the best player on this year’s team has verballed to Clemson.

    Did first Joe Alleva and then Kevin White fiddle while Durham burned? Maybe. Hindsight is always 20:20. Do we need new leadership? Again, maybe. If I were Duke AD and I decided to pull that trigger, my shortlist would be pretty short: the aforementioned Munday, Harvard DC Becca Block, and maybe one or two others. But there are no guarantees that either of them, or anyone else you could name, can be a Kara Lawson-type transformational hire.. It would be nice if Duke could match what Clemson has done in terms of facilities, but that’s probably not happening in the near term barring a major contribution, and I haven’t won PowerBall yet. And when Nina thinks about this, there’s a counterfactual right over on East Campus. At the end of the 2022 season, there were very similar conversations around the state of Duke field hockey, but staying the course and one generational recruit got Duke back to the final four.


    None of this is easy.
    First, let's correctly quote Burnspbesq

    Quote Originally Posted by Dukegrid View Post
    "Kara Lawson-type transformational hire"?

    I'm not sure exactly what you're arguing in your post, but it lacks insight .
    And then, let's ask, how do you infer from that lengthy and very well reasoned post that "it lacks insight"?
    And more to the point, how do you not think that Kara Lawson was transformational, pulling Duke women's basketball out of the dumpster fire it was into landing top 5 nationally recruited classes?
    Q "Why do you like Duke, you didn't even go there." A "Because my art school didn't have a basketball team."

  17. #77

    All ACC

    https://goduke.com/news/2024/4/23/wo...accolades.aspx

    Katie DeSimone named to the All ACC 1st team and Bella Goodwin made the All Rookie team.

  18. #78
    Duke Women made the tourney

    I am happy to be wrong!

  19. #79
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    New Orleans, Louisiana
    Quote Originally Posted by DangerDevil View Post
    Duke Women made the tourney

    I am happy to be wrong!
    You can find the bracket and schedule here. Duke WLAX goes to Philadelphia and will play Loyola Maryland on Friday at 4pm ET. The winner will play again on Sunday against the winner of Richmond vs. host and 8-seed Penn. Both the first and second round games are on ESPN+.

  20. #80
    Almost certainly the last team in—but last in is always better than first out. The win over UVa was probably the differentiator vs. the other bubble teams.

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