A thread to discuss Schutt

[UrinalCake]

The topic of Schutt's playing time has permeated multiple threads, but I thought this was worth starting a new one. A tweet from yesterday referenced another tweet suggesting that Schutt may be in line for some playing time. Curious if others have heard anything similar?

Ryan Lommen
@TheDukeNation
Scheyer added: "We’ve told Jaden (Schutt) to be ready"

(via @BrendanRMarks)

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[Kedsy]

The topic of Schutt's playing time has permeated multiple threads, but I thought this was worth starting a new one. A tweet from yesterday referenced another tweet suggesting that Schutt may be in line for some playing time. Curious if others have heard anything similar?

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Interesting. Earlier in the season, I wasn't clamoring for Schutt. If the coaches thought he wasn't ready, then he wasn't ready. But at this point, especially while Whitehead is out and Blakes's role seemingly reduced, I've come around to the idea that it's worth trying. Adding a shooter might help our offense come around, make us more difficult to defend. That's assuming he's not a complete liability on defense. But in the few minutes he's received, while he didn't look like a strong defender, he didn't look like a total defense-killer, either.

[ClemmonsDevil]

Interesting. Earlier in the season, I wasn't clamoring for Schutt. If the coaches thought he wasn't ready, then he wasn't ready. But at this point, especially while Whitehead is out and Blakes's role seemingly reduced, I've come around to the idea that it's worth trying. Adding a shooter might help our offense come around, make us more difficult to defend. That's assuming he's not a complete liability on defense. But in the few minutes he's received, while he didn't look like a strong defender, he didn't look like a total defense-killer, either.

I am deeply in the time is earned in practice camp. They didn't play him, because they didn't trust him. Would be a great sign if he is able to earn some run.

[scottdude8]

If there was a game for some Schutt, this would be a good one… while Syracuse is famous for its zone, Josh Pastner also commonly uses some different zones in Atlanta. Assuming he does so tomorrow, there should be a need for Schutt’s zone breaking shooting ability. Here’s hoping he takes that chance and runs with it.

[UrinalCake]

My thinking is in line with Kedsy and Clemmons - if the coaches aren't playing him then he must not be showing enough in practice to warrant playing time. Hitting a couple threes against scrub opponents isn't enough to prove he can do it against ACC teams (so far he is 1-3 aginst USC Upstate, 3-3 against Maryland ES, 1-1 in garbage time against NC State). Also freshmen who were ranked in his range don't typically come in and shoot well, or at least they don't have the ability to create good shots which would allow them to shoot well. But if there has been a shift and the coaches think he's ready then let's see what he's got!

[ingrjc1]

My thinking is in line with Kedsy and Clemmons - if the coaches aren't playing him then he must not be showing enough in practice to warrant playing time. Hitting a couple threes against scrub opponents isn't enough to prove he can do it against ACC teams (so far he is 1-3 aginst USC Upstate, 3-3 against Maryland ES, 1-1 in garbage time against NC State). Also freshmen who were ranked in his range don't typically come in and shoot well, or at least they don't have the ability to create good shots which would allow them to shoot well. But if there has been a shift and the coaches think he's ready then let's see what he's got!

How about what players show in games? We don't get to go to practice, but we watch games. We don't really know what Schutt can do in games, but we have seen what other players are doing in games. Maybe lack of game performance should limit play for some and open up play for others.

[ClemmonsDevil]

How about what players show in games? We don't get to go to practice, but we watch games. We don't really know what Schutt can do in games, but we have seen what other players are doing in games. Maybe lack of game performance should limit play for some and open up play for others.

But if the dude struggling in games is dotting the eyes of the dude behind him in practice, tough to play the lesser dude.

[dukebluesincebirth]

My thinking is in line with Kedsy and Clemmons - if the coaches aren't playing him then he must not be showing enough in practice to warrant playing time. Hitting a couple threes against scrub opponents isn't enough to prove he can do it against ACC teams (so far he is 1-3 aginst USC Upstate, 3-3 against Maryland ES, 1-1 in garbage time against NC State). Also freshmen who were ranked in his range don't typically come in and shoot well, or at least they don't have the ability to create good shots which would allow them to shoot well. But if there has been a shift and the coaches think he's ready then let's see what he's got!

Yes. Creating your own shot is not easy at this level unless you've got the moves/handles/speed to make that happen. If you can't create your own, you have to be a knock-down shooter who relies on teammates to create your open looks. Which means your teammates have to be drawing some major attention from the defense. Duke doesn't have any offensive players that draw much attention with the exception of maybe Flip. It would be interesting to see what happens, but I think Schutt at this point in his game probably needs better offensive playmakers around him to be effective.

[UrinalCake]

But if the dude struggling in games is dotting the eyes of the dude behind him in practice, tough to play the lesser dude.

I have a theory, completely unsubstantiated of course, that in practice Grandison and Proctor are shooting just as well from three as Schutt. And they're doing other things better, which is why Schutt hasn't played. Would love to be wrong and have Schutt come in and bury some shots.

[CrazyNotCrazie]

I would give anything to be in the room for the recruiting conversations the Duke coaches have with guys like Schutt whose playing time will be uncertain. I assume the coaches lay out the roster and say that there are no guarantees and we will keep recruiting highly ranked players so we might recruit over you in your upper class years.

Knowing what the coaches likely say, I would also like to know what the players actually heard of that and what their thoughts are.

I often wonder if either a) the players aren't hearing what the coaches are saying, or b) the players have a lot of self-confidence and are convinced they will earn playing time, even though there are more highly ranked players ahead of them.

[Bob Green]

But at this point, especially while Whitehead is out and Blakes's role seemingly reduced, I've come around to the idea that it's worth trying. Adding a shooter might help our offense come around, make us more difficult to defend.

Kedsy hits the nail on the head. Blakes played only five minutes in each of the last two games so essentially the rotation is down two players so it’s perfect timing to give Schutt an opportunity.

[CDu]

I would give anything to be in the room for the recruiting conversations the Duke coaches have with guys like Schutt whose playing time will be uncertain. I assume the coaches lay out the roster and say that there are no guarantees and we will keep recruiting highly ranked players so we might recruit over you in your upper class years.

Knowing what the coaches likely say, I would also like to know what the players actually heard of that and what their thoughts are.

I often wonder if either a) the players aren't hearing what the coaches are saying, or b) the players have a lot of self-confidence and are convinced they will earn playing time, even though there are more highly ranked players ahead of them.

I would be shocked if the coaches told a player "we don't expect you to play..." during the recruiting trail. As Coach K says, everyone runs his/her own race, so it's not set in stone that a player will be destined for backup duties. Heck, Goldwire was a sub-300 rated recruit and he earned starter level minutes for two years.

I'm guessing they present it more like "this is the type of player we think you could be if you come to Duke; there will be a bunch of talented players, but everyone will have the opportunity to earn playing time." They don't pigeon hole anyone into a limited situation. But at the same time, they don't guarantee anyone playing time either.

Players are, of course, very self-confident. You don't get to be good enough to be recruited by Duke by being unsure of yourself on the court.

[elvis14]

I have a theory, completely unsubstantiated of course, that in practice Grandison and Proctor are shooting just as well from three as Schutt. And they're doing other things better, which is why Schutt hasn't played. Would love to be wrong and have Schutt come in and bury some shots.

I suspect you could be right about practice but we also know that Grandison shows up to play about one out of every 4 games and Proctor seems to be all or nothing from 3 in games. We have a couple of losses where we shot terribly from 3 (including, my alma mater, Clemson) and since we were going to lose anyway it would have been good to give a shooter a shot. I'd like to see Jaden get some minutes in games.

[CrazyNotCrazie]

I would be shocked if the coaches told a player "we don't expect you to play..." during the recruiting trail. As Coach K says, everyone runs his/her own race, so it's not set in stone that a player will be destined for backup duties. Heck, Goldwire was a sub-300 rated recruit and he earned starter level minutes for two years.

I'm guessing they present it more like "this is the type of player we think you could be if you come to Duke; there will be a bunch of talented players, but everyone will have the opportunity to earn playing time." They don't pigeon hole anyone into a limited situation. But at the same time, they don't guarantee anyone playing time either.

Players are, of course, very self-confident. You don't get to be good enough to be recruited by Duke by being unsure of yourself on the court.

Yes - that is what I was saying. I think there is some sense of realism presented. And I'm sure they highlight lower ranked guys who worked hard and developed into significant contributors and tell them that that is a possibility.

[Kedsy]

Creating your own shot is not easy at this level unless you've got the moves/handles/speed to make that happen. If you can't create your own, you have to be a knock-down shooter who relies on teammates to create your open looks. Which means your teammates have to be drawing some major attention from the defense. Duke doesn't have any offensive players that draw much attention with the exception of maybe Flip. It would be interesting to see what happens, but I think Schutt at this point in his game probably needs better offensive playmakers around him to be effective.

I'm not sure I agree. In general, at least at Duke (I haven't researched other teams in this regard), assists on three-point baskets comprise between 40% and 60% of a team's total assists. Which end of the spectrum would seem to be controlled by multiple factors, the primary three factors being inside presence, chief playmaker, and three-point shooting ability. Below is a chart showing what percentage of our assists were on three point baskets over the most recent ten year period. With the exception of 2014, the lack of a "true" PG has seemed to correlate with a higher percentage of our assists coming on threes (though it may not truly correlate because of the multitude of factors involved). That's obviously limited if you don't shoot threes very well.

Year	on 3s	on 2s	total	PG		C		team 3%	%3pt assts
2023	119	158	277	Proctor?	Young/Lively	32.1%	43.0%
2022	272	345	617	Moore?		M Williams	36.6%	44.1%
2021	162	193	355	Goldwire?	M Williams?	35.2%	45.6%
2020	178	279	457	Tr Jones	Carey		35.2%	38.9%
2019	241	352	593	Tr Jones	Bolden		30.8%	40.6%
2018	269	378	647	Duval		Carter/Bagley	37.2%	41.6%
2017	260	225	485	Allen?		Jefferson/Giles	37.8%	53.6%
2016	297	184	481	Allen?		Mar Plumlee	38.5%	61.7%
2015	258	330	588	Ty Jones	Okafor		38.7%	43.9%
2014	271	238	509	Cook		Jefferson?	39.5%	53.2%

Right now, Roach, Proctor, and Filipowski have slashing ability (though they're also the three guys who take the most threes on the team, with a fairly low percentage of success). Young has the ability to kick out to a shooter, and Grandison has the ability to fake an outside shot and dish around the horn for a better shot. My guess is adding another shooter would probably result in a fair amount of open three attempts.

I have a theory, completely unsubstantiated of course, that in practice Grandison and Proctor are shooting just as well from three as Schutt. And they're doing other things better, which is why Schutt hasn't played. Would love to be wrong and have Schutt come in and bury some shots.

I think this is probably correct. However, adding an additional shooter has the potential to give everybody more open threes. If you only have one or two deep threats, it's easier for the defense to keep track of the one guy on the floor and make sure he doesn't get an open shot. The more shooters you have, the more difficult it is for the defense to keep track of all of them.

[ClemmonsDevil]

I have a theory, completely unsubstantiated of course, that in practice Grandison and Proctor are shooting just as well from three as Schutt. And they're doing other things better, which is why Schutt hasn't played. Would love to be wrong and have Schutt come in and bury some shots.

That would make sense. My assumption is he's just getting decimated in practice. Or at least has been. Cuz that's where playing time comes from. If you destroy people in practice then you're going to get a look.

[duke79]

I would give anything to be in the room for the recruiting conversations the Duke coaches have with guys like Schutt whose playing time will be uncertain. I assume the coaches lay out the roster and say that there are no guarantees and we will keep recruiting highly ranked players so we might recruit over you in your upper class years.

Knowing what the coaches likely say, I would also like to know what the players actually heard of that and what their thoughts are.

I often wonder if either a) the players aren't hearing what the coaches are saying, or b) the players have a lot of self-confidence and are convinced they will earn playing time, even though there are more highly ranked players ahead of them.

I would be shocked if the coaches told a player "we don't expect you to play..." during the recruiting trail. As Coach K says, everyone runs his/her own race, so it's not set in stone that a player will be destined for backup duties. Heck, Goldwire was a sub-300 rated recruit and he earned starter level minutes for two years.

I'm guessing they present it more like "this is the type of player we think you could be if you come to Duke; there will be a bunch of talented players, but everyone will have the opportunity to earn playing time." They don't pigeon hole anyone into a limited situation. But at the same time, they don't guarantee anyone playing time either.

Players are, of course, very self-confident. You don't get to be good enough to be recruited by Duke by being unsure of yourself on the court.

You may both be right but there is always the possibility that someone like Schutt (and his parents) might be thinking "Yea, maybe I won't start and be a basketball star at a school like Duke BUT I am getting a free four-year ride to one of the top universities in the country AND I get to tell people that I played on the Duke basketball team. Plus, if I can improve my basketball skills (and what better place to do it), maybe I can earn some significant playing time". Of course, I have no clue what might have been going through his mind.

[Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15]

That would make sense. My assumption is he's just getting decimated in practice. Or at least has been. Cuz that's where playing time comes from. If you destroy people in practice then you're going to get a look.

Yeah. I doubt our coaching staff is intentionally holding a knockdown shooter off the floor.

[lotusland]

What I remember from Schutt’s mix tape was (1) the opponents weren’t that physically imposing and (2) he seemed to have been given the keys to run the offense. He may not have been the PG but he initiated the offense often. So I think he’s comfortable driving, dishing and shooting but he’ll need to be able to do it a much higher level at Duke than in HS.

[budwom]

The backup quarterback is always the fan favorite.