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  1. #41
    Quote Originally Posted by Matches View Post
    This. With all due respect to Baker, who always seemed to be a good teammate and a fine representative of the university- a future recruit asked about him will probably answer “who?” and have little question marks floating over his head.

    Dude changed his mind. It happens. Best of luck to him. This isn’t a four-alarm fire.
    Yeah. I imagine future Duke recruits will be slightly more familiar with Zion, Kyrie, Tatum, etc than Joey Baker.

    Absent any context, I find it really strange that this Duke board is seeking a reason to be upset about this.

    Baker didn't pan out in any fashion. He stuck it out four years and is headed on. We can stop arguing over whether he is going to blossom into the pure shooter that we hoped for. Eventually, we may even stop arguing over whether it was a mistake to...

    Nevermind. I'm not even going to mention it.

  2. #42
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Los Angeles
    Quote Originally Posted by Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15 View Post
    This is crazy talk! Everyone on this board knows that every decision made by any Duke basketball player past or present is a BASKETBALL decision! Additionally, it reflects either positively or negatively on the program.

    No one has non-basketball career aspirations, family considerations, romantic entanglements, or even hobbies. ALL BASKETBALL ALL THE TIME.
    Amen brother. There are lots of reasons having nothing to do with basketball that could have driven this decision and its timing. Most likely among them would be a family issue or his girlfriend is transferring/moving/etc to another part of the country and Joey wants to be near her. Wouldn't be the first time...

  3. #43
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Boston, MA
    Quote Originally Posted by Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15 View Post
    Yeah. I imagine future Duke recruits will be slightly more familiar with Zion, Kyrie, Tatum, etc than Joey Baker.

    Absent any context, I find it really strange that this Duke board is seeking a reason to be upset about this.

    Baker didn't pan out in any fashion. He stuck it out four years and is headed on. We can stop arguing over whether he is going to blossom into the pure shooter that we hoped for. Eventually, we may even stop arguing over whether it was a mistake to...

    Nevermind. I'm not even going to mention it.
    I assume a few are upset, but I think a lot of us are just confused. That includes me. I don't get the timing given there is no new information.
    Criticism may not be agreeable, but it is necessary. It fulfils the same function as pain in the human body. It calls attention to an unhealthy state of things. - Winston Churchill

    President of the "Nolan Smith Should Have His Jersey in The Rafters" Club

  4. #44
    Quote Originally Posted by SouthernDukie View Post
    This is strange, to say the least. When I heard the news that Joey would be coming back for next season, I was absolutely surprised. I had really pegged him as an absolute, sure fire transfer. But with the news that he was returning, I figured he just loved Duke and would be staying no matter what.

    And now he’s transferring? I don’t get it at all.
    I figured him for a transfer and got on trouble here for saying so, so I was quite surprised when he initially announced his return. I honestly wonder if he just got caught up in all the emotions of the end of last season and the final four and just, going off sentiment, said "I'll be back." Once the smoke cleared and the reality of playing time set in, I think he made a practical decision that he should transfer.

  5. #45
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Vermont
    Quote Originally Posted by proelitedota View Post
    Clearly staff is confident that we get both Keels (back) and AJ Green.



    He can be a grad transfer.
    Clear as mud I'd say.

  6. #46
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Durham
    Quote Originally Posted by scottdude8 View Post
    I would agree 100% with you on this if it happened prior to the typical portal deadline, and Duke hadn't made a point of announcing his return. But that announcement, combined with this strange timing (I haven't heard of anyone else entering the portal after the May 1 deadline), make it appear that something weird went on behind the scenes.

    You're right that the reality here won't be anywhere near as bad as my initial reaction was. But I think the confluence of circumstances here make this a worse look than your usual transfer, or if Joey had transferred three weeks ago without having a senior night. As always, the reality is probably somewhere in the middle... now that I've vented I'll do my part by not adding my initially extreme perspective to the discourse
    an overwhelming majority of college basketball fans couldn't tell you one thing about transfer deadlines. even IF he were a prime time player, there would be some mumbo jumbo about why he could/could not play next year, and people's eyes would glaze over.

    I'm here and likely more in tune than your average fan, and I can't tell you all the rules why someone can or can't play next year. I'm sad to see him go, but in the grand scheme of things, this is nothingburger.
    1200. DDMF.

  7. #47
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    NC
    Quote Originally Posted by scottdude8 View Post
    I would agree 100% with you on this if it happened prior to the typical portal deadline, and Duke hadn't made a point of announcing his return. But that announcement, combined with this strange timing (I haven't heard of anyone else entering the portal after the May 1 deadline), make it appear that something weird went on behind the scenes.
    Yeah, that "something behind the scenes" could very well be that Green is coming. As others have noted, while we've HOPED that we'd have Keels or a transfer, that has merely been a hope. I'm guessing Baker had a pretty good idea Keels was going to stay in the draft, and until today (with the report that Green was coming to campus) we hadn't had any real traction with the transfers. So I think it's quite plausible that Baker thought he had a shot at at least meaningful minutes, if not a starting gig. But if Green is coming for real, then he's stuck fighting with Schutt for backup minutes, and he doesn't add a skill that Green doesn't already provide better. So it really could be that simple: he held out hope that he'd be an impact guy next year, and only now realizes that it won't happen.

    Could it be something different? Sure. But I would tend toward my explanation being the most likely. It is also the least sinister. But I really can't imagine Coach K or Coach Scheyer misleading Baker, nor could I imagine Coach K not letting Baker have his senior night.

    Quote Originally Posted by scottdude8 View Post
    You're right that the reality here won't be anywhere near as bad as my initial reaction was. But I think the confluence of circumstances here make this a worse look than your usual transfer, or if Joey had transferred three weeks ago without having a senior night. As always, the reality is probably somewhere in the middle... now that I've vented I'll do my part by not adding my initially extreme perspective to the discourse
    I completely agree that it would have looked better had Baker entered by May 1. But it may well be that Baker simply deluded himself into hoping/thinking he could play a major role next year at his dream school, and only just now did the realization sink in. It doesn't have to be something sinister: he could have just really truly believed he wanted to be here, and only as things got more real did he realize that his opportunity would be better elsewhere.

    If Baker convinced the team that he was planning on returning and didn't want to do his senior night this year and come back (which would look weird), it makes sense that they wouldn't do senior night. If Baker convinced Scheyer that he really wanted to be here, it makes sense to celebrate his return (and I'm guessing Baker had a big hand in his own promotion of the return). None of that means Duke did wrong.

  8. #48
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
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    NC
    Quote Originally Posted by flyingdutchdevil View Post
    I assume a few are upset, but I think a lot of us are just confused. That includes me. I don't get the timing given there is no new information.
    But there IS new information. Per 247, Green is either on campus currently or on his way to campus. That is a substantial bit of news. No, we don't have an official commitment, but maybe there were conversations today that made more clear where things were headed (but just aren't "official" enough to be reported)?

  9. #49
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
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    Boston, MA
    Quote Originally Posted by CDu View Post
    But there IS new information. Per 247, Green is either on campus currently or on his way to campus. That is a substantial bit of news. No, we don't have an official commitment, but maybe there were conversations today that made more clear where things were headed (but just aren't "official" enough to be reported)?
    I'm not sure about you, but I was pretty confident Duke was going to have Keels or a high level transfer at the 2 next season. I didn't foresee an option of Baker/Whitehead at the 2 (and if Whitehead is at the 2, Mitchell at the 3).

    To me (and a lot of us), this is surprising. It clearly isn't surprising to you.
    Criticism may not be agreeable, but it is necessary. It fulfils the same function as pain in the human body. It calls attention to an unhealthy state of things. - Winston Churchill

    President of the "Nolan Smith Should Have His Jersey in The Rafters" Club

  10. #50
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Raleigh, NC
    Sorry if someone else mentioned this and I missed it, but isn't it at least possible that he got some kind of NIL offer from another school some business? It isn't necessarily what I think is most likely, but I was mildly surprised not to have seen it yet.

    It does bring back to mind his "thanks for 4 great years" [paraphrased, not the exact quote] tweet. I suspect that even though this seems to have happened suddenly it didn't come out of nowhere.

  11. #51
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
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    NC
    Quote Originally Posted by flyingdutchdevil View Post
    I'm not sure about you, but I was pretty confident Duke was going to have Keels or a high level transfer at the 2 next season. I didn't foresee an option of Baker/Whitehead at the 2 (and if Whitehead is at the 2, Mitchell at the 3).
    I too was pretty hopeful/confident that we were going to get Keels or a transfer. But it wasn't a given. And Baker could have easily convinced himself that his chances were better than they really were. It wouldn't be the first time such a thing happened.

    Quote Originally Posted by flyingdutchdevil View Post
    To me (and a lot of us), this is surprising. It clearly isn't surprising to you.
    I was surprised he didn't do it sooner. I guess I'm surprised now too, but not wildly so. And I think it's easily explainable despite being surprising.

  12. #52
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
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    Boston, MA
    Quote Originally Posted by CDu View Post
    I too was pretty hopeful/confident that we were going to get Keels or a transfer. But it wasn't a given. And Baker could have easily convinced himself that his chances were better than they really were. It wouldn't be the first time such a thing happened.



    I was surprised he didn't do it sooner. I guess I'm surprised now too, but not wildly so. And I think it's easily explainable despite being surprising.
    I'm shocked he didn't transfer after the season. When he committed to a fifth season, I was convinced Baker loved Duke, wanted a Duke graduate degree, and wanted to play a leadership role moreso than looking forward to playing a key role in next year's season.

    I am even more shocked today. Of course, every player can change their mind and priorities change, but I still believe there is something out there we don't know. Maybe one of Schutt/Blakes are rotation-ready and would place out Baker. I have no idea. But again, the timing is very surprising.
    Criticism may not be agreeable, but it is necessary. It fulfils the same function as pain in the human body. It calls attention to an unhealthy state of things. - Winston Churchill

    President of the "Nolan Smith Should Have His Jersey in The Rafters" Club

  13. #53
    Quote Originally Posted by Acymetric View Post
    Sorry if someone else mentioned this and I missed it, but isn't it at least possible that he got some kind of NIL offer from another school some business? It isn't necessarily what I think is most likely, but I was mildly surprised not to have seen it yet.

    It does bring back to mind his "thanks for 4 great years" [paraphrased, not the exact quote] tweet. I suspect that even though this seems to have happened suddenly it didn't come out of nowhere.
    I don't doubt that he could command a little Bojangles' money, but how would a player of his caliber get "school changing" money?

  14. #54
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
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    Boston, MA
    Quote Originally Posted by Acymetric View Post
    Sorry if someone else mentioned this and I missed it, but isn't it at least possible that he got some kind of NIL offer from another school some business? It isn't necessarily what I think is most likely, but I was mildly surprised not to have seen it yet.

    It does bring back to mind his "thanks for 4 great years" [paraphrased, not the exact quote] tweet. I suspect that even though this seems to have happened suddenly it didn't come out of nowhere.
    Crap. This, to me, is probably the most likely reason. Being an "end of the rotation" player at Duke may be less lucrative financially than a starting role at a good mid-major.
    Criticism may not be agreeable, but it is necessary. It fulfils the same function as pain in the human body. It calls attention to an unhealthy state of things. - Winston Churchill

    President of the "Nolan Smith Should Have His Jersey in The Rafters" Club

  15. #55
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Durham
    Nobody has mentioned Joey's recent hip surgery. Maybe his recovery is not going as well as hoped. It may be that he felt he could not participate fully in the summer scrimmages, and that that would set back his hopes of a starting role, regardless of who is coming/returning. He was a fan favorite, but never reached the potential predicted for him as a recruit. Best wishes in the next step of his career.

  16. #56
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    New Bern, NC unless it's a home football game then I'm grilling on Devil's Alley
    Quote Originally Posted by Acymetric View Post
    Sorry if someone else mentioned this and I missed it, but isn't it at least possible that he got some kind of NIL offer from another school some business? It isn't necessarily what I think is most likely, but I was mildly surprised not to have seen it yet.

    It does bring back to mind his "thanks for 4 great years" [paraphrased, not the exact quote] tweet. I suspect that even though this seems to have happened suddenly it didn't come out of nowhere.
    That would be tampering. Doesn't matter if it were to happen with an elite player or a bench warmer, that would still be tampering, and likely lead to a bit of nastiness with multiple parties.
    Q "Why do you like Duke, you didn't even go there." A "Because my art school didn't have a basketball team."

  17. #57
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Colorado
    Good luck to him. He seemed like a great young man. Even when pulled from the game, he seemed to be engaged and supportive of his teammates.

    I think (always dangerous) everyone would agree that Joey did not live up to expectations. He didn't get much playing time and, although he occasionally hit some shots in a game, didn't have the ability to earn consistent playing time. This is not a criticism of him, sometimes things just don't work out.

    With Schutt and, perhaps, Green coming in next year, it is unlikely that Joey could lift his game to get consistent minutes.

    I'd love to see him go to a lesser school with lesser competition and be a star next year.

    Best wishes to him. He will always be a Duke guy in my mind.

  18. #58
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Cary, NC
    Any chance this is related to his injury recovery? Like either it isn't going as well as expected and he doesn't think he'll be ready to contributed at the level required of Duke by the start of the season, OR maybe it's going much better than expected and he originally didn't think he would be a viable transfer candidate due to his health but now that has changed? Just tossing out ideas here. The fact that he had hip surgery immediately after the season ended has to be a huge factor in his trajectory as a player.

  19. #59
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
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    Washington, DC area
    Quote Originally Posted by CameronBornAndBred View Post
    That would be tampering. Doesn't matter if it were to happen with an elite player or a bench warmer, that would still be tampering, and likely lead to a bit of nastiness with multiple parties.
    I'm shocked, shocked!, to find that tampering is going on out there!

    -jk

  20. #60
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    New Bern, NC unless it's a home football game then I'm grilling on Devil's Alley
    Quote Originally Posted by -jk View Post
    I'm shocked, shocked!, to find that tampering is going on out there!

    -jk
    Transferring and then getting offers is one thing. Getting offers and then announcing (especially after a deadline) is something totally different. (And also very likely why it's not the case here.)
    Q "Why do you like Duke, you didn't even go there." A "Because my art school didn't have a basketball team."

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