Duke Football 2022

[BCCoordinators]

There's always a place for the occasional trick play...but what I never got about Cut was he'd watch the team rip down the field with big gainers left and right, then feel compelled to do something tricky instead of sticking with what was working.

Agree -- we're saying the same thing. We just need to get back to fundamentals and being more physical than the other team.

[Dr. Maturin]

I know the failed trick plays stick out in the memory, but Cut's teams also ran some good ones. Off the top of my head:

- 2014 Sun Bowl. Needing a TD late in the 4th quarter, Duke pulls off a fake punt and then a WR pass (Jamison to Blakeney) to take the lead.
- 2018 @ Miami - Duke converts a RB jump pass at a key moment - this either gave us the lead or added to our lead late.
- 2019 @ VT - Jalon Calhoun throws a TD pass to help turn a lead into a blowout over the Hokies
- 2019 UVA - Down 2 scores in the 4th quarter, TJ Rahming throws a TD pass that gets Duke back in the game.

[-jk]

Agree -- we're saying the same thing. We just need to get back to fundamentals and being more physical than the other team.

Do we have the depth to make that sustainable?

-jk

[budwom]

Do we have the depth to make that sustainable?

-jk

This is THE question. Two major questions: how much talent do we have now (I really don't know, suspect it is not particularly good) and how well and how soon can recruiting change our direction?

[BCCoordinators]

This is THE question. Two major questions: how much talent do we have now (I really don't know, suspect it is not particularly good) and how well and how soon can recruiting change our direction?

I don't think we have the depth this year. It'll take time. We just have to be patient and see signs of progress.

[Bob Green]

I know the failed trick plays stick out in the memory, but Cut's teams also ran some good ones. Off the top of my head:

- 2014 Sun Bowl. Needing a TD late in the 4th quarter, Duke pulls off a fake punt and then a WR pass (Jamison to Blakeney) to take the lead.

I feel compelled to point out Jamison Crowder threw the TD pass left handed. Crowder is right handed.

[HereBeforeCoachK]

There's always a place for the occasional trick play...but what I never got about Cut was he'd watch the team rip down the field with big gainers left and right, then feel compelled to do something tricky instead of sticking with what was working.

THIS^^^...so THIS! It seemed like there was zero feel for when the offense was just on a roll, and a pre-determined decision to run the little league formation in the red zone....I especially felt this way during some of Anthony Boone's tenure...he'd have them on a clear roll, and then the gimmicks would start in the red zone. Not only did it kill big mo, it weakened the effectiveness of the gimmick formation for when we might have needed it.

[budwom]

THIS^^^...so THIS! It seemed like there was zero feel for when the offense was just on a roll, and a pre-determined decision to run the little league formation in the red zone...I especially felt this way during some of Anthony Boone's tenure...he'd have them on a clear roll, and then the gimmicks would start in the red zone. Not only did it kill big mo, it weakened the effectiveness of the gimmick formation for when we might have needed it.

yep, one QB is hot, leads them down the field only to get pulled for the last five yards...ouch! (and thanks for the note)!

[HereBeforeCoachK]

yep, one QB is hot, leads them down the field only to get pulled for the last five yards...ouch! (and thanks for the note)!

When I would see this....it was like Boone would be saying WTF as this was happening. Then again, that could well be ME PROJECTING....what I was thinking. But we know QBs like to rack up TD passes and TD runs.......so there's that ego part too. And it's a valid ego consideration in this situation.

[Dr. Maturin]

When I would see this...it was like Boone would be saying WTF as this was happening. Then again, that could well be ME PROJECTING...what I was thinking. But we know QBs like to rack up TD passes and TD runs....so there's that ego part too. And it's a valid ego consideration in this situation.

We can debate the handling of egos and whether its fair to let the backup QB "poach" a red zone chance. What it beyond doubt is that the strategy was amazingly effective. We were literally the best team in the country in goal to go situations in 2013. I think it was pretty remarkable that Cut was able to take a backup QB like Brandon Connette and turn him into an elite short-yardage rusher. Similarly, Cut was able to take a "linebacker in a safety's body" in Jeremy Cash and allow him to thrive in the strike safety position. At his best, Cut knew that you had to do things differently to win at Duke. Even his best teams could rarely line the ball up and beat opponents physically. Sadly, his ability to innovate faded over the years.

Anyway, it's a new day and I can't wait to see what Coach Elko has planned for the program.

[budwom]

We can debate the handling of egos and whether its fair to let the backup QB "poach" a red zone chance. What it beyond doubt is that the strategy was amazingly effective. We were literally the best team in the country in goal to go situations in 2013. I think it was pretty remarkable that Cut was able to take a backup QB like Brandon Connette and turn him into an elite short-yardage rusher. Similarly, Cut was able to take a "linebacker in a safety's body" in Jeremy Cash and allow him to thrive in the strike safety position. At his best, Cut knew that you had to do things differently to win at Duke. Even his best teams could rarely line the ball up and beat opponents physically. Sadly, his ability to innovate faded over the years.

Anyway, it's a new day and I can't wait to see what Coach Elko has planned for the program.

ah, but we're talking about two different time frames. Absolutely true that Connette was highly effective in that role, but that was nine years ago. Since he left that same red zone approach has been pretty lousy, because Connette had a unique skill set ( he was incredibly patient at waiting for a hole, and was a tough runner). His successors possessed neither trait.

[HoKogan]

ah, but we're talking about two different time frames. Absolutely true that Connette was highly effective in that role, but that was nine years ago. Since he left that same red zone approach has been pretty lousy, because Connette had a unique skill set ( he was incredibly patient at waiting for a hole, and was a tough runner). His successors possessed neither trait.

It should be noted that the Connette experiment's success was tied to Boone's injury in early 2013. Connette HAD to pass the ball, and ended up being relatively successful at it. IIRC, Duke went 2-2 during that stretch, and when Boone returned, Connette proved himself to be an effective passer, effective enough to where the defense couldn't just stack 8 in the box. So now you had a starting QB that could pass and run, and a running QB that could pass if needed. Cut's ideal offense was ball control, short passes that eat up TOP and keep the defense guessing so he could get a good run from Thompson, Duncan, Snead, whoever was back there. That duel threat QB was the key and it was really only there for 13 and 14.

[ehdg]

Memories of the 1991 Duke/UNLV game. Ah yes!

Larry
DevilHorse

Totally recall that and spent the Seder watching the game instead and even my dad left the table to join me and watch the last 10 minutes of the game.

[Dr. Maturin]

ah, but we're talking about two different time frames. Absolutely true that Connette was highly effective in that role, but that was nine years ago. Since he left that same red zone approach has been pretty lousy, because Connette had a unique skill set ( he was incredibly patient at waiting for a hole, and was a tough runner). His successors possessed neither trait.

The post I responded to was talking about Boone, so that's the time frame I was talking about. In 2015 Sirk was a good power runner, and Daniel Jones had his moments, but was better running in space. I agree that Cut's ability to innovate waned over the years.

[HereBeforeCoachK]

What it beyond doubt is that the strategy was amazingly effective. We were literally the best team in the country in goal to go situations in 2013. .

And if I had made this comment in 2013, yours would be a valid retort. I didn't complain about this in 2013...but after 2013, everybody knew about it and it continued to deteriorate over the years...yet we kept doing it over and over.

Also, with Boone pretty much on fire all year, and a young man named Crowder at WR...other talent at RB and TE...the other names you mentioned, that offense was explosive from everywhere. There is no way to know if Duke needed the gimmicks down close or not to be a good red zone team.

That was a dad gummed good college offense all over the field in most games. They hung almost 700 yards on a Texas A and M team that was competitive with Bama, and 48 points...very close to hanging 59 on them...

The only thing that is beyond doubt is that this formation was used well past its sell by date.

[Dr. Maturin]

And if I had made this comment in 2013, yours would be a valid retort. I didn't complain about this in 2013...but after 2013, everybody knew about it and it continued to deteriorate over the years...yet we kept doing it over and over.

Also, with Boone pretty much on fire all year, and a young man named Crowder at WR...other talent at RB and TE...the other names you mentioned, that offense was explosive from everywhere. There is no way to know if Duke needed the gimmicks down close or not to be a good red zone team.

That was a dad gummed good college offense all over the field in most games. They hung almost 700 yards on a Texas A and M team that was competitive with Bama, and 48 points...very close to hanging 59 on them...

The only thing that is beyond doubt is that this formation was used well past its sell by date.

Your post mentioned Boone being taken out of games in the red zone, so that's the period I responded to. When Boone was the starting QB, Cut used Connette (2013) and Sirk (2014) as power rushers near the goal line, and it was highly successful. I don't recall Cut using a backup QB in these situations after 2014. We certainly used the QB in the running game near the goalline in the years since, and with less success than the Connette/Sirk years.

[BCCoordinators]

Eli Pancol stopped by to talk about the upcoming football season. If you take the time to listen, you'll learn a lot about his family history, his tattoos and how he spends his free time. Eli's a great guy. I hope you enjoy this interview. Let me know if you think he should become a recurring guest. I'd like to have him back on the pod a few more times.

https://anchor.fm/bullcitycoordinato...Pancol-e1h0lg6

https://bullcitycoordinators.com/202...ew-eli-pancol/

[sagegrouse]

All I do is refer to this quote:
Napoleon's famous aphorism, “in war the moral is to the physical as three is to one,” brings into focus the pivotal importance of troop morale, ...

Yeah, and last year the Duke team showed little interest in playing football, as in blocking and tackling, after the first few games. This year I know there will be a huge improvement.

[HereBeforeCoachK]

I know the failed trick plays stick out in the memory, but Cut's teams also ran some good ones. Off the top of my head:

- 2014 Sun Bowl. Needing a TD late in the 4th quarter, Duke pulls off a fake punt and then a WR pass (Jamison to Blakeney) to take the lead.
- 2018 @ Miami - Duke converts a RB jump pass at a key moment - this either gave us the lead or added to our lead late.
- 2019 @ VT - Jalon Calhoun throws a TD pass to help turn a lead into a blowout over the Hokies
- 2019 UVA - Down 2 scores in the 4th quarter, TJ Rahming throws a TD pass that gets Duke back in the game.

IIRC, three of those four were NOT in red zone situations...and the element of surprise worked in Duke's favor. Cut ran so many "trick plays" inside the ten that they became predictable....I am always for being unpredictable.

I would also say that with respects to the early years, when the gimmick formation did bring good results...that Duke's offense was very good period. When a team rolls down the field on one of those drives where everything is clicking...I am reticent to credit a gimmick formation with a TD that appears inevitable with the standard formation.

Of course we'll never know...but to my eye, it seemed like the switch to that formation was formulaic and automatic. I believe in using metrics to help in game decisions, but there was no basis in metrics for this one.

[jv001]

IIRC, three of those four were NOT in red zone situations...and the element of surprise worked in Duke's favor. Cut ran so many "trick plays" inside the ten that they became predictable...I am always for being unpredictable.

I would also say that with respects to the early years, when the gimmick formation did bring good results...that Duke's offense was very good period. When a team rolls down the field on one of those drives where everything is clicking...I am reticent to credit a gimmick formation with a TD that appears inevitable with the standard formation.

Of course we'll never know...but to my eye, it seemed like the switch to that formation was formulaic and automatic. I believe in using metrics to help in game decisions, but there was no basis in metrics for this one.

I think our entire offense became predictable. It was like Cut didn't think our opponents had a video of our offense. It became very hard to watch.

GoDuke!