2021-2022 PGA Tour Season

[CameronDuke]

K.H. Lee won the AT&T Byron Nelson for the 2nd consecutive year yesterday, shooting -26 to take the tournament. The 30-year old South Korean golfer shot -25 last year to win the tournament.

Are we doing the PGA Championship degenerate gambler’s pool this week folks? MKirsh?

[mkirsh]

The long awaited field for the first LIV golf event has been announced, with DJ being the biggest name player (and biggest surprise) in the field. A few months back he said he was committed to the PGA tour but seems to have reversed course. Buckle up, things are going to get very bumpy in professional golf.

[dudog84]

The long awaited field for the first LIV golf event has been announced, with DJ being the biggest name player (and biggest surprise) in the field. A few months back he said he was committed to the PGA tour but seems to have reversed course. Buckle up, things are going to get very bumpy in professional golf.

We'll see. The only top golfer who has fallen farther than DJ recently is DeChambeau (who has the excuse of being injured). That's using your metric (OWGR), mkirsh.

DJ is not the golfer he was a couple of years ago, he may get his mojo back, but some golfers never do. He was great in late 2020, winning the Tour Championship and the mis-timed Masters, but he has not won on the Tour since (though he did play well on the Ryder Cup).

[CameronDuke]

https://nypost.com/2022/06/01/extrem...ustin-johnson/

“RBC is a proud partner of the PGA Tour. Our partnership is anchored with two world-class golf tournaments—the RBC Heritage and the RBC Canadian Open,” the statement read. “The PGA Tour has been clear about its intentions in accordance with its tournament regulations should a golfer choose to play in a tournament outside the tour, including the LIV Golf Invitational Series. We were recently made aware that Dustin Johnson made the decision to play the LIV Golf Invitational Series opener. DJ has been a valued RBC team member since 2018. While we are extremely disappointed in his decision, we wish him well.”

By committing to next week’s LIV Tour event in London, DJ has made the decision not to play in the PGA Tour’s RBC Canadian Open, a tournament he won in 2018.

[75Crazie]

By committing to next week’s LIV Tour event in London, DJ has made the decision not to play in the PGA Tour’s RBC Canadian Open, a tournament he won in 2018.

I cannot come remotely close to guessing the process he used in coming to that decision, particularly since he was a spokesman for RBC.

[mkirsh]

I cannot come remotely close to guessing the process he used in coming to that decision, particularly since he was a spokesman for RBC.

RBC Canadian Open: ~$8m purse with ~135 players in the field with a cut

LIV London: $25m purse with 48 players in the field with no cut

All about the $$$ and loss of sponsorship likely will be more than offset the difference in winnings from LIV

[CameronDuke]

RBC Canadian Open: ~$8m purse with ~135 players in the field with a cut

LIV London: $25m purse with 48 players in the field with no cut

All about the $$$ and loss of sponsorship likely will be more than offset the difference in winnings from LIV

He has also been pretty irrelevant on the PGA Tour since winning the November 2020 Masters and 2020 Tour Championship a couple months before that.

Like you said, DJ sold out for the money - he is guaranteed more money there and the way he’s been playing on the PGA Tour, he wasn’t making that kind of money by winning many events lately.

This will hurt his legacy and it will be interesting to see what events the PGA Tour lets him play in going forward. Maybe he gets banned, maybe not. Jay Monahan does not like this Saudi backed league.

His father-in-law, the Great One Wayne Gretzky, is a Canuck too! He should play in the RBC Canadian Open simply because of that!

[mkirsh]

He has also been pretty irrelevant on the PGA Tour since winning the November 2020 Masters and 2020 Tour Championship a couple months before that.

Like you said, DJ sold out for the money - he is guaranteed more money there and the way he’s been playing on the PGA Tour, he wasn’t making that kind of money by winning many events lately.

This will hurt his legacy and it will be interesting to see what events the PGA Tour lets him play in going forward. Maybe he gets banned, maybe not. Jay Monahan does not like this Saudi backed league.

His father-in-law, the Great One Wayne Gretzky, is a Canuck too! He should play in the RBC Canadian Open simply because of that!

I find this whole thing fascinating. So many questions for the players and leagues to figure out. For me, if I was a PGA tour player, there are 3 key questions:

1) Do I believe LIV has staying power? The Saudi's are funding this, and have committed something like $2B, but there are no TV deals, no sponsors, no natural audience; ie no other revenue. Without that it's just Saudi expense. How long will they throw money at this before it either finds a revenue stream to make an ROI (which I think it will hard to generate that much more revenue than the current tour does to pay the purses they are offering), or they decide to spend $$ elsewhere? This is why jumping to this league makes sense to the older guys with less career left - Phil, Westwood, Poulter, Sergio, Kaymer, etc (Rory called it the "pre-senior tour"). If the league folds in 2 years for them who cares, they made $$ and they were going to be done anyway. That is why in some ways guys like Talor Gooch and Sam Horsfield are so surprising to see on this list - young up and comers who will have no where to play if this thing folds. DJ is somewhere in the middle, but probably doesn't care about golf that much it seems.

2) How does this fit in with Majors? I assume the 48 guys who signed up with LIV are ok skipping the RBC Open or the Dutch Open, but what happens to the Masters, PGA, US Open, Open Championship? Theoretically those are independent and LIV players can't be barred from them by the PGA Tour, but can the PGA tour prohibit the OWGR from allocating points to LIV events, making the majors difficult to reach for these players?

3) What happens to my endorsements? PGA players lament that they don't have multi-year guaranteed contracts like MLB, NBA, or NFL players, but they are walking billboards and can rent space on their hat, shirt collar, shirt sleeve, shirt front, bag, etc. But if LIV golf doesn't have any TV coverage, will RBC, Workday, Titleist, Nike, etc still want to pay those players? Particularly if they are already sponsors of the PGA and need to keep that relationship (a la RBC and DJ, KPMG and Phil)? As a player, how much of that fixed income would I be walking away from?

Ultimately, while there are big $$$ out there now, there may not be tremendous first mover advantages so current tour players can sit back and watch how this plays out before deciding to jump at a later date. It is really fascinating. I do wonder what viewership will be for the first event (I think it maybe be shown on youtube?)? Not sure I will watch but TBD for me personally.

[75Crazie]

RBC Canadian Open: ~$8m purse with ~135 players in the field with a cut

LIV London: $25m purse with 48 players in the field with no cut

All about the $$$ and loss of sponsorship likely will be more than offset the difference in winnings from LIV

I was trying to craft a response to this, but your own later post said things much better than I was able to articulate. Your points were all more or less in my mind when I was questioning wth DJ was thinking; I just don't think the long-term potential of the LIV is anywhere near what he would do staying with the PGA. And I guess that says I also don't agree with CameronDuke's assertion that DJ has been "irrelevant" (a term I despise when applied to sports participants or teams).

[mkirsh]

I was trying to craft a response to this, but your own later post said things much better than I was able to articulate. Your points were all more or less in my mind when I was questioning wth DJ was thinking; I just don't think the long-term potential of the LIV is anywhere near what he would do staying with the PGA. And I guess that says I also don't agree with CameronDuke's assertion that DJ has been "irrelevant" (a term I despise when applied to sports participants or teams).

Just saw this: they gave him a $125m offer. That is large

And that adds question #4 - what else will players need to do to participate? Appearances, sponsor events, etc? Some of the rumors are pretty crazy (letting fans celebrate with you, etc)

[CameronDuke]

I was trying to craft a response to this, but your own later post said things much better than I was able to articulate. Your points were all more or less in my mind when I was questioning wth DJ was thinking; I just don't think the long-term potential of the LIV is anywhere near what he would do staying with the PGA. And I guess that says I also don't agree with CameronDuke's assertion that DJ has been "irrelevant" (a term I despise when applied to sports participants or teams).

Does saying he hasn’t been much of a factor or he hasn’t been in the mix work better for you?

[dudog84]

Does saying he hasn’t been much of a factor or he hasn’t been in the mix work better for you?

How about fallen off a cliff?

At last year's Masters, DJ had over 11 OWGR points, 2 points ahead of the next golfer. Now he has 4.5699.

The money is good if you can look past what the golfers themselves say is a poor civil rights record. Not sure DJ has ever said anything about it though, he's not the most loquacious man on the tour.

Oh, and he better not take Paulina with him.

[75Crazie]

Does saying he hasn’t been much of a factor or he hasn’t been in the mix work better for you?

Much, yes, thank you. The term "irrelevant" hits my hot buttons regarding the "image is everything" culture.

[dudog84]

Well, Dustin Johnson has resigned from the PGA Tour. I guess over $75M in lifetime earnings wasn't enough.

He won't be on any more U.S. Ryder or Presidents Cup teams, and no one is sure how the majors are going to handle this. I'm also wondering what sponsors are going to do. These players must figure any loss of sponsorship money will be more than made up for by Saudi money.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/gol...5YQ?li=BBnb7Kz

[nmduke2001]

Well, Dustin Johnson has resigned from the PGA Tour. I guess over $75M in lifetime earnings wasn't enough.

He won't be on any more U.S. Ryder or Presidents Cup teams, and no one is sure how the majors are going to handle this. I'm also wondering what sponsors are going to do. These players must figure any loss of sponsorship money will be more than made up for by Saudi money.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/gol...5YQ?li=BBnb7Kz

I might be the biggest Mickelson fan out there, but even I think this is a terrible look. However, if you're looking just at money it's pretty dang incredible. DJ will receive $125 million just to play. Mickelson is rumored to be between $200 - $250 million just to play! The winner of each event will earn somewhere between $4 and $7 million and then there are bonuses and team prize money. For all of these guys, the next year will likely see them earning more money then they could in the PGA tour over the next several years and maybe by a large factor. In addition, 5 of the 8 events are being played in the US, 1 in Europe and the final 2 in Asia. That's not too hard of a schedule. I don't like it; I don't think I would do it; but the money is insane.

[CameronBornAndBred]

Well, Dustin Johnson has resigned from the PGA Tour. I guess over $75M in lifetime earnings wasn't enough.

He won't be on any more U.S. Ryder or Presidents Cup teams, and no one is sure how the majors are going to handle this. I'm also wondering what sponsors are going to do. These players must figure any loss of sponsorship money will be more than made up for by Saudi money.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/gol...5YQ?li=BBnb7Kz

I think a lot of this truly is about matters of principle. It's not like these guys are starving for cash. (Well, Phil excluded.)
It's about the PGA being so iron fisted, that it's rubbing many of these folks the wrong way, to the point that more than a few of them are now saying "Fine, eff you".
And it's not a battle that the PGA is going to win.

PS...the idea of the PGA taking the moral high ground is one bathed in irony.

[dudog84]

I think a lot of this truly is about matters of principle. It's not like these guys are starving for cash. (Well, Phil excluded.)
It's about the PGA being so iron fisted, that it's rubbing many of these folks the wrong way, to the point that more than a few of them are now saying "Fine, eff you".
And it's not a battle that the PGA is going to win.

PS...the idea of the PGA taking the moral high ground is one bathed in irony.

I'll admit I'm not up on how much or if the PGA abuses its players. But all sports leagues provide the forum for these guys to play. The PGA took decades and hundreds of players to get to where it is today. I believe the PGA does a lot for the locations (charities, etc.) where they play.

All of these people make too much money, on every side of the ball. I think Roberto Clemente might have made 10X what my dad made. It's out of hand, and now it's infecting college sports. But it's America, and everyone has a right to get what they can I suppose.

[cato]

I might be the biggest Mickelson fan out there, but even I think this is a terrible look. However, if you're looking just at money it's pretty dang incredible. DJ will receive $125 million just to play. Mickelson is rumored to be between $200 - $250 million just to play! The winner of each event will earn somewhere between $4 and $7 million and then there are bonuses and team prize money. For all of these guys, the next year will likely see them earning more money then they could in the PGA tour over the next several years and maybe by a large factor. In addition, 5 of the 8 events are being played in the US, 1 in Europe and the final 2 in Asia. That's not too hard of a schedule. I don't like it; I don't think I would do it; but the money is insane.

Steve Breen with a vivid take: https://www.sandiegouniontribune.com...ecent-cartoons

[CameronBornAndBred]

Drip drip drip

Patrick Reed, 2018 Masters champion, and Bryson DeChambeau, 2020 U.S. Open champion, will play on the LIV circuit, according to a new report in the Daily Telegraph. The report also indicated that Rickie Fowler is close to signing with LIV, as well.

https://www.yahoo.com/sports/report-...130120438.html

[SouthernDukie]

It appears Bryson DeChambeau and Patrick Reed are the latest to join the LIV tour. And now that it appears the 4 majors aren't going to prevent them from playing, I'm not sure but what there won't be even more jumping over if the money continues to flow.

https://sports.yahoo.com/report-brys...130120438.html


EDIT: Sorry, I see CameronB&B beat me to the punch on that bit of news.