Dukies on the 2022 PGA and LPGA Tours

[sagegrouse]

At the 3M tournament, Adam Long, playing the morning round on Friday, has moved into the top ten after eight holes, sitting at -4.

[dudog84]

Adam Long is in this week's 3M Tourney in Blair, Minn. Streelman and Smalley are not in the field. I expect a reappearance of them in the tour's last two events before the playoffs (Rocket Mortgage and Wyndham). In the Barracuda tourney wrapping up yesterday Julian Suri finished T26 thanks to a good Stableford Sunday finish of +13 (Tourney total +23, $27,565).

Smalley and Streelman are indeed playing in Detroit next week. It's the following week, Smalley playing in his hometown of Greensboro, that I'm looking forward to. I always get ahead of myself.

[Bob Green]

Adam Long is T14 at -4 headed into the weekend. He tees off #1 at 09:18 EDT.

[dudog84]

Adam Long is T14 at -4 headed into the weekend. He tees off #1 at 09:18 EDT.

Golfers went off early in threesomes, front and back, due to expected bad weather. And play has already been suspended, probably for the day.

Though I suppose they could get in some holes late. I think it stays light pretty late up there in the summer in Minnesota.

[sagegrouse]

Golfers went off early in threesomes due to expected bad weather. And play has already been suspended, probably for the day.

Though I suppose they could get in some holes late. I think it stays light pretty late up there in the summer in Minnesota.

Adam Long, -2 for the day and T-15 through nine holes, has a birdie putt on #10 of 7'9" when play resumes.

[Bob Green]

Adam Long, -2 for the day and T-15 through nine holes, has a birdie putt on #10 of 7'9" when play resumes.

Adam Long made that birdie putt. He shot a -4 (67) to improve to -8 for the tournament and is T13 heading into today’s final round. He tees off at 11:51 EDT.

Video clip: https://www.pgatour.com/video/2022/0...t-3m-open.html

[seacap29]

Kevin Streelman and Alex Smalley are in this week's field in the Rocket Mortgage Classic in Detroit. Adam Long finished T16 ($103,313.) at the 3M. He is not entered this week.

[CrazieDUMB]

Kevin Streelman and Alex Smalley are in this week's field in the Rocket Mortgage Classic in Detroit. Adam Long finished T16 ($103,313.) at the 3M. He is not entered this week.

I don't know anything about golf, but $100k sounds pretty good for a weekend's work! Do these guys have to pay their own way to the tournaments or is that covered? Does he have to split that with a caddy? Just curious as to how much he gets to keep.

[duke79]

I don't know anything about golf, but $100k sounds pretty good for a weekend's work! Do these guys have to pay their own way to the tournaments or is that covered? Does he have to split that with a caddy? Just curious as to how much he gets to keep.

The professional golfers are, essentially, independent contractors. They have to pay all of their costs - transportation, hotels, meals, etc. - for each of the tournaments that they play in. The caddies typically get some sort of "base salary" plus usually a percentage of their golfer's winnings but my understanding is the arrangement between pro golfer and the caddy can vary from golfer/caddy to golfer/caddy. So, if a pro golfer misses a cut in a tournament, he gets paid nothing but still has to pay for all of his expenses for that week plus the caddy's salary. For many pro golfers (and I'm not talking Tiger Woods or Dustin Johnson here), it can be a stressful financial arrangement, if they are not playing well and not making money in every tournament that they play in. Plus, they have to pay federal and state income taxes on their net earnings. The reality is that most pro golfers take home much less that what they win in prize money. I'm sure it's one reason why the LIV has been modestly successful in signing up quite a few pro golfers to their tour (especially the so-called journymen pros or those past their prime) with substantial guaranteed up-front contracts and guaranteed payouts (no cuts) for their tournaments.

[CrazyNotCrazie]

The professional golfers are, essentially, independent contractors. They have to pay all of their costs - transportation, hotels, meals, etc. - for each of the tournaments that they play in. The caddies typically get some sort of "base salary" plus usually a percentage of their golfer's winnings but my understanding is the arrangement between pro golfer and the caddy can vary from golfer/caddy to golfer/caddy. So, if a pro golfer misses a cut in a tournament, he gets paid nothing but still has to pay for all of his expenses for that week plus the caddy's salary. For many pro golfers (and I'm not talking Tiger Woods or Dustin Johnson here), it can be a stressful financial arrangement, if they are not playing well and not making money in every tournament that they play in. Plus, they have to pay federal and state income taxes on their net earnings. The reality is that most pro golfers take home much less that what they win in prize money. I'm sure it's one reason why the LIV has been modestly successful in signing up quite a few pro golfers to their tour (especially the so-called journymen pros or those past their prime) with substantial guaranteed up-front contracts and guaranteed payouts (no cuts) for their tournaments.

All 100% correct based on my understanding. Though sponsorships should factor in - anyone on the PGA tour has some sponsorship deal, with the sponsor hoping that perhaps they will get paired with Tiger or someone similar and be very visible. I had an acquaintance who was on tour for two non-consecutive years and made very little but for every tournament he played in, his ball sponsor, his club sponsor, etc. gave him something. To your point, it likely wasn't enough to fully cover expenses, but helped. If I recall, he would often use local caddies rather than paying for someone to travel with him.

[sagegrouse]

Expenses on the PGA Tour for a year? I have read $500K. Sponsors will help foot the bill, but I don't know what Titleist, Callaway, TaylorMade, etc. will pay for a newcomer.

[dudog84]

Adam Long has made over $1.3M this year without a top-10 finish. That covers a few missed cuts. I would happily switch financial profiles with him.

[seacap29]

It would be well to remember these PGA golfers are at the very top of their profession. Millions and millions of golfers around the world and these guys are the best.

[rsvman]

All 100% correct based on my understanding. Though sponsorships should factor in - anyone on the PGA tour has some sponsorship deal, with the sponsor hoping that perhaps they will get paired with Tiger or someone similar and be very visible. I had an acquaintance who was on tour for two non-consecutive years and made very little but for every tournament he played in, his ball sponsor, his club sponsor, etc. gave him something. To your point, it likely wasn't enough to fully cover expenses, but helped. If I recall, he would often use local caddies rather than paying for someone to travel with him.

I don't think it is true that 100% of pro golfers have commercial sponsors, and even if they do, the amount of money they make from said sponsorship is commensurate with the amount of coverage they are likely to get; in other words, if they are not in the top 100 players in the world, their sponsorship money can be pretty meager.

I know there are venture capitalists who invest in new players turning pro from college or from a lesser tour. They can set up whatever kind of deal they want, and deals can vary quite a bit, but for example, a venture capitalist might agree to pay 80% of the player's expenses in exchange for 40% of his earnings (making up the numbers; I'm sure they vary a lot).

Caddies can also have a variety of deals, but for many years the typical deal was 10% of the player's winnings. They may also be salaried atop that, but if the player is missing cuts, where is that money coming from?


Look for the PGA tour to begin offering guaranteed money very soon, in response to the LIV tour. Being a grinder on the PGA tour can be very trying; travel to the location of the tournament, rent a car, get a hotel, go to the venue to play practice rounds and get a feel for the course and the greens, etc., then play Thursday and Friday and perhaps miss the cut by a shot. Said shot could have been a 4-foot putt on the third hole on Thursday morning. Get paid nothing, and start setting up your travel for next week's tournament.

There are certainly people doing very well playing professional golf, but not all card-carrying PGA tour pros are actually making a lot of money.

[OZZIE4DUKE]

Times and the money involved have certainly changed about 100,000% since the 1980's, but back then young wannabe pros had local sponsors to foot their bills. I'm specifically referring to a local touring pro from xxxxxxxxxx, NC. Local business men, all members of the local country club, paid his expenses so he could play on the development tour for part of a year and then the PGA. He did well enough early to eventually not need those sponsorships, and he did get small deals from folks like Lance Crackers and the various equipment companies. He got paid for each second he was on TV. Unfortunately, those moments were few and far between if he wasn't among the leaders - players and fans loved him (he was funny and vocal) but he cussed too often on open mic's for the networks and broke one too many mics (with his driver) next to the tees. He did win one PGA tour event and blew it on the 72nd hole of what should of been his second win.

Some of his friends from the local club often caddied for him. He paid them the going rate and expenses, including a percentage of his winnings if he made the cut.

He would have been a great candidate for the LIV tour.

[jv001]

Times and the money involved have certainly changed about 100,000% since the 1980's, but back then young wannabe pros had local sponsors to foot their bills. I'm specifically referring to a local touring pro from xxxxxxxxxx, NC. Local business men, all members of the local country club, paid his expenses so he could play on the development tour for part of a year and then the PGA. He did well enough early to eventually not need those sponsorships, and he did get small deals from folks like Lance Crackers and the various equipment companies. He got paid for each second he was on TV. Unfortunately, those moments were few and far between if he wasn't among the leaders - players and fans loved him (he was funny and vocal) but he cussed too often on open mic's for the networks and broke one too many mics (with his driver) next to the tees. He did win one PGA tour event and blew it on the 72nd hole of what should of been his second win.

Some of his friends from the local club often caddied for him. He paid them the going rate and expenses, including a percentage of his winnings if he made the cut.

He would have been a great candidate for the LIV tour.

Sounds like Sedgefield CC to me. But it might have been one other Greensboro Golf Club but I would still say it's the former.

[dudog84]

Smalley and Streelman get the bad Thursday afternoon draw, when it looks like winds will be almost 10 mph higher than in the morning.

[OZZIE4DUKE]

Sounds like Sedgefield CC to me. But it might have been one other Greensboro Golf Club but I would still say it's the former.

No, it was the Country Club of Johnston County. I was a member there for 33 years. Now I’m a member at Starmount Forest CC in Greensboro, the original home
of the GGO, aka the Greater Greensboro Open, aka the pop top open because of the free flowing beer cans.

The tournament is now known as the Wyndham Championship and is played at Sedgefield. Next
week!

[dudog84]

I think this is sorta a big week for Alex. Three weeks ago he was in the mix at The Scottish Open, and while he played very well, if he had made just one short putt he would have qualified for the The Open at St. Andrews. I want him to bounce back with at least a top-20 this week.

And I'll say this now: Alex Smalley will be the best men's golfer ever produced by Duke. Maybe best golfer period.

The best thing about this prediction is that it will probably take at least 20 years to prove me wrong.

[dudog84]

After a solid 2-under on the front, Alex having a terrible back nine. Currently well outside the cut, but a few holes left and tomorrow's another day.