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  1. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by JasonEvans View Post
    Color me utterly confused by all the Franz Wagner love that is out there. His big brother is a NBA journeyman who was on three different teams this past season. I get that their games are different (Mo is a big man while Franz is a wing) but Mo was a better college player than Franz. What is it about Franz and his 12.5ppg at Michigan that makes folks think he is a worth a lottery pick?
    It's not about the points per game with Wagner. This is a guy who is hands down the best off-ball defender in the draft. He has tremendous defensive instincts and anticipation, and is very smart in how he sees the floor. He's good on the ball too, very disruptive. He's got excellent size for his position. Passes the ball extremely well. Unselfish. I don't love his shot mechanics but he does manage to hit a decent percentage. I think he can improve his shooting/scoring going forward. He's a guy who, even if he isn't a plus scorer, helps you win basketball games.

  2. #42
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
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    Seattle, WA
    With the #18 pick in the Mock NBA Draft, the OKC Thunder select:
    Kai Jones, F/C, Texas

    Upside, upside, upside is the name of the game with our picks, and Kai Jones puts the up in upside. He's got serious rim-running talent and we hope can immediately hop into the pick-and-roll game with SGA. He's also shown flashes of being able to hit the outside shot. And he profiles as a plus defender, both on the ball and in help scenarios, with long arms to deter scoring at the rim.

    With Kuminga, Johnson, and Jones, we have a guard, wing, and big who all have tantalizing potential but who all need time to develop. If any of them pops, they'll have long-term value that exceeds the slot where we drafted them, but they also could each be solid contributors in their roles even if they don't grow into stars. We like this strategy for a team with draft picks to burn and no realistic prospect of competing next year.
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  3. #43
    scottdude8's Avatar
    scottdude8 is online now Moderator, Contributor, Zoubek disciple, and resident Wolverine
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    Quote Originally Posted by JasonEvans View Post
    Color me utterly confused by all the Franz Wagner love that is out there. His big brother is a NBA journeyman who was on three different teams this past season. I get that their games are different (Mo is a big man while Franz is a wing) but Mo was a better college player than Franz. What is it about Franz and his 12.5ppg at Michigan that makes folks think he is a worth a lottery pick?
    I also think him being a high lottery pick is a bit high, but Franz' game is ideally suited to being a high-level "3 and D" man at this level. He's a plus-plus defender able to guard most wings, and potentially some 1s and 4s, and is also showcased excellent passing abilities at Michigan. His shot was inconsistent, but if in reality he's an ~40% 3 point shooter (not a ~30% one), his ceiling is the ideal complementary starter alongside ball-dependent scorers.

    As to the stats, it's also worth recognizing that Mo was the go-to guy his junior year, while Franz was the tertiary option while Livers was in the lineup and the secondary one behind Dickinson when Livers was out. So the pure statistical comparison probably isn't one-to-one.

    TL;DR: I think Franz is DEFINITELY a first round pick, possibly a late lottery pick. Top 10 seems to high to me too, but that seems to be the buzz as to where he'll go.
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  4. #44
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    Feb 2013
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    Cambridge, MA
    Quote Originally Posted by roywhite View Post
    And everybody knows there is not much talent around by pick #41

    2021 MVP Nikola Jokic was taken with the 41st pick in the Second Round of the 2014 draft
    Fun fact from the this-has-to-be-a-complete-coincidence desk ...

    ... Tre Jones, Chris Carrawell, and Erik Meek were also selected with the 41st pick in the NBA draft.

    FWIW, Carrawell and Meek are the two most recent guys picked 41 who never played a single NBA game.

  5. #45
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
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    New Orleans, Louisiana
    Several trains of thought as we await word from accfanfrom1970 in Alaska:

    Quote Originally Posted by Billy Dat View Post
    With the 12th pick in the mock-draft, the San Antonio Spurs select everybody's All American, Luka Garza of Iowa.
    Quote Originally Posted by Truth&Justise View Post
    The Spurs also have pick #41, and I'd be surprised if Garza goes in the real draft before then. Taking him at 12 is certainly...unorthodox, as you indicate.
    Billy Dat went with his gut, and I respect that. Luka Garza may not be highly rated (#78 on the NBADraft.net Big Board, behind DJ Steward, ahead of Matthew Hurt), but he's a known quantity to DBR and I suspect someone would have picked him in this mock draft before #41.

    Quote Originally Posted by roywhite View Post
    2021 MVP Nikola Jokic was taken with the 41st pick in the Second Round of the 2014 draft
    Quote Originally Posted by phaedrus View Post
    But where was he picked in the DBR mock draft?
    He went #51 in the 2014 DBR Mock Draft. Right after James Michael McAdoo.

    Quote Originally Posted by FerryFor50 View Post
    With the lucky 13th pick of the NBA draft, the Indiana Pacers tests their luck and drafts Jalen Johnson, Duke.
    Jalen Johnson fit that SG/SF mold that I wanted for the Pelicans at #10, but I treated him as an afterthought because I was unwilling to invest even mock franchise money on him. Real GMs with real money may also hesitate. He's a big risk in the Top 10, and an arguable steal after #20. His draft value likely falls somewhere in between, but keep in mind that this draft class has a lot of potential first rounders that fit that SG/SF mold, and almost all of them played more than Jalen Johnson last year.

    More players will be added, but from this green room list, I could see Jalen Johnson waiting with Josh Giddey and Corey Kispert to see who gets picked last.

    Jonathan Givony @DraftExpress

    Source: 15 players have received invites to the NBA Draft green room so far

    Cade Cunningham
    Jalen Green
    Evan Mobley
    Jalen Suggs
    Jonathan Kuminga
    Scottie Barnes
    Davion Mitchell
    James Bouknight
    Keon Johnson
    Franz Wagner
    Josh Giddey
    Jalen Johnson
    Corey Kispert
    Moses Moody
    Kai Jones

    2:39 PM · Jul 16, 2021

    This mock draft already has 3 names not on this list (Alperen Sengun, Ziaire Williams, Luka Garza) that were picked before Jalen Johnson. Then there's Sharife Cooper, Chris Duarte, Jared Butler, and others that are projected in the 20s but might get selected earlier. I just don't know what teams feel passionately about drafting Jalen Johnson, and his fate should be one of the more interesting storylines of draft night.

  6. #46
    The New York Knicks would love to package their two first round picks, and the 32nd and move up. Don’t see that happening and certainly not happening here. So they take - Chris Duarte, wing from Oregon.

    “Chris Duarte was one of the best spot-up shooters in the country this year, averaging 17.1 points per game. Of his 301 field-goal attempts this year, nearly half (144) came from beyond the arc. The 6-foot-6 guard/forward deserved the green light, given he shot 42.4% behind the line.”

    More to follow after the 2nd first round pick.

  7. #47
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
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    Marietta, Georgia
    Quote Originally Posted by brevity View Post

    This mock draft already has 3 names not on this list (Alperen Sengun, Ziaire Williams, Luka Garza) that were picked before Jalen Johnson. Then there's Sharife Cooper, Chris Duarte, Jared Butler, and others that are projected in the 20s but might get selected earlier. I just don't know what teams feel passionately about drafting Jalen Johnson, and his fate should be one of the more interesting storylines of draft night.
    Just a quirky trivia note for y'all: Sharife Omar Cooper has a twin brother,Omar Sharife Cooper.

  8. #48
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
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    Hot'Lanta... home of the Falcons!

    Atlanta Hawks pick

    The Hawks have magically transformed from a team with a future into a team with a present. Their run to the Eastern Conference Finals completely reshapes their priorities in the draft because they no longer need to focus on finding youngsters who can develop, instead they want someone who can maybe help right away.

    In terms of team need, so much depends on what happens with John Collins. If the Hawks re-sign him then they are pretty well set in their 2-deep at every position except PG. Lou Williams is aging and even if they bring him back, finding a backup PG with the 20th pick in this draft seems like the most logical positional draft pick. So, I strongly considered Jared Butler and Miles McBride with this pick.

    But then something happened that made me toss the positional need and the readiness factor out the window... Josh Giddy slipped. So, with the 20th pick in the draft, the Atlanta Hawks select Josh Giddy, wing from Australia.

    Giddy may be the best passer in the draft. He is crafty with his passing, finding angles that other guys simply do not see. He is not a great shooter, but I am selecting him for his ability to create offense for the other guys on the second unit, something the Hawks sorely need when Trae Young is not in the game. Giddy has long arms, which will help with his defense, and he is a strong rebounder (better than 7 rebounds per game in the Aussie pro league). Giddy is also super young, just 18 years old. Most draft experts expect him to go off the board late in the lottery or in the mid-teens at the latest. For him to still be here at #20... well, I just could not pass that up.
    Why are you wasting time here when you could be wasting it by listening to the latest episode of the DBR Podcast?

  9. #49
    Their first pick was for help in the backcourt, with their second pick the Knicks look for help in the front court. So the Knicks take forward/center prospect Usman Garuba.

    “Despite being just 19, Garuba has been a part of Real Madrid for 3 seasons now. Garuba is 6’8 with a massive 7’3 wingspan and he uses that reach when scrapping down low. Garuba has both length and a wide frame, his high-energy rebounding should translate into the NBA.

    Garuba’s energy shows up in his speed as well. He’s going to run up and down the court with conviction – something Coach T will love. Now while he never may amount to a big scorer (No real jump shot or touch away from the basket) Garuba has some chops passing the ball. He makes nice reads off of some basic 2-3 dribble moves and could be an underrated cog of an NBA offense one day.

    His potential on defense is intriguing. Garuba already has nice technique and strength as a post defender, and it’s easy to see it continuing to develop. There is serious potential here for Garuba to be able to even defend perimeter players.”
    Last edited by JasonEvans; 07-20-2021 at 08:54 AM.

  10. #50
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Hot'Lanta... home of the Falcons!
    As an update, here is where we stand:

    2021 FIRST ROUND
    1. Detroit - scottdude8 - Cade Cunningham, Guard, Oklahoma State
    2. Houston - kAzE - Evan Mobley, Center, USC
    3. Cleveland - House P - Jalen Green, Guard, G-League
    4. Toronto - scottdude8 - Jalen Suggs, Guard, Gonzaga
    5. Orlando - roywhite - Scottie Barnes, Guard, Florida State
    6. Oklahoma City - pfrduke - Jonathan Kuminga, F, G League Ignite
    7. Golden State - jacone21 - Davion Mitchell, G, Baylor
    8. Orlando - roywhite - Alperen Sengun, PF/C, Turkey
    9. Sacramento - flyingdutchdevil - Ziaire Williams, F, Stanford
    10. New Orleans - brevity - Moses Moody, SG, Arkansas
    11. Charlotte - JasonEvans - Corey Kispert, SF, Gonzaga
    12. San Antonio - Billy Dat - Luka Garza, C, Iowa.
    13. Indiana - FerryFor50 - Jalen Johnson, F, Duke
    14. Golden State - jacone21 - Franz Wagner, G, Michigan
    15. Washington - Truth&Justise - James Bouknight, G, UConn
    16. Oklahoma City - pfrduke - Keon Johnson, G, Tennessee
    17. Memphis - powellhill1981 - Ayo Dosunmu, G, Illinois
    18. Oklahoma City - pfrduke - Kai Jones, F/C, Texas
    19. New York - accfanfrom1970 - Chris Duarte, G/F, Oregon
    20. Atlanta - JasonEvans - Josh Giddy, G/F, Australia
    21. New York - accfanfrom1970 - Usman Garuba, F, Spain
    22. Los Angeles Lakers - theschwartz - Jared Butler, G, Balor
    23. Houston - kAzE
    24. Houston - kAzE
    25. LA Clippers - Kdogg
    26. Denver - MrPoon
    27. Brooklyn - Billy Dat
    28. Philadelphia - Gooch
    29. Phoenix - roywhite
    30. Utah - coldriver10
    Last edited by JasonEvans; 07-20-2021 at 02:26 PM.
    Why are you wasting time here when you could be wasting it by listening to the latest episode of the DBR Podcast?

  11. #51
    Quote Originally Posted by Daddylawman View Post
    Just a quirky trivia note for y'all: Sharife Omar Cooper has a twin brother,Omar Sharife Cooper.
    I heard the parents were confused with the sudden appearance of the second child.

  12. #52
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Mount Kisco, NY
    Quote Originally Posted by accfanfrom1970 View Post
    Their first pick was for help in the backcourt, with their second pick the Knicks look for help in the front court. So the Knicks take forward/center prospect Usman Garuba.

    “Despite being just 19, Garuba has been a part of Real Madrid for 3 seasons now. Garuba is 6’8 with a massive 7’3 wingspan and he uses that reach when scrapping down low. Garuba has both length and a wide frame, his high-energy rebounding should translate into the NBA.

    Garuba’s energy shows up in his speed as well. He’s going to run up and down the court with conviction – something Coach T will love. Now while he never may amount to a big scorer (No real jump shot or touch away from the basket) Garuba has some chops passing the ball. He makes nice reads off of some basic 2-3 dribble moves and could be an underrated cog of an NBA offense one day.

    His potential on defense is intriguing. Garuba already has nice technique and strength as a post defender, and it’s easy to see it continuing to develop. There is serious potential here for Garuba to be able to even defend perimeter players.”
    I watched Garuba play against Team USA on Sunday night in the final Olympic tune-up. While he didn't shine, he looked like he belonged out there, which is saying something for a teenager.

  13. #53
    Quote Originally Posted by Billy Dat View Post
    I watched Garuba play against Team USA on Sunday night in the final Olympic tune-up. While he didn't shine, he looked like he belonged out there, which is saying something for a teenager.
    Garuba was the guy Denver (me) was hoping slipped a few more spots. Would have been a steal in mid 20s. New York will probably screw it up and we can trade a few flat balls and a second round pick in 2072 for him in another year.
    The ceiling is the roof

  14. #54
    Are the Lakers going to pick?

    It doesn’t appear that theschwartz is with us.
    Sorry but these jokes just write themselves.
    The ceiling is the roof

  15. #55
    Sorry for the delay with the Knicks picks. I really didn’t consider the time difference being in Alaska this week, and doing the draft.

    To follow up, the Knicks were hoping Kai Jones would have fallen one more slot and at 19 would have ran to the commissioner with that pick. After that went to getting a shooter as their biggest need. Probably could have taken Giddy and hoped Atlanta would have skipped Duarte, but really wanted shooting -

    “ Duarte is one of the top shooters in the draft, and a capable defender and ball-mover, with a mature style of play befitting his advanced age. While he struggles a bit to separate and create his own shot and isn’t supremely athletic, he’s smart and consistent enough to stick in the league a long time, particularly considering the premium placed on his skill set.”

    After Giddy went then it was front court help given the uncertainty around Noel and Robinson. Knowing Thibodeau’s defensive mindset we went with Garuba -

    “On the flipside, his biggest appeals so far while playing for Real Madrid have been his team defense, overall consistency, and lack of mental lapses.” At 19 he can develop offensively while providing D early on.
    Last edited by accfanfrom1970; 07-20-2021 at 01:27 PM.

  16. #56

    Lakers with the #22 pick

    Sorry for the delay. We West Coasters like to sleep in. :-)

    Although this past season ended somewhat ignominiously for the Lakers, they are still just 9 months removed from winning the 2019-2020 title. While the still-reigning champs face more questions than answers this offseason, if we could trade our draft pick for a healthy Lebron and AD next year, we would do so in a heartbeat. A longer offseason this year should help, but with only 6 players under contract for a whopping $110 million—including the $5 million they’re paying Luol Deng to not play for them this coming season—there’s a lot of work to do. There's some big decisions to make with their free agents, including Dennis Schroder (who'll likely be asking for top dollar as a free agent), Markieff Morris, Talen Horton-Tucker, Alex Caruso, and Andre Drummond, not to mention Montrezl Harrell has a player option.

    The Lakers window for contention is slowly closing. Lebron is 36 and although he’s expressed his desire to finish his career with the Lakers, who knows how long that will be? So the Lakers know they have only so many years to build a contending team around Lebron. Late-round draft picks aren’t the recipe for making that happen, despite the Lakers historical success in finding late-round draft gems (Kyle Kuzma was the #27 pick in 2017, THT was the #46 pick in 2019). In a perfect world, the Lakers would package 2 or 3 of their players currently under contract (Kentavious Caldwell-Pope, Kuzma, maybe Harrell if he opts in), along with the #22 pick, for an established point guard. Lillard is a pipe dream, but guys like Kemba Walker or Lonzo Ball would be nice options. Hey, anyone else remember a couple summers ago when the Lakers viewed Lonzo and BI as expendable but Kuzma was untouchable? Yeah, good times.

    So if we assume that the Lakers aren’t able to pull off the trade, they’re looking for win-now prospects who can make an immediate difference. And if we assume that they’re not going to bring back Schroder for his supposed asking price of $20-25 million, their biggest need this offseason will be a point guard. In that vein, the Lakers will continue their success in the draft, as they select the ultimate win-now point guard, Jared Butler of the NCAA Champion Baylor Bears. The emotional leader of the national champs, Butler is still fairly young, not turning 21 until after the draft. He’s an efficient player on offense who can score all over the floor and create for his teammates. He’s also a tenacious defender who’ll chase shooters around screens and get into passing lanes. Most importantly, he’s a high-character guy whose championship attitude will fit nicely with the Lakers. We also took a long look at Sharife Cooper and Tre Mann at this spot. Would have loved to pick Ayo Dosunmu if he were still around.

  17. #57
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Hot'Lanta... home of the Falcons!
    Quote Originally Posted by theschwartz View Post
    So if we assume that the Lakers aren’t able to pull off the trade, they’re looking for win-now prospects who can make an immediate difference. And if we assume that they’re not going to bring back Schroder for his supposed asking price of $20-25 million, their biggest need this offseason will be a point guard. In that vein, the Lakers will continue their success in the draft, as they select the ultimate win-now point guard, Jared Butler of the NCAA Champion Baylor Bears. The emotional leader of the national champs, Butler is still fairly young, not turning 21 until after the draft. He’s an efficient player on offense who can score all over the floor and create for his teammates. He’s also a tenacious defender who’ll chase shooters around screens and get into passing lanes. Most importantly, he’s a high-character guy whose championship attitude will fit nicely with the Lakers. We also took a long look at Sharife Cooper and Tre Mann at this spot. Would have loved to pick Ayo Dosunmu if he were still around.
    Assuming his health issues are behind him, this is a great pick. I love winners and Butler is a winner.
    Why are you wasting time here when you could be wasting it by listening to the latest episode of the DBR Podcast?

  18. #58
    Quote Originally Posted by theschwartz View Post
    Sorry for the delay. We West Coasters like to sleep in. :-)

    Although this past season ended somewhat ignominiously for the Lakers, they are still just 9 months removed from winning the 2019-2020 title. While the still-reigning champs face more questions than answers this offseason, if we could trade our draft pick for a healthy Lebron and AD next year, we would do so in a heartbeat. A longer offseason this year should help, but with only 6 players under contract for a whopping $110 million—including the $5 million they’re paying Luol Deng to not play for them this coming season—there’s a lot of work to do. There's some big decisions to make with their free agents, including Dennis Schroder (who'll likely be asking for top dollar as a free agent), Markieff Morris, Talen Horton-Tucker, Alex Caruso, and Andre Drummond, not to mention Montrezl Harrell has a player option.

    The Lakers window for contention is slowly closing. Lebron is 36 and although he’s expressed his desire to finish his career with the Lakers, who knows how long that will be? So the Lakers know they have only so many years to build a contending team around Lebron. Late-round draft picks aren’t the recipe for making that happen, despite the Lakers historical success in finding late-round draft gems (Kyle Kuzma was the #27 pick in 2017, THT was the #46 pick in 2019). In a perfect world, the Lakers would package 2 or 3 of their players currently under contract (Kentavious Caldwell-Pope, Kuzma, maybe Harrell if he opts in), along with the #22 pick, for an established point guard. Lillard is a pipe dream, but guys like Kemba Walker or Lonzo Ball would be nice options. Hey, anyone else remember a couple summers ago when the Lakers viewed Lonzo and BI as expendable but Kuzma was untouchable? Yeah, good times.

    So if we assume that the Lakers aren’t able to pull off the trade, they’re looking for win-now prospects who can make an immediate difference. And if we assume that they’re not going to bring back Schroder for his supposed asking price of $20-25 million, their biggest need this offseason will be a point guard. In that vein, the Lakers will continue their success in the draft, as they select the ultimate win-now point guard, Jared Butler of the NCAA Champion Baylor Bears. The emotional leader of the national champs, Butler is still fairly young, not turning 21 until after the draft. He’s an efficient player on offense who can score all over the floor and create for his teammates. He’s also a tenacious defender who’ll chase shooters around screens and get into passing lanes. Most importantly, he’s a high-character guy whose championship attitude will fit nicely with the Lakers. We also took a long look at Sharife Cooper and Tre Mann at this spot. Would have loved to pick Ayo Dosunmu if he were still around.
    You just poached my pick for the Clippers. I

  19. #59
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Location
    Dallas, TX

    #23. Houston Rockets select PG Sharife Cooper

    With just 1 player guaranteed through the 2023-24 season, the Rockets are wide open in terms of who positional need.

    The players I feel comfortable about re-signing at a cap-friendly rate are Jae'Sean Tate and Evan Mobley. Martin is under team control for very cheap for the next 3 years. Everyone else is expendable, including Christian Wood and Kevin Porter Jr., depending on their asking price for extensions.

    The team owes John Wall over $90 million for the next 2 years, and will most likely be resting him large stretches of the regular season (if not outright buying out his huge contract) as they tank away for the next 2-3 years, so I will draft the best point guard available at #23: Sharife Cooper from Auburn University

    Coper is a pure point guard with a great feel for spacing, for setting up teammates and for taking over the game when needed. He has elite quickness, ball handling skills, and passing vision. He is arguably the best passer in the 2021 draft, and should have no problems orchestrating efficient offense in the NBA. He averaged 20.3 points and 8.1 assists in just 33 minutes per game in college.

    Standing just 6'1", he will have some defensive issues until he can get much stronger. He will also need to improve his perimeter shooting to stay in the league long term. However, he does have a fantastic mid range game, with very nice touch on his floater, and as a pass-first pick and roll ball handler, he should be quite deadly as both a scorer and facilitator. Surprisingly, Cooper averaged an incredible 10.3 free throw attempts for 40 minutes in college, which makes a Trae Young comparison somewhat passable, minus the insane shooting range.

    With John Wall not part of the long term plans, and a desire to be terrible for the next 2 years, I'm happy to take a fantastic offensive PG who will likely have some defensive issues, and let him learn on the job to see if there's anything there worth singing long term.

  20. #60
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Location
    Dallas, TX

    #24. Houston Rockets select G/F Trey Murphy

    I've drafted a big, and a PG, so I'll round things out for Houston's last pick in this mock draft by taking the best wing left on the board: Trey Murphy, SF out of the University of Virginia.

    Murphy is basically what you would build in a lab if you wanted to create the perfect 3-and-D wing role player. Standing 6'9", with a 7'0" wingspan, Murphy recorded shooting splits of 50.3% FG, 43.3% 3FG, and 92.7% FT in his 1 season at UVA after playing 2 years at Rice. He is the type of player who has to potential to fit any lineup, playing with anyone. I don't think there's a safer pick in the draft outside of the lottery.

    Murphy has tremendous versatility on defense, and can conceivably guard 1-4 at a high level. His lateral quickness is excellent, and he recovers extremely well on help defense. In college, he held his opponents to just 32.8% shooting when he was the primary defender. He is great defending pick and roll guarding the screener or the ball handler.

    On offense, he is obviously a knockdown shooter, who cannot be left unguarded. As a cutter, he shot 82.6%, for an impressive 1.73 points per possession, #1 of any player in the draft with at least 25 cutting possessions. He's an elite off ball scorer, who can knock down shots, or attack the closeout and finish at an elite level. He was not utilized nearly enough in UVA's ultra slow offense.

    The one area where Murphy is still developing is his ability to create his own shot off the dribble, but that's no problem at all. You always need guys who don't need the ball in their hands to be effective, so that your superstars can run the show. Murphy contributes on both ends without ever needing to take a single dribble.

    I'll be honest, if I only had 1 pick in this range, I would have taken Trey Murphy over Sharife Cooper, but I won't be telling their mock agents that when we're doing mock contract negotiations.

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