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  1. #81
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Raleigh, NC
    Quote Originally Posted by Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15 View Post
    Isn't it possible that he wasn't under the influence, speeding, or looking at his phone, but merely driving a car he was unfamiliar with?
    Yes, I didn't mean to imply that those were the only possibilities (thus the "or whatever" after those 3). I was just pointing out that IF it was an issue like that (and I have no idea and I'm not implying that it was) then I wouldn't mind if they just let the legalities slide (again, those injuries would be punishment enough). My main point was that the curiosity is understandable giving the information at hand. I did not mean to be insensitive in any way and I really hope he has a good recovery (and I'm a guy that roots against him when he's golfing).

  2. #82
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Skinker-DeBaliviere, Saint Louis
    Also, probably not Tiger this week, but plenty of people are hammered drunk at 7am.

  3. #83
    Quote Originally Posted by throatybeard View Post
    Also, probably not Tiger this week, but plenty of people are hammered drunk at 7am.
    Indeed. Quite a few deaths on the road at 7am caused by drunk people passing out or otherwise losing control of their cars during a morning commute. If you go to bed black out drunk at 3 am you likely are not sober at 7 am.

  4. #84
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Washington, DC area
    Quote Originally Posted by sagegrouse View Post
    He was headed to work at 7 AM for an 8 PM appearance -- having worked all the previous day. I expect he was not DUI.
    Rough commute.

    -jk

  5. #85
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Vermont
    Quote Originally Posted by Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15 View Post
    Isn't it possible that he wasn't under the influence, speeding, or looking at his phone, but merely driving a car he was unfamiliar with?
    More than one of the sheriffs said he was driving well above the limit...I suspect we'll subsequently know how fast.

    Yes, I teed that one up on the "driving skills," that's my charitable donation for the day!

  6. #86
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    Winston’Salem
    Quote Originally Posted by -jk View Post
    Rough commute.

    -jk
    Well, it *was* LA, after all. Although I suspect sage meant 8 A.
    "Amazing what a minute can do."

  7. #87
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Vermont
    Quote Originally Posted by Tripping William View Post
    Well, it *was* LA, after all. Although I suspect sage meant 8 A.
    which only makes it more fortunate that he didn't hit anyone in the two lanes of oncoming traffic he crossed..wouldn't pull that off at 4pm I'd guess...

  8. #88
    Join Date
    Dec 2014
    Location
    I'd tell ya, but then I'd have to kill ya
    Quote Originally Posted by killerleft View Post
    I've never thought JD Power was reputable. Consumer Reports says that Genesis and Lincoln have experienced big drops in reliability this past year. For Genesis, this may be ominous, since the brand is only 3 years old.

    Not to change subjects, but I've always had a feeling that JD Power was just a shill for the auto industry, created to combat bad press.
    Ok, so let's say I give you that JD Power is a sham (I have no idea). Though we are a very tiny corner of the internet, I still say it is irresponsible to posit that Genesis is in any way responsible for the crash. Worse than positing on Tiger's state behind the wheel, we at least have a bit of history there. I find absolutely no evidence of Genesis vehicles having a malfunction and suddenly careening across a wide median, through two lanes of traffic, and then barrel-rolling through many yards of trees and brush. For pete's sake, it probably didn't even have 200 miles on it.

  9. #89
    Quote Originally Posted by dudog84 View Post
    Ok, so let's say I give you that JD Power is a sham (I have no idea). Though we are a very tiny corner of the internet, I still say it is irresponsible to posit that Genesis is in any way responsible for the crash. Worse than positing on Tiger's state behind the wheel, we at least have a bit of history there. I find absolutely no evidence of Genesis vehicles having a malfunction and suddenly careening across a wide median, through two lanes of traffic, and then barrel-rolling through many yards of trees and brush. For pete's sake, it probably didn't even have 200 miles on it.
    I feel casting aspirations on Genesis is exactly as far as casting them on Tiger. It was precise why I brought it up.

  10. #90
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Greensboro, NC
    Quote Originally Posted by dudog84 View Post
    Ok, so let's say I give you that JD Power is a sham (I have no idea). Though we are a very tiny corner of the internet, I still say it is irresponsible to posit that Genesis is in any way responsible for the crash. Worse than positing on Tiger's state behind the wheel, we at least have a bit of history there. I find absolutely no evidence of Genesis vehicles having a malfunction and suddenly careening across a wide median, through two lanes of traffic, and then barrel-rolling through many yards of trees and brush. For pete's sake, it probably didn't even have 200 miles on it.
    Sorry. I agree with you. Chances are certainly much, much better that operator error was the reason that Genesis crashed. Although the number of recalls for new and used autos suggests that chances are way better than zero that many cars are flawed upon delivery.
    Man, if your Mom made you wear that color when you were a baby, and you're still wearing it, it's time to grow up!

  11. #91
    Quote Originally Posted by killerleft View Post
    For Genesis, this may be ominous, since the brand is only 3 years old.
    Its a sub brand of Hyundai. The cars have been around for a decade plus. Originally Hyundai wanted to start it has their luxury division like Toyota did with Lexus. Market conditions said otherwise so they started selling it as a high end Hyundai (sans any Hyundai markings). When it was released with was by far the best bang for the buck luxury car but had no cachet. Eventually Hyundai separated from the main brand after it became established.

    Its looking likely this was a accident caused by driver error...speeding, fatigue or unfamiliarity with the road or some combination. It was lucky there wasnt anyone else involved. Its going to be a tough recovery.

  12. #92
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Steamboat Springs, CO
    Quote Originally Posted by throatybeard View Post
    Also, probably not Tiger this week, but plenty of people are hammered drunk at 7am.
    I will accept as credible your expertise on this subject.
    Sage Grouse

    ---------------------------------------
    'When I got on the bus for my first road game at Duke, I saw that every player was carrying textbooks or laptops. I coached in the SEC for 25 years, and I had never seen that before, not even once.' - David Cutcliffe to Duke alumni in Washington, DC, June 2013

  13. #93
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Vermont
    Quote Originally Posted by Kdogg View Post
    Its a sub brand of Hyundai. The cars have been around for a decade plus. Originally Hyundai wanted to start it has their luxury division like Toyota did with Lexus. Market conditions said otherwise so they started selling it as a high end Hyundai (sans any Hyundai markings). When it was released with was by far the best bang for the buck luxury car but had no cachet. Eventually Hyundai separated from the main brand after it became established.

    Its looking likely this was a accident caused by driver error...speeding, fatigue or unfamiliarity with the road or some combination. It was lucky there wasnt anyone else involved. Its going to be a tough recovery.
    Good Genesis summary...highly touted but uninspiring vehicles. In any event, this is not how they saw things playing out when they lent Tiger the car...

  14. #94
    Join Date
    Dec 2014
    Location
    I'd tell ya, but then I'd have to kill ya
    Quote Originally Posted by budwom View Post
    Good Genesis summary...highly touted but uninspiring vehicles. In any event, this is not how they saw things playing out when they lent Tiger the car...
    Are you trying to be cute with the golfing analogies? The first could be said about most any golfer not named Tiger. Last weekend was a joint Tiger/Genesis event. Playing out I should leave alone, because unfortunately Tiger is very likely done as a player (though I think he will remain a force in golf...he's that much bigger than the sport).

  15. #95
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Derm
    As tweeted by someone: I know more about Tiger Woods accident than where to find a vaccine for my parents.

  16. #96
    Quote Originally Posted by Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15 View Post
    Isn't it possible that he wasn't under the influence, speeding, or looking at his phone, but merely driving a car he was unfamiliar with?
    Id think hed be familiar with the brake pedal no matter the car.

  17. #97
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Vermont
    Quote Originally Posted by dudog84 View Post
    Are you trying to be cute with the golfing analogies? The first could be said about most any golfer not named Tiger. Last weekend was a joint Tiger/Genesis event. Playing out I should leave alone, because unfortunately Tiger is very likely done as a player (though I think he will remain a force in golf...he's that much bigger than the sport).
    I don't think sports analogies can be avoided (as my wife completely understands)...I just try to give my 110% every day, move the ball forward, I don't spike the ball prematurely.

    Had Tiger been drinking (which he wasn't) we could have said he was in his cups I would imagine...

    Anyway, pretty fortunate he didn't damage himself (or others) worse than he did, for that we can be grateful.

  18. #98
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Ashburn, VA
    Quote Originally Posted by Phredd3 View Post
    I'm just saying that if I were conducting an investigation in a high-profile case like this, I'd sure want to look into whether or not his cell phone was in use at the time. Both the cell phone transmission records and the phone itself would be of interest to me, if I were trying to get a thorough understanding of what happened.
    How useful would that information actually be though?

    If he were actually making a regular phone call (which there would be records for), how would you know if it were hands-free or an actual contributing factor?

    Now, most of the time people spend using their phones isn't for regular voice calls.
    And if it weren't a phone call (again, for which there would be a specific record for with the carrier), how useful is knowing "data transmission activity" was occurring?

    With all the apps and services running on our phone, that are constantly communicating out to the internet whether we are actively using our phone or not, is there actually any good way to tie data transmission timestamps and statistics to active user participation? I would think that would be nearly impossible, but perhaps I'm wrong.
    A text without a context is a pretext.

  19. #99
    Join Date
    Dec 2014
    Location
    I'd tell ya, but then I'd have to kill ya
    Quote Originally Posted by snowdenscold View Post
    How useful would that information actually be though?

    If he were actually making a regular phone call (which there would be records for), how would you know if it were hands-free or an actual contributing factor?

    Now, most of the time people spend using their phones isn't for regular voice calls.
    And if it weren't a phone call (again, for which there would be a specific record for with the carrier), how useful is knowing "data transmission activity" was occurring?

    With all the apps and services running on our phone, that are constantly communicating out to the internet whether we are actively using our phone or not, is there actually any good way to tie data transmission timestamps and statistics to active user participation? I would think that would be nearly impossible, but perhaps I'm wrong.
    I read (I'll see if I can find it) that the black box in the vehicle might have infrared measurements of his eye movements. How's that for freaky?

    Edit: Couldn't immediately find the article, but it seems I didn't dream it up. There's other good info in this article about the things the black box might record.

    For instance, cameras in some vehicles now monitor whether the driver is paying attention to the road
    https://www.boston.com/sports/golf/2...cause-of-wreck

    Apropos of nothing, I was thinking this morning what could cause me to do what Tiger did, so I could give him the benefit of the doubt. Going a little too fast on a curvy road...a spider crawling on my neck could do it. Or a bee in the car. Or a gecko up the leg. I don't think any of those things would show up on the black box.
    Last edited by dudog84; 02-27-2021 at 03:49 PM.

  20. #100
    Join Date
    Feb 2018
    Location
    Durham, NC
    Quote Originally Posted by snowdenscold View Post
    How useful would that information actually be though?

    If he were actually making a regular phone call (which there would be records for), how would you know if it were hands-free or an actual contributing factor?

    Now, most of the time people spend using their phones isn't for regular voice calls.
    And if it weren't a phone call (again, for which there would be a specific record for with the carrier), how useful is knowing "data transmission activity" was occurring?

    With all the apps and services running on our phone, that are constantly communicating out to the internet whether we are actively using our phone or not, is there actually any good way to tie data transmission timestamps and statistics to active user participation? I would think that would be nearly impossible, but perhaps I'm wrong.
    Everything is pretty well tracked. Calls are distinguishable from text and both are distinguishable from app data. I'm not sure how granular the data tracking gets at the carrier level, but I'd guess it would be relatively trivial at a minimum to determine which app is active at any given time, which by itself could potentially tell you quite a bit.

    As for how useful the information would be, it depends on what result you want to achieve. I gather the police are not planning to pursue this line of inquiry at all, so we'll probably never know.

    One last point, related to your second sentence: Hands-free use *is* a contributing factor. Newer studies do suggest that hands-free driving is safer than using a handheld, but it isn't as safe as not using a device at all. Phone + driving = bad.

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