2020-21 minutes thread - or is this redundant

[sagegrouse]

This write-up of last night's inter squad scrimmage does little to clarify some of our earlier theories...

http://bluedevilnation.net/2020/11/d...lds-scrimmage/

Not one mention of Hurt, Roach the leading scorer, Tapé prominence...mystery abounds.

My question after reading the writeup (and seeing the old scrimmage video from weeks ago): is Steward going to be more of a PG than Roach?

Bizarre omission, unless Hurt was hurt.

Here's the annotated write-up:

• [*]Roach's 22 points over the three periods combined were the most of any player, and his five assists tied with Steward and Goldwire for the scrimmage lead. Roach shot 6-of-9 from the field and hit all eight of his free throw attempts.
  
• Steward and Goldwire had five assists each.
  
• Coleman and Tapé led the way on the glass with 10 rebounds each while also contributing offensively, as Coleman scored 17 points and Tapé added 14.
  
• Sophomore Wendell Moore Jr., finished with 16 total points and went 7-of-9 from the charity stripe, while...
  
• [Jalen] Johnson shot 7-of-11 from the floor for 17 points.
  
• Junior Joey Baker [15 points] totaled five points in each of the three periods and finished the night 6-of-12 from the field and 3-of-6 from long range.
  
• The two squads combined to shoot 36-of-50 (.720) from the free throw line for the scrimmage. After getting more accustomed to the surroundings, the teams shot a combined 31-of-75 (.413) from the field over the final two periods.

Eight players were mentioned. Before we consign Hurt to the end of the bench, maybe we should wait for next Friday's scrimmage.

[dcar1985]

Footage from the Saturday scrimmage

https://youtu.be/x1Jq2H5fK3A

[DukieInBrasil]

Footage from the Saturday scrimmage

https://youtu.be/x1Jq2H5fK3A

do you know the name of the player who played without a jersey? Even Savarino got a lot PT, or at least camera time.
Saw lots of Coleman and Williams, not a whole lot of Brakefiled.
Starting to get that jones for college hoops...

[CDu]

Footage from the Saturday scrimmage

https://youtu.be/x1Jq2H5fK3A

Thanks for posting this link!

My thoughts on viewing, for what little a highlight video is worth for analysis:
1. Mark Williams is REALLY tall
2. It looked like Roach and Goldwire were the primary guys running the offense for each side
3. Not a lot of defense in these scrimmages
4. Coleman looks like a stout young man
5. Hurt still looks skinny

No real analysis to take away as it was just a highlight video and a lot of the video included guys like Savarino and (I think) a manager on the court.

But definitely getting excited about bball coming.

[luvdahops]

Thanks for posting this link!

My thoughts on viewing, for what little a highlight video is worth for analysis:
1. Mark Williams is REALLY tall
2. It looked like Roach and Goldwire were the primary guys running the offense for each side
3. Not a lot of defense in these scrimmages
4. Coleman looks like a stout young man
5. Hurt still looks skinny

No real analysis to take away as it was just a highlight video and a lot of the video included guys like Savarino and (I think) a manager on the court.

But definitely getting excited about bball coming.

Agree on the bolded point above, but I thought DJ also showed a pretty slick handle and good court vision. Roach's shooting looked better than advertised, and it was nice to see Baker scoring off the bounce a few times, too.

[Troublemaker]

My question after reading the writeup (and seeing the old scrimmage video from weeks ago): is Steward going to be more of a PG than Roach?

While DJ's point skills were definitely underrated by almost everyone in the spring (not by me, though, haha), he's going to have a tough time playing more than Roach and JGold at a listed 163 pounds. I know that the official roster weights and heights aren't the Word of God or anything, but typically if they're wrong, they're wrong in the direction of flattering the player.

In the spring, I thought DJ would start but I'm now tempering those expectations a bit. I just didn't know that he'd be a buck sixty.

[Troublemaker]

Footage from the Saturday scrimmage

https://youtu.be/x1Jq2H5fK3A

Too lazy to look up the timestamp, but Jalen had a beautiful rebound-and-then-touch-pass-in-one-motion to Tape for a dunk in that highlight reel. If the coaches have been lukewarm in praise for Jalen, the one thing they've really raved about though is his passing.

[LasVegas]

Footage from the Saturday scrimmage

https://youtu.be/x1Jq2H5fK3A

That was horribly filmed. Way too zoomed in on the action to see anything.

[JasonEvans]

We podded on the footage: https://cms.megaphone.fm/channel/duk...=VMP1578575713

Really impressed with Roach and loved seeing him drain some threes. He only missed 3 shots the entire scrimmage so it isn't like he took 8 threes to hit those two.
The speed they are playing at was striking. This team is clearly going to push the ball up the floor in a big way.
I dunno how much he plays, but I can't help but notice that Henry Coleman is always making an impact out there.

Also, I may be wrong but I think the unnumbered player who was not wearing a jersey late in the video was Jeremy Roach playing for a different team than he played for earlier.

[CDu]

Also, I may be wrong but I think the unnumbered player who was not wearing a jersey late in the video was Jeremy Roach playing for a different team than he played for earlier.

Pretty sure the unnumbered player was NOT Jeremy Roach. Different skin tone, different body type, shorter, different hairstyle. It might have been a fill-in for Roach though if Roach had gotten banged up for example.

[JasonEvans]

Pretty sure the unnumbered player was NOT Jeremy Roach. Different skin tone, different body type, different hairstyle.

Other than that...

Sorry, I was just spitballing.

[CDu]

Other than that...

Sorry, I was just spitballing.

Pretty sure it's one of the team managers getting some run at the end of the scrimmage.

[luvdahops]

While DJ's point skills were definitely underrated by almost everyone in the spring (not by me, though, haha), he's going to have a tough time playing more than Roach and JGold at a listed 163 pounds. I know that the official roster weights and heights aren't the Word of God or anything, but typically if they're wrong, they're wrong in the direction of flattering the player.

In the spring, I thought DJ would start but I'm now tempering those expectations a bit. I just didn't know that he'd be a buck sixty.

Not sure if that will be any sort of disqualifier, especially if the flip side is quickness that no one else on the squad appears to possess. It looked to me that Roach and JGold were on the same team at least half the time, which suggests that DJ was running the point for the other side. Either way, I suspect that we will see any two from among Roach, JGold and DJ on the floor together a lot.

[CDu]

Not sure if that will be any sort of disqualifier, especially if the flip side is quickness that no one else on the squad appears to possess. It looked to me that Roach and JGold were on the same team at least half the time, which suggests that DJ was running the point for the other side. Either way, I suspect that we will see any two from among Roach, JGold and DJ on the floor together a lot.

Yeah, I was just typing something similar. From that video, it feels like we'll see a lot of 2-"PG" lineups, which would mean a lot of Roach/Goldwire/Steward in some combination. That would push Moore to the 3, which feels right anyway (he doesn't shoot well enough to be a college 2, and given his size/strength/toughness he can easily handle the 3/4 spots in college). That would leave the battle for PT at the 4/5 between Johnson/Hurt/Tape/Williams/Coleman/Brakefield, with only 3 or 4 of those guys likely to play big minutes just by virtue of limited available minutes to go around.

[DukieTiger]

While DJ's point skills were definitely underrated by almost everyone in the spring (not by me, though, haha), he's going to have a tough time playing more than Roach and JGold at a listed 163 pounds. I know that the official roster weights and heights aren't the Word of God or anything, but typically if they're wrong, they're wrong in the direction of flattering the player.

In the spring, I thought DJ would start but I'm now tempering those expectations a bit. I just didn't know that he'd be a buck sixty.

Agreed that the weight is a bit of a concern and probably wise to temper expectations.

I will say though, DJ looks taller and longer than I expected. While the weight might limit his freshman upside - the height and length (if my perception is accurate) is a good sign for his long-term upside.

Back to the weight (and implicitly, strength) questions... One of the greatest strengths I read in scouting reports on DJS is his remarkable touch, which helps him finish around the basket. I'm anticipating he won't flash that strength this year, that this will be a challenge for him transitioning to a higher level of bball and he'll mostly contribute value as a spot up shooter and above average passer. I'm guessing that makes him a 2 year (at least) player. But, if he does finish in traffic reasonably well in spite of the lack of strength, I could see his NBA stock remaining relatively high due to his shooting upside.

[Troublemaker]

Not sure if that will be any sort of disqualifier, especially if the flip side is quickness that no one else on the squad appears to possess.

I'm not saying it's a disqualifier at all. I still think DJ will play a lot, but I would guess he plays less than the more stout JGold and Roach at this point. In the spring, on my little notepad file where I play around with lineups, I had DJ starting and playing 32 mpg. I've dialed that down to 20 mpg now. But it's early. Maybe the next time I see him play, I'm so impressed I dial it back up again.

Not sure if that will be any sort of disqualifier, especially if the flip side is quickness that no one else on the squad appears to possess.

I think Roach is probably quicker. But DJ's three-ball threat is going to put him in advantageous positions for penetration. In the video, he was able to get by Wendell because Wendell was crowding him far beyond the 3-pt line, hands up, ready to contest a shot.

[CDu]

I'm not saying it's a disqualifier at all. I still think DJ will play a lot, but I would guess he plays less than the more stout JGold and Roach at this point. In the spring, on my little notepad file where I play around with lineups, I had DJ starting and playing 32 mpg. I've dialed that down to 20 mpg now. But it's early. Maybe the next time I see him play, I'm so impressed I dial it back up again.

I think Roach is probably quicker. But DJ's three-ball threat is going to put him in advantageous positions for penetration. In the video, he was able to get by Wendell because Wendell was crowding him far beyond the 3-pt line, hands up, ready to contest a shot.

Yeah, I don't know yet how exactly I feel about each of the 3 guards' playing time will go, except that I expect each to play a lot. In the spring, I figured Roach and Steward would play the most of the 3, with Goldwire still playing significant minutes and perhaps even starting with Steward playing more but off the bench. But if Goldwire's shooting touch is improved (and he was hitting a variety of interesting shots in this game, which suggests that maybe he's progressing) that could make a difference. He shot 35% from 3 last year on very low volume; if he improves upon that, he becomes a legitimate threat to play starter minutes due to his defensive skills.

Either way, I feel like having 3 very capable ballhandlers is a good place to be. Especially as Roach and Steward each seem quite capable of creating off the dribble. Goldwire less so of course. But if he does show improvement on his 3pt shot, that would make him more of a threat off the bounce.

When you combine that with Johnson's playmaking ability and mismatch potential and Hurt's floor spacing potential, it's going to be an interesting team to watch on offense this year. There appear to be potentially way more shot creators than last year, when it was really just Tre Jones who had to create for everyone because 75% of the team couldn't dribble and one of the ones who could dribble was just way too turnover prone (Moore).

[Billy Dat]

From the Steve Wiseman Charlotte Observer article linked on the DBR front page
https://www.charlotteobserver.com/sp...247085217.html

He says the initial starters will probably be the small ball line-up of Goldwire, Roach, Hurt, Johnson and Moore. There is so much buzz around Coleman that he seems destined for minutes. Nate James also called out Tape as someone who seems to have accepted his defend, screen, rebound role as a big.

Per CDu's comments about expanded playmaking options, it will be interesting to see how the scoring gets divided among those starters. Goldwire's shot has really improved, and he was a much better finisher in the lane last year, but the baseline was so low. Roach looks like he can shoot on a limited sample. We know Hurt can shoot but I'll be interested to see if he can become more of a scorer. Johnson seems, by what I read, like a demon on the break but more of a playmaker in the half court. Wendell is a driver, we'll see if he's expanded his offensive repertoire.

Like Troublemaker, I have a feeling about Steward. The kid just feels like someone who is going to get buckets, no matter his build. There has also been very little chatter about Baker, who I'd like to see on the court with all of these playmakers.

Obviously, there will be minutes for guys who can produce on both ends, it'll be fun to find out who they are...I hope.

[CDu]

From the Steve Wiseman Charlotte Observer article linked on the DBR front page
https://www.charlotteobserver.com/sp...247085217.html

He says the initial starters will probably be the small ball line-up of Goldwire, Roach, Hurt, Johnson and Moore. There is so much buzz around Coleman that he seems destined for minutes. Nate James also called out Tape as someone who seems to have accepted his defend, screen, rebound role as a big.

Per CDu's comments about expanded playmaking options, it will be interesting to see how the scoring gets divided among those starters. Goldwire's shot has really improved, and he was a much better finisher in the lane last year, but the baseline was so low. Roach looks like he can shoot on a limited sample. We know Hurt can shoot but I'll be interested to see if he can become more of a scorer. Johnson seems, by what I read, like a demon on the break but more of a playmaker in the half court. Wendell is a driver, we'll see if he's expanded his offensive repertoire.

Like Troublemaker, I have a feeling about Steward. The kid just feels like someone who is going to get buckets, no matter his build. There has also been very little chatter about Baker, who I'd like to see on the court with all of these playmakers.

Obviously, there will be minutes for guys who can produce on both ends, it'll be fun to find out who they are...I hope.

Yeah, I do like the potential of the Johnson/Hurt combo at the 4/5 spots. They could be such a mismatch for opposing teams' bigs. Each can handle and play away from the basket, which is going to make teams uncomfortable. Additionally, their ability to spread the court (Hurt with his shooting, Johnson with his playmaking) will open lanes for Roach and Moore and Steward and (maybe) Goldwire to attack off the dribble. It is interesting that Coleman seems to be getting more chatter than Williams and Baker. He very much fits the grinder mold that Coach K likes, and certainly appears to have the physicality to play inside. Sounds like Tape is ahead of Williams, which shouldn't be too surprising given the age/experience difference.

[luvdahops]

Yeah, I do like the potential of the Johnson/Hurt combo at the 4/5 spots. They could be such a mismatch for opposing teams' bigs. Each can handle and play away from the basket, which is going to make teams uncomfortable. Additionally, their ability to spread the court (Hurt with his shooting, Johnson with his playmaking) will open lanes for Roach and Moore and Steward and (maybe) Goldwire to attack off the dribble. It is interesting that Coleman seems to be getting more chatter than Williams and Baker. He very much fits the grinder mold that Coach K likes, and certainly appears to have the physicality to play inside. Sounds like Tape is ahead of Williams, which shouldn't be too surprising given the age/experience difference.

I still have questions about Coleman's athleticism, but he seems to - at a minimum - have a strong body, great nose for the ball, nice touch around the basket, and to run the floor very well.