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  1. #341
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Albemarle, North Carolina
    I’ve always been skeptical of UFO sighting because well I think most people are to dumb to know what they are seeing tbh and just say “ufo” in terms of aliens. However that said, listening to Lex Fridman interview David Fravor on what him and his crew experienced in the Navy made me start to believe.
    "The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, it is the illusion of knowledge" -Stephen Hawking

  2. #342
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Greenville, SC
    Quote Originally Posted by JNort View Post
    I’ve always been skeptical of UFO sighting because well I think most people are to dumb to know what they are seeing tbh and just say “ufo” in terms of aliens. However that said, listening to Lex Fridman interview David Fravor on what him and his crew experienced in the Navy made me start to believe.
    I've always believed in UFOs.

    I do have a problem with the leap many people make when they try to remove the "U" and say something like, "We don't know what it is so it must be..."

  3. #343
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    New Bern, NC unless it's a home football game then I'm grilling on Devil's Alley
    I'm assuming that the government has been slowly setting us up to the big reveal of reality. Ultimately they'll say "If it looks like a duck, and walks like a duck, and quacks like a duck, it's obviously a duck. It's an alien duck, but still."

    a8b869075c06fe2336e1d32b3d117d14.jpg
    Q "Why do you like Duke, you didn't even go there." A "Because my art school didn't have a basketball team."

  4. #344
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Wherever the wind blows and the leaves dance.
    No surprise but it looks like the UFO report that is supposed to be released in June is facing a multitude of hurdles and is in jeopardy of not meeting its deadline. Per the Politico:

    Quote Originally Posted by Politico
    Some military and spy agencies are blocking or simply ignoring the effort to catalog what they have on "unidentified aerial phenomenon," according to multiple current and former government officials. And as a result, the Biden administration will likely delay a much-anticipated public report to Congress.

    "Just getting access to the information, because of all the different security bureaucracies, that's an ordeal in itself," said Christopher Mellon, a former Pentagon intelligence official who lobbied for the disclosure provision and is continuing to advise policymakers on the issue.

    "I know that the task force has been denied access to pertinent information by the Air Force and they have been stiff-armed by them," Mellon said in an interview. "That is disappointing but not unexpected."
    Remember the Air Force intentionally misled citizens with Project Sign, Project Grudge, and Project Blue Book. Why the need to blatantly mislead citizens? The Air Force could of just hid behind “classified” and not spent tons of tax payer money on bogus reports. Maybe that was money well spent as they have been able to obfuscate a lot of people into dismissing the most incredible phenomenon of the last one hundred years.

    Quote Originally Posted by Politico
    He also sees what he called "passive resistance," or "they're just not going to do anything to support it," such as applying resources or personnel to the activity.
    It seems like the general public is expecting a legitimate UFO report which in the end I don’t think is going to happen. Hopefully these kinds of articles will provide needed transparency.

  5. #345
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Durham, NC
    Quote Originally Posted by whereinthehellami View Post
    Maybe but why run it all the way up the chain of command to the Chief of Naval Operations creating a long paper trail? Unless you want to create the paper trail so that it gets uncovered via a FOIA request, like what happened. Hmm.
    Um, yes, that's what I was saying. Classic misdirection.

  6. #346
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Wherever the wind blows and the leaves dance.
    Lt. Ryan Graves, a retired F-18 advanced fighter pilot for the Navy was recently interviewed by Kevin Rose on his multiple UFO encounters off the east coast. From 2013-2019 there were numerous interactions with pilots and radar showing incursions in military no-fly zones.

    Lt. Graves talks about how the Navy got a new advanced radar system that coincided with the Navy seeing these UFO which were for the most part not visible to the pilots. Lt. Graves said the pilots would fly near them and the UFO would change just enough elevation so as not to be seen. There were a few incidents where the pilots did see the UFOs including a flying sphere encasing a cube with lights around flying between two F-18s that were about 400 feet apart. According to the Lt. Graves the pilots that saw it were visibly shaken after landing as the safety concerns of this UFO encounter was potentially life threatening. Remember that they are flying at around 800 mph with objects that are seen all over the radars and are only rarely visually seen.

    Multiple reports were filed within the Navy which is a big deal because…UFOs. Lt. Graves said that the Navy ended up issuing NOTAMs. An official notice to airmen that was reviewed before flying telling the airmen to be aware of the unexplained objects in the protected airspace. According to Lt. Graves this is a big deal in the Navy to say that there are unexplained objects in their airspace and to continue training. Lt. Graves went on to say that all of the 50-60 airmen that he flew with over the years had similar experiences but didn’t want the publicity of UFOs.

    This interview is interesting due to the similarities of his experiences to Commander Fravor's who famously saw the ‘Tic-Tac’ UFO off the coast of California in 2004. Both are trained fighter pilot experts who have had encounters with UFOs from 2004-2019 off both the east and west coasts. Both of these airmen have said that that these UFO are common, able to defy physics, and that their encounters have been corroborated by radar and a multitude of other trained experts.

  7. #347
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Wherever the wind blows and the leaves dance.
    John Greenewald Jr., creator of the Black Vault website, recently interviewed James Woolsey, former director of the CIA, and for about 15 minutes they discussed UFOs. James Woolsey publicly stated that his skepticism has been shaken by what he’s been exposed to regarding UFOs. Woolsey relates a story in which someone he trusts was flying at 40,000 feet and their plane was paused in midair, which seems pretty remarkable. Woolsey didn't go into a lot of details but did say that he has talked to enough trusted people who have had unexplainable experiences and encounters with aerial phenomenon that he believes that they were not man-made.

    The Black Vault website recently made the news when they received and made public thousands of CIA documents related to UFOs thru FOIA requests.

  8. #348
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Wherever the wind blows and the leaves dance.
    On Friday, the New Yorker ran a lengthy piece on the UFO phenomenon and the government. This article has a lot of good info in it for novices to the UFO phenomenon. It is good to see mainstream media coming around to the legitimacy of the phenomenon.

    The New Yorker highlights Leslie Kean who penned the UFO piece in the New York Times back in 2017 and has dedicated her life to the phenomenon. The article also touches on some of the more mainstream UFO skeptics in Michael Shermer and Mick West.

  9. #349
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Vermont
    Quote Originally Posted by whereinthehellami View Post
    On Friday, the New Yorker ran a lengthy piece on the UFO phenomenon and the government. This article has a lot of good info in it for novices to the UFO phenomenon. It is good to see mainstream media coming around to the legitimacy of the phenomenon.

    The New Yorker highlights Leslie Kean who penned the UFO piece in the New York Times back in 2017 and has dedicated her life to the phenomenon. The article also touches on some of the more mainstream UFO skeptics in Michael Shermer and Mick West.
    yes, extremely comprehensive article, including bits about my wife's old pal Allen Hynek...

  10. #350
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Wherever the wind blows and the leaves dance.
    Quote Originally Posted by budwom View Post
    yes, extremely comprehensive article, including bits about my wife's old pal Allen Hynek...
    J. Allen Hynek is such a central figure in the UFO phenomenon. He is somebody who saw things from both side of the fence so to speak. I would have loved to talk with him, he passed in 1986. A skeptic turned ufologist but a scientist first and foremost.

    Last Friday, the New York post ran an article on the federal cover-up of UFOs focusing on Luis “Lue” Elizondo, who ran the Pentagon’s Advanced Aerospace Threat Identification Program from 2010-2017.

    Some interesting excerpts from the New Your Post article:

    Quote Originally Posted by New York Post
    As part of his job, Elizondo said, he had access to the Pentagon’s UFO data and interviewed military eyewitnesses who encountered UAP on an almost “daily basis.”

    Elizondo scrutinized all this evidence, including radar and electro-optical data, that showed unknown aircraft zipping 60 miles in five seconds and descending at speeds of 14 miles per second.

    “Do the math,” Elizondo, also a former intelligence officer for the US Department of Defense, told The Post. “You’ll see that it’s very fast.” (BTW: We did the math — and 60 miles in five seconds is 43,200 mph.)

    He also detailed Spielberg-worthy operational capabilities that fall into the realm of “transmedium travel.” Elizondo explained that the eye-popping vessels can fly 50 feet above the Earth’s surface or 80,000 feet in the sky and even submerge underwater without a compromise in performance at any level: “When you see that, you recognize you are dealing with a technology more advanced than ours.”

    Even the way in which these inexplicable flying machines manage to lift off blows away rational engineering. “[These] things have no wings, no cockpits, no control surfaces, no rivets in the skin, no obvious signs of propulsion — and somehow they are able to defy the natural effects of Earth’s gravity,” Elizondo marveled. “How is that possible?”

    Then there is the sheer ability to handle the stress of it all: “Humans can withstand 9 Gs for just a short period of time before negative physical consequences. The F-16 fighter jet will begin to experience structural failure around 17 Gs. The objects we’re seeing are doing 600 Gs. Obviously well beyond the healthy limitations of anything” — including whoever or whatever is inside the vessel.
    Elizondo touched on some of the frustration he felt in trying to brief Pentagon officials:

    Quote Originally Posted by New York Post
    Elizondo quit his Pentagon job in frustration over authorities being unwilling to even entertain the possibility of UFOs.

    Elizondo claimed one senior official “told him to ‘Stop'” investigating UFOs — and asked Elizondo if he had “read your Bible lately?”

    Elizondo asked where his boss was going with the non sequitur before acknowledging familiarity with the Good Book. As per Elizondo, he was then told, “‘Well, then you would know that these things are demonic and we should not be pursuing them.’ He wasn’t kidding. That’s exactly how he felt.”

    The line of thinking is not restricted to America. Nick Pope saw similar incidents of religion trumping science in the UK. “Some objections come from people in government who think the phenomenon is real — but demonic,” Pope said. “Their belief seems to be that studying UFOs would thus give energy to attention-seeking demons, which should be avoided. This view comes, in part, from the biblical description of Satan as ‘the prince of the power of the air.’”

    “I was asked if I believe the US government is in possession of [UFOs] and I said, ‘Yes. I believe so.’ And that’s all I’m prepared to say.” (Elizondo, who is tied to a lifelong NDA with the government, rides a fine line between what he can reveal and what he can’t.)

  11. #351
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Vermont
    when my wife was young, she got to hang out with J. Allen and Carl Sagan quite a bit, she's got some great memories of this.

  12. #352
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    New Bern, NC unless it's a home football game then I'm grilling on Devil's Alley
    Quote Originally Posted by budwom View Post
    when my wife was young, she got to hang out with J. Allen and Carl Sagan quite a bit, she's got some great memories of this.
    Here is how I picture me hanging out with Carl Sagain.

    "Say it."
    "No."
    "C'mon, just this once."
    "Again, no."
    "I'll never ask again, just one time."
    "I've already said it for you a billion times."

    "Now it's a billion and one."
    Q "Why do you like Duke, you didn't even go there." A "Because my art school didn't have a basketball team."

  13. #353
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Vermont
    yeah, I'd be wanting billions and billions of something...

  14. #354
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Wherever the wind blows and the leaves dance.
    Quote Originally Posted by New York Post
    “I was asked if I believe the US government is in possession of [UFOs] and I said, ‘Yes. I believe so.’ And that’s all I’m prepared to say.” (Elizondo, who is tied to a lifelong NDA with the government, rides a fine line between what he can reveal and what he can’t.)
    The New York post ran an article on former Senator Harry Reid saying Lockheed Martin may have UFO fragments.

    Quote Originally Posted by New York Post
    ““I was told for decades that Lockheed had some of these retrieved materials,” the Democrat told the magazine.

    “And I tried to get, as I recall, a classified approval by the Pentagon to have me go look at the stuff. They would not approve that,” Reid continued. “I don’t know what all the numbers were, what kind of classification it was, but they would not give that to me.”
    This a pretty big deal as Reid has always measured his words carefully with regards to the phenomenon. Could this be part of the UFO report due later this summer? I'm still skeptical that anything interesting is going to come from this report. But who knows, 2020 kind of changed normalcy.

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