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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Wherever the wind blows and the leaves dance.

    UAP & ET - Do you believe?

    I have always wanted to believe in Unidentified Flying Objects (UFOs) and extraterrestrials (ET) but was a healthy skeptic. “Show me the evidence” was my mantra. I have two science degrees, a BS in Biology and a MS in Geography (GIS).

    After the release (April 27, 2020) of the USS Nimitz UFO sightings in 2004 and the USS Roosevelt UFO sightings in 2015 I started looking into the UFO phenomenon. I have gone down the rabbit hole so to speak and have been blown away by some of the cases I was not aware of.

    The question for me, is no longer have UFOs visited earth, as there can be little doubt that they have visited but instead why is there not more interest and more questions? For what is more interesting than the reality of earth being visited by aliens and UFO?

    I’m very curious about where most people stand on UFO/ET. So, my questions would be:
    1. Do you believe UFOs have visited earth? Why?
    2. Do you believe extraterrestrials have visited earth? Why?
    3. If you believe extraterrestrials have visited earth, do you actively search for information?
    4. If you don’t believe extraterrestrials have visited earth, are you open to believing it?

    For those that don’t believe UFO/ETs have visited earth, I propose to present 10 of the most believable cases and see what your thoughts are on whether your mind has been changed or not.

    I will follow this post with one case at a time.

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Greensboro, NC
    I doubt we are alone, but I don't think we've been visited by any of the other folk. Speed of light and distances involved and all that.

  3. #3
    Hey, it's 2020, so why not?

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Durham, NC
    It would certainly explain Hollywood. And Congress.

  5. #5
    I don't know about aliens, but I have most definitely seen an unidentified object in the sky.

    It was in the SE sky as seen from my house just south of Raleigh. I saw one bright light surrounded by a perfect circle of a dozen or so lights. I would say the entire formation was about the size of my fist when my arm was extended out. It appeared as a bright constellation, but not bright enough to see what was causing it. I turned and went inside to get my wife and kids to see it, and in that 30 seconds it was gone completely.

    Aliens? Secret military tech? Swamp gas? I have no idea...but I definitely believe in unexplained things in the sky.

    I would think it's too soon for aliens to visit, though I do believe we are not alone in the Universe.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    NC
    Considering that water was likely originally delivered to Earth via asteroids, and given the size of the universe, I feel confident we aren’t the only planet with life on it. But I don’t believe humans nor Earth have ever encountered said extraterrestrial life.

  7. #7
    I would guess life exists elsewhere – possibly as close as Mars, Venus, Europa, or Enceladus. Liquid water exists today in several (arguably double-digits) Solar System objects. I doubt we've been visited by intelligent life in the form of UFOs, though.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Chesapeake, VA.
    I'm with Packman. I saw a UFO about 30 years ago, but i don't know that it was an alien spacecraft.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Feb 2018
    Location
    Dur'm
    Quote Originally Posted by whereinthehellami View Post
    I’m very curious about where most people stand on UFO/ET. So, my questions would be:
    1. Do you believe UFOs have visited earth? Why? No. I have seen no reports of credible evidence in support of it.
    2. Do you believe extraterrestrials have visited earth? Why? No, I have seen no reports of credible evidence in support of it.
    3. If you believe extraterrestrials have visited earth, do you actively search for information? No, plenty of well-equipped folks are already looking. There's no need for me to duplicate that effort.
    4. If you don’t believe extraterrestrials have visited earth, are you open to believing it? I hate the word "believe" here. As with nearly everything, I am open to being convinced by credible evidence. Such evidence would lead me to conclude, rather than believe, that extraterrestrials have visited Earth.
    I highly doubt anything you plan to present will convince me, but I'm willing to follow along and see. (By the way, I am taking "extraterrstrials" here in it's conventional meaning of "sentient life forms from planets outside the Earth's solar system". There are other ways to use that expression, so if you intend some other meaning, please specify the definition you are using.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Wherever the wind blows and the leaves dance.
    Quote Originally Posted by PackMan97 View Post
    I don't know about aliens, but I have most definitely seen an unidentified object in the sky.

    It was in the SE sky as seen from my house just south of Raleigh. I saw one bright light surrounded by a perfect circle of a dozen or so lights. I would say the entire formation was about the size of my fist when my arm was extended out. It appeared as a bright constellation, but not bright enough to see what was causing it. I turned and went inside to get my wife and kids to see it, and in that 30 seconds it was gone completely.

    Aliens? Secret military tech? Swamp gas? I have no idea...but I definitely believe in unexplained things in the sky.

    I would think it's too soon for aliens to visit, though I do believe we are not alone in the Universe.
    What year was your sighting? Was it just hovering?

    Quote Originally Posted by rsvman View Post
    I'm with Packman. I saw a UFO about 30 years ago, but i don't know that it was an alien spacecraft.
    What did it look like? How long was the sighting?

    Quote Originally Posted by Phredd3 View Post
    I highly doubt anything you plan to present will convince me, but I'm willing to follow along and see. (By the way, I am taking "extraterrstrials" here in it's conventional meaning of "sentient life forms from planets outside the Earth's solar system". There are other ways to use that expression, so if you intend some other meaning, please specify the definition you are using.
    I'm not really seeing where you are going with this? a sentient life form versus alien bacteria maybe?

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Greenville, SC
    I absolutely believe in UFOs.

    It's when people jump to identifying them that I become skeptical. You know, "We don't know what is was so it must be..."

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Feb 2018
    Location
    Dur'm
    Quote Originally Posted by whereinthehellami View Post
    I'm not really seeing where you are going with this? a sentient life form versus alien bacteria maybe?
    Sorry, I meant to extend that definition to encompass "UFOs" as you used it in the first question. I certainly believe there have been many flying objects that have remained unidentified. But your question specified "UFOs have visited Earth", which implies that the unidentified objects did not have earthly origin and were piloted to Earth by the extraterrestrials as defined. I think it is plausible that some "UFOs" are, in fact, extraterrestrial in origin (i.e. meteors), and in some sense they have "visited Earth", but that wouldn't count in the conversation I expect you wanted to have.

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Raleigh, NC
    I believe it was Arthur C. Clarke who said something along the lines of "we are either alone in the universe or we aren't. Either possibility is terrifying."

    The possibility of FTL travel is the key. In the absence of faster-than-light travel the only way interstellar travel makes sense is for a species that has an exceptionally long life span and the capability of building ships and artificial environments that last a really, really long time.

    And lots of patience.

    Living thousands of years versus faster-than-light travel. Way above my pay grade. Anyone with a doctorate in physics? Or life sciences?

    Most importantly, is it too late for these aliens to register for the 2020 elections?

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    New Orleans, Louisiana
    As I get older, I become more convinced that there is no intelligent life in the universe. Not even on Earth.

    Well, maybe dolphins.

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Undisclosed
    Quote Originally Posted by brevity View Post
    As I get older, I become more convinced that there is no intelligent life in the universe. Not even on Earth.

    Well, maybe dolphins.
    "So long, and thanks for all the fish."

  16. #16
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Vermont
    Not sure I want to get into the weeds on this one, but when my wife was growing up at the satellite tracking station in Cadiz Spain, frequent dinner guests were Carl Sagan and J. Allen Hynek, he of Project Blue Book fame (originally hired by the Air Force to debunk UFO stories, he later came to have a lot more respect for UFO reports from military pilots...you can Google him up)...there was a recent TV series based on his experiences...pretty fascinating guy.

  17. #17
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Cincinnati, Ohio
    My thinking on this is, "Yes, they're out there, and no, we're not going to see them".

    Life has restarted on earth about half a dozen times after some of the planet's extreme events. Since it has bounced back here under various different conditions, it just doesn't seem reasonable that it wouldn't happen elsewhere given the innumerable other locations where it could happen.

    Then assuming they are out there in great numbers, it would seem likely that some of them are hundreds of thousands if not millions of years further along in their evolution than us. And many others might be equally far behind us. But if intragalactic - or intergalactic travel were feasible, because of some technology we haven't discovered yet, then some and possibly many of those further advanced civilizations should have stopped by to say hello by now. I can't buy that they would make the enormous investment required to take a voyage like that, and then just drive by and go home.

    So I think that unless the luck of the draw puts multiple life sustaining planets in close enough proximity - there's no way we get to see each other.

  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by Ggallagher View Post
    My thinking on this is, "Yes, they're out there, and no, we're not going to see them".

    Life has restarted on earth about half a dozen times after some of the planet's extreme events. Since it has bounced back here under various different conditions, it just doesn't seem reasonable that it wouldn't happen elsewhere given the innumerable other locations where it could happen.

    Then assuming they are out there in great numbers, it would seem likely that some of them are hundreds of thousands if not millions of years further along in their evolution than us. And many others might be equally far behind us. But if intragalactic - or intergalactic travel were feasible, because of some technology we haven't discovered yet, then some and possibly many of those further advanced civilizations should have stopped by to say hello by now. I can't buy that they would make the enormous investment required to take a voyage like that, and then just drive by and go home.

    So I think that unless the luck of the draw puts multiple life sustaining planets in close enough proximity - there's no way we get to see each other.
    Another theory I heard about this is that species might only be "noisy" for a very short period of time. The period of time where humanity has BLASTED electronic broadcasts into space is going to be microscopic on a galactic scale. Already we are moving everything to ground based fiber and/or narrow beam satellite. I imagine on a global scale the amount of detectable electronic broadcasts leaving earth have dropped significantly since the 1940s and 50s and will only drop further. This will make us harder to find and unless you are looking at the right place for the 50-100 years a species is making noise, you won't find them.

  19. #19
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Vermont
    Like Stephen Hawking said, we ought not be too hopeful of having space dudes visit as they might wish to consume us like cocktail shrimp. (I paraphrase)...

  20. #20
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Wherever the wind blows and the leaves dance.
    Quote Originally Posted by duke79 View Post
    ... And there are also quite a few people who claim that they have been abducted by aliens (there was a famous and controversial book written by a psychiatrist and professor at Harvard Medical School, who went around the United States, interviewing these "alien abductees", and he even put many of them under hypnosis. He found many of their stories to be quite similar and legitimate and he could not come up with a good explanation for their shared experiences).
    I think you are talking about Dr. Mack and he was very well respected Harvard psychiatrist and professor until he got interested in abductions.

    Quote Originally Posted by duke79 View Post
    Some people have speculated that perhaps the "UFO's" are really "manned" by highly sophisticated robots (so not really a "living species") that could survive a very long time travel. Also there is the possibility (which I mentioned above) that the universe is somehow set up differently that what we currently believe. See link below.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wormhole
    There are some really interesting theories out there. A lot of them are varying degrees of fringe thinking.

    Quote Originally Posted by Wander View Post
    Not necessarily, because of relativity and time dilation. A spaceship that travels extremely fast, at almost but not quite the speed of light, could make it to other stars in the galaxy in thousands of years from our perspective, but in only decades from the perspective of a creature on board the spaceship. It sounds wacky, but note that time dilation and relativity have already been proven to be Real Things using very precise measurements.

    But, this is all getting ahead of ourselves. The next step is to look for life in our Solar System. And I think it's totally realistic that we find strong evidence of microbial life on Mars, Venus, Europa, or Enceladus within our lifetimes.
    I think the first step is to say that there is a lot out there that we don't understand. Quantum physics and entanglement theory seem on the verge of some important discoveries in the coming years.

    Quote Originally Posted by budwom View Post
    Not sure I want to get into the weeds on this one, but when my wife was growing up at the satellite tracking station in Cadiz Spain, frequent dinner guests were Carl Sagan and J. Allen Hynek, he of Project Blue Book fame (originally hired by the Air Force to debunk UFO stories, he later came to have a lot more respect for UFO reports from military pilots...you can Google him up)...there was a recent TV series based on his experiences...pretty fascinating guy.
    Quote Originally Posted by budwom View Post
    Like Stephen Hawking said, we ought not be too hopeful of having space dudes visit as they might wish to consume us like cocktail shrimp. (I paraphrase)...
    Very cool. There area a lot of characters in the UFO/ET world. There are some guys who are well respected and believe to some degree in UFO/ET, J. Allen Hynek and Stan Friedman are an example.

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