I'm not sure I get this . . .

[Lurkingdukedog]

I just saw this on my news feed:

https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/nca...id=mailsignout

And this line from the article really caught my attentions:

Now, it’s Rose’s hope that the school will put up a special banner for the Fab Five, and maybe even the Basketball Hall of Fame as well

I'm not sure why he thinks the school should do this? They didn't win anything, did they? I'd love Scottdude's take on this as well

[bundabergdevil]

I just saw this on my news feed:

https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/nca...id=mailsignout

And this line from the article really caught my attentions:

Now, it’s Rose’s hope that the school will put up a special banner for the Fab Five, and maybe even the Basketball Hall of Fame as well

I'm not sure why he thinks the school should do this? They didn't win anything, did they? I'd love Scottdude's take on this as well

A special banner? For what!?!? I'm sure Michigan has a basketball/sports museum akin to what we have at Duke. Acknowledge them there if they haven't been already. But a banner? Participation trophies in elementary school are fine with me, not in NCAA Division 1 basketball.

[dukebluesincebirth]

We beat you by 20 jalen. Go ahead and kiss Grant Hill’s ring, and get over it.

[Dr. Rosenrosen]

If only Helms Bakery was still in operation...

[scottdude8]

I just saw this on my news feed:

https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/nca...id=mailsignout

And this line from the article really caught my attentions:

Now, it’s Rose’s hope that the school will put up a special banner for the Fab Five, and maybe even the Basketball Hall of Fame as well

I'm not sure why he thinks the school should do this? They didn't win anything, did they? I'd love Scottdude's take on this as well

So I'll start with a disclaimer that the Fab Five was a bit before my time (I was in diapers when they were playing!), so a lot of what I know about the situation is secondhand through stories my Dad (an obviously fervent Wolverine) has passed down. So take everything with a grain of salt!

That said, I think there's two separate issues here: the end of the "feud" with Webber and the banner. The "feud" revolves around the fact that (again, probably not perfect on the details here) it was Webber who was primarily accountable for the NCAA violations that led to the Final Four banners being vacated. As part of the fallout from that booster scandal, Michigan was officially required to "disassociate" itself from Webber until 2013. In the years since, there's been almost yearly speculation along the lines of "the time has come to honor Chris Webber" in some form or fashion. Nothing has happened through the basketball program specifically; the closest has been when he was an honorary captain at a Michigan football game in 2018. The athletic department (and to a lesser extent other members of the Fab Five, particularly Rose) have wanted some form of an apology from Webber before he would be fully re-embraced by the group and the basketball program, which hasn't come to pass. But since Juwan Howard became the head coach, which brought Rose back into the fold as a "proxy" for the program in the media, the speculation has been growing and growing that some sort of "reunion" is inevitable.

Now, that is a completely separate issue from the "banner" issue. I think you may have misinterpreted that article: Rose wasn't saying that they should re-hang the Final Four banners, which of course would be against NCAA rules. He seemed to be wanting them to hang some sort of "honorary" banner for the Fab Five as a group. Would that be silly? Most definitely. Would it be entirely unprecedented? I don't think so. There isn't a set rule on what is meant by a "banner" for each program. Some schools raise "Sweet 16" banners (obviously Duke doesn't... Michigan doesn't either FWIW). UMBC raised a banner (IIRC) for being the first 16 seed to beat a 1 seed. I think Rose is asking for something along the lines of the latter, not an official recognition of anything the Fab Five won (because of course that was vacated). I think this would be extremely tacky and beneath Michigan as a basketball program, which has a great history before the Fab Five and obviously an encouraging present and future... so I doubt anything like that would actually happen.

That said, while a "banner" is likely not going to happen, some sort of "reunion" and recognition of the Fab Five, with or without Webber, seems inevitable. It largely seems up to Webber as to whether he's willing to take responsibility for his past misdeeds in order to be included in that.

[uh_no]

were there a michigan sports hall of fame, as duke has, (and maybe there is), that would IMO be the appropriate place for a "shrine" to the fab 5. It is a huge part of the history of college basketball, and deserves that recognition. Would I hang a banner? Of course not. Just because a team was transcendent doesn't mean it deserves a banner, just as Zion doesn't have a zion banner because he's zion.

Michigan can do whatever they want though.

[brevity]

A longer quote from Jalen Rose from the above linked article:

“None of our jerseys are retired, but one of us is the coach of the team,” Rose said. “I watch a lot of college basketball, I see their numbers get retired, and I’m happy for them. I did three years at Michigan, they have to do one black banner, put the maize and blue on the outside of it, and put the five numbers up there and still let the people wear the numbers. Make it a Fab Five banner..."

Honestly, this is one of his more logical suggestions. If other schools can honor jerseys without retiring them, what harm is there in proposing that Michigan do the same? And he's capitalizing on a moment of time favorable to the Fab Five, where Juwan Howard is in charge of the program and things are going well for him. This certainly sounds like an easier call than what Kentucky did in 1992, retiring the four jerseys of The Unforgettables.

Maybe this idea is more palatable if Rose hadn't used the word "banner".

[Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15]

A longer quote from Jalen Rose from the above linked article:



Honestly, this is one of his more logical suggestions. If other schools can honor jerseys without retiring them, what harm is there in proposing that Michigan do the same? And he's capitalizing on a moment of time favorable to the Fab Five, where Juwan Howard is in charge of the program and things are going well for him. This certainly sounds like an easier call than what Kentucky did in 1992, retiring the four jerseys of The Unforgettables.

Maybe this idea is more palatable if Rose hadn't used the word "banner".

I have a hard time getting fired up over what another school wants to do to recognize athletes.

Go on with your bad self, Big Blue.

[scottdude8]

I have a hard time getting fired up over what another school wants to do to recognize athletes.

Go on with your bad self, Big Blue.

Don’t call Michigan Big Blue! That’s reserved for UK, a team that everyone hates

[Lurkingdukedog]

So I'll start with a disclaimer that the Fab Five was a bit before my time (I was in diapers when they were playing!), so a lot of what I know about the situation is secondhand through stories my Dad (an obviously fervent Wolverine) has passed down. So take everything with a grain of salt!

That said, I think there's two separate issues here: the end of the "feud" with Webber and the banner. The "feud" revolves around the fact that (again, probably not perfect on the details here) it was Webber who was primarily accountable for the NCAA violations that led to the Final Four banners being vacated. As part of the fallout from that booster scandal, Michigan was officially required to "disassociate" itself from Webber until 2013. In the years since, there's been almost yearly speculation along the lines of "the time has come to honor Chris Webber" in some form or fashion. Nothing has happened through the basketball program specifically; the closest has been when he was an honorary captain at a Michigan football game in 2018. The athletic department (and to a lesser extent other members of the Fab Five, particularly Rose) have wanted some form of an apology from Webber before he would be fully re-embraced by the group and the basketball program, which hasn't come to pass. But since Juwan Howard became the head coach, which brought Rose back into the fold as a "proxy" for the program in the media, the speculation has been growing and growing that some sort of "reunion" is inevitable.

Now, that is a completely separate issue from the "banner" issue. I think you may have misinterpreted that article: Rose wasn't saying that they should re-hang the Final Four banners, which of course would be against NCAA rules. He seemed to be wanting them to hang some sort of "honorary" banner for the Fab Five as a group. Would that be silly? Most definitely. Would it be entirely unprecedented? I don't think so. There isn't a set rule on what is meant by a "banner" for each program. Some schools raise "Sweet 16" banners (obviously Duke doesn't... Michigan doesn't either FWIW). UMBC raised a banner (IIRC) for being the first 16 seed to beat a 1 seed. I think Rose is asking for something along the lines of the latter, not an official recognition of anything the Fab Five won (because of course that was vacated). I think this would be extremely tacky and beneath Michigan as a basketball program, which has a great history before the Fab Five and obviously an encouraging present and future... so I doubt anything like that would actually happen.

That said, while a "banner" is likely not going to happen, some sort of "reunion" and recognition of the Fab Five, with or without Webber, seems inevitable. It largely seems up to Webber as to whether he's willing to take responsibility for his past misdeeds in order to be included in that.

Thanks for your thoughtful reply and your bringing me up to speed.

[Ggallagher]

We beat you by 20 jalen. Go ahead and kiss Grant Hill’s ring, and get over it.

Not only did we beat them by 20, we were 5-0 against them in that 91-94 period. It cracks me up every time I hear how wonderful the 0-5 Fab Five were.

[MartyClark]

Not only did we beat them by 20, we were 5-0 against them in that 91-94 period. It cracks me up every time I hear how wonderful the 0-5 Fab Five were.

Some folks think they changed the course of college basketball. Long shorts, attitude etc. I don't.

They were a darn good team that came up short against Duke every single time.

I've grown to like Jalen Rose. I think he is interesting and insightful when discussing sports.

Michigan banners? Don't care but it seems a little silly to post a banner for a team that never won a championship

[sagegrouse]

I just saw this on my news feed:

https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/nca...id=mailsignout

And this line from the article really caught my attentions:

Now, it’s Rose’s hope that the school will put up a special banner for the Fab Five, and maybe even the Basketball Hall of Fame as well

I'm not sure why he thinks the school should do this? They didn't win anything, did they? I'd love Scottdude's take on this as well

Heck, I even checked the link and couldn't figure out or remember what this is about.

[weezie]

“...they have to do one black banner, put the maize and blue on the outside of it, and put the five numbers up there and still let the people wear the numbers. Make it a Fab Five banner..."

Where will Ed Martin's number be? In the middle of that Fab Five?

[devildeac]

“...they have to do one black banner, put the maize and blue on the outside of it, and put the five numbers up there and still let the people wear the numbers. Make it a Fab Five banner..."

Where will Ed Martin's number be? In the middle of that Fab Five?

From Wiki:

"...Ed Martin died of a suspected pulmonary embolism on February 14, 2003, at the Henry Ford Hospital in Detroit..."

Best I could tell, the worst criminal punishment he got was probation, so, I have no comment what they do with his "number." As for the Fab Five, my feelings parallel those at tOSU hospital during rivalry week (and the other 51 weeks of the year, too, for that matter):

Xichigan

[weezie]

From Wiki:

"...Ed Martin died of a suspected pulmonary embolism on February 14, 2003, at the Henry Ford Hospital in Detroit..."

Best I could tell, the worst criminal punishment he got was probation, so...

Yah, ok, then maybe his former phone number. In memoriam.

[DU82]

Some folks think they changed the course of college basketball. Long shorts, attitude etc. I don't.

They were a darn good team that came up short against Duke every single time.

I've grown to like Jalen Rose. I think he is interesting and insightful when discussing sports.

Michigan banners? Don't care but it seems a little silly to post a banner for a team that never won a championship

Don't disagree with the first two lines, don't care for Rose.

But they went to two Final Fours (unofficially, of course.) Those are regional championships, and we hang banners for those.

[arnie]

Don't disagree with the first two lines, don't care for Rose.

But they went to two Final Fours (unofficially, of course.) Those are regional championships, and we hang banners for those.

Concur with both your above paragraphs.

Plus, Cheats hung a banner for NIT Final 4. Anything Michigan does with banners, pales in comparison.

[JetpackJesus]

Not only did we beat them by 20, we were 5-0 against them in that 91-94 period. It cracks me up every time I hear how wonderful the 0-5 Fab Five were.

" ... I am proud of my family. I am proud of my Duke championships and all my Duke teammates. And, I am proud I never lost a game against the Fab Five." -Grant Henry Hill, March 16, 2011.

[JasonEvans]

That said, while a "banner" is likely not going to happen, some sort of "reunion" and recognition of the Fab Five, with or without Webber, seems inevitable. It largely seems up to Webber as to whether he's willing to take responsibility for his past misdeeds in order to be included in that.

A Fab Five reunion without Webber feels silly. If Duke were to stage a special ceremony to mark the anniversary of "the shot" without Christian Laettner it just would not work.