Duke Ball 2019-20 through 1st 10 games

[MarkD83]

I just wanted to post some thoughts about the 1st qtr of the season. Some of these are from other folks in different threads but worth combining.

1. Duke's MTM D is back to what we like to see. Perhaps it is due to having the right mix of 6'2" to 6'8" players or...in the near past Duke had a lot of great offensive players that Coach K had to leave on the court even though they did not excel at D.
2. Duke has a lot of depth. Now most folks look at this and track the number of players in any given game that play more than 10 or 12 or X amount of minutes. Perhaps a better way to judge depth is the versatility that it gives Coach K. Against Kansas and MSU, Vernon was very effective. Against VT he was less effective but Coach K could adjust to the small ball that VT was playing. I like the versatility that Duke has.
3. The versatility also adds to having "insurance" against injuries. Duke did not seem to miss a beat with Cassius not playing against MSU and being rusty against VT.
4. For the first time in a long time I am enjoying watching the freshman grow into new roles. Don't get me wrong I love the skills that RJ, Zion, Cam, Marvin, Wendell C., Jason, Brandon...brought to Duke but their games did not change much from their first games to their last games. And last year, the team's best game was their first one against Ky. This year, I fully expect that their best games will be in March.
5. After hearing Coach K's comments after the SFA and VT game, I suspect he is going to do much more "in game" coaching than he has had to do the past several years. That will be fun to watch.
6. I know that the SFA loss will make experts downplay Duke for several weeks. However, don't downplay the two road wins. Especially a win at VT which has not happened for the past 3 years.

[jv001]

I just wanted to post some thoughts about the 1st qtr of the season. Some of these are from other folks in different threads but worth combining.

1. Duke's MTM D is back to what we like to see. Perhaps it is due to having the right mix of 6'2" to 6'8" players or...in the near past Duke had a lot of great offensive players that Coach K had to leave on the court even though they did not excel at D.
2. Duke has a lot of depth. Now most folks look at this and track the number of players in any given game that play more than 10 or 12 or X amount of minutes. Perhaps a better way to judge depth is the versatility that it gives Coach K. Against Kansas and MSU, Vernon was very effective. Against VT he was less effective but Coach K could adjust to the small ball that VT was playing. I like the versatility that Duke has.
3. The versatility also adds to having "insurance" against injuries. Duke did not seem to miss a beat with Cassius not playing against MSU and being rusty against VT.
4. For the first time in a long time I am enjoying watching the freshman grow into new roles. Don't get me wrong I love the skills that RJ, Zion, Cam, Marvin, Wendell C., Jason, Brandon...brought to Duke but their games did not change much from their first games to their last games. And last year, the team's best game was their first one against Ky. This year, I fully expect that their best games will be in March.
5. After hearing Coach K's comments after the SFA and VT game, I suspect he is going to do much more "in game" coaching than he has had to do the past several years. That will be fun to watch.
6. I know that the SFA loss will make experts downplay Duke for several weeks. However, don't downplay the two road wins. Especially a win at VT which has not happened for the past 3 years.

Good observations and good post. I'll just add; It seems obvious to me this group of young men have the ability to play some outstanding man2man but it all begins with Tre. He's able to stall the opposing point guard and make him give up the ball. That causes the opponent to get into their set plays with less time on the shot clock. And in regards to Tre, he's been able to contribute more on offense this season(ytd). I agree that our depth has already helped. When Cassius was not in the lineup and not 100% for the VT game, others stepped up. Wendell in particular, as he had his best game of the season. The depth came into play another way against VT. Duke was able to go small and take control of the game and that was with Carey and Hurt not playing much in the 2nd half. Our depth should be a major weapon throughout the season. As for your point number 5, like you I think Coach K is going to be more involved in game time coaching from the sidelines. This squad will probably need that type leadership.

I'm hoping our guys come back from the Christmas holidays ready to pick up where they left off. However, they may need to shake off some rust before getting there.

GoDuke!

[Reddevil]

So far the our small ball is better than your small ball approach is working and maybe should have been used more in the SFA game. Another way to counter small ball defensively while keeping Vernon in the game is to play some zone. Until recently I would not have brought this up, but coach has employed this tactic for the past couple of years in stretches (especially 2017-2018) for different reasons, and it may work here. I would not be shocked again to see it sprung on an opponent in the near future that tries to go small. Hopefully it stops the layup drill that has transpired too frequently against the standard lineup, and allows Carey the to take advantage offensively.

[dukelifer]

I just wanted to post some thoughts about the 1st qtr of the season. Some of these are from other folks in different threads but worth combining.

1. Duke's MTM D is back to what we like to see. Perhaps it is due to having the right mix of 6'2" to 6'8" players or...in the near past Duke had a lot of great offensive players that Coach K had to leave on the court even though they did not excel at D.
2. Duke has a lot of depth. Now most folks look at this and track the number of players in any given game that play more than 10 or 12 or X amount of minutes. Perhaps a better way to judge depth is the versatility that it gives Coach K. Against Kansas and MSU, Vernon was very effective. Against VT he was less effective but Coach K could adjust to the small ball that VT was playing. I like the versatility that Duke has.
3. The versatility also adds to having "insurance" against injuries. Duke did not seem to miss a beat with Cassius not playing against MSU and being rusty against VT.
4. For the first time in a long time I am enjoying watching the freshman grow into new roles. Don't get me wrong I love the skills that RJ, Zion, Cam, Marvin, Wendell C., Jason, Brandon...brought to Duke but their games did not change much from their first games to their last games. And last year, the team's best game was their first one against Ky. This year, I fully expect that their best games will be in March.
5. After hearing Coach K's comments after the SFA and VT game, I suspect he is going to do much more "in game" coaching than he has had to do the past several years. That will be fun to watch.
6. I know that the SFA loss will make experts downplay Duke for several weeks. However, don't downplay the two road wins. Especially a win at VT which has not happened for the past 3 years.

All I know is that I have enjoyed watching this team develop. They are a fun bunch to root for and while they may be less talented than last year's team, they may be more balanced and versatile. I am happy that many guys are not only playing but contributing at a high level. Guys who were not expect to be big factors like Baker, Goldwire have all had big games against really good teams early in the season. That is not very typical. This team may end up being able to hit the three with more consistency as well. This is a good team and getting better as they learn to play together.

[flyingdutchdevil]

I just wanted to post some thoughts about the 1st qtr of the season. Some of these are from other folks in different threads but worth combining.

1. Duke's MTM D is back to what we like to see. Perhaps it is due to having the right mix of 6'2" to 6'8" players or...in the near past Duke had a lot of great offensive players that Coach K had to leave on the court even though they did not excel at D.
2. Duke has a lot of depth. Now most folks look at this and track the number of players in any given game that play more than 10 or 12 or X amount of minutes. Perhaps a better way to judge depth is the versatility that it gives Coach K. Against Kansas and MSU, Vernon was very effective. Against VT he was less effective but Coach K could adjust to the small ball that VT was playing. I like the versatility that Duke has.
3. The versatility also adds to having "insurance" against injuries. Duke did not seem to miss a beat with Cassius not playing against MSU and being rusty against VT.
4. For the first time in a long time I am enjoying watching the freshman grow into new roles. Don't get me wrong I love the skills that RJ, Zion, Cam, Marvin, Wendell C., Jason, Brandon...brought to Duke but their games did not change much from their first games to their last games. And last year, the team's best game was their first one against Ky. This year, I fully expect that their best games will be in March.
5. After hearing Coach K's comments after the SFA and VT game, I suspect he is going to do much more "in game" coaching than he has had to do the past several years. That will be fun to watch.
6. I know that the SFA loss will make experts downplay Duke for several weeks. However, don't downplay the two road wins. Especially a win at VT which has not happened for the past 3 years.

Some nice points. Would like to expand on a few:

-Raise your hand if thought Coach K would actually play 9 players, not to mention 10 players, during tough non-conference and the beginning of conference play. Coach K has said in the last 2-3 years he needed more depth (or to play more depth). Welp, it only took 2-3 years! Really enjoying the fact we have 2-3 total package players (Tre, Carey, possibly Cassius) mixed with a bunch of players who are one-sided or even one-dimensional (White can do everything but shoot, Baker can do nothing but shoot. Okay, okay, a little harsh, but you get my drift). It leads to a lot of sexy combinations and experimentation.

-I forgot how much I love watching "upperclassmen" grow, especially high potential sophomores. Remember watching Kennard turn from sub-par shooter to lights out shooter? Tre is turning from Double D (distributor/defender) to Mr. Everything. And Jack White is more Jack White than ever. Javin has looked good the last two games but he had a terrible start to the season. Goldwire and AOC have had some nice moments. Baker is a scoring machine!

-The SFA loss was bad. No way to sugar coat that. But I believe it was a great moment for Duke. It's something for Coach K to continue to motivate the team. If Duke lost to MSU at MSU, it would be completely understandable and not necessarily be a motivating game. SFA absolutely is.

[kAzE]

Some nice points. Would like to expand on a few:

Raise your hand if thought Coach K would actually play 9 players, not to mention 10 players, during tough non-conference and the beginning of conference play. Coach K has said in the last 2-3 years he needed more depth (or to play more depth). Welp, it only took 2-3 years! Really enjoying the fact we have 2-3 total package players (Tre, Carey, possibly Cassius) mixed with a bunch of players who are one-sided or even one-dimensional (White can do everything but shoot, Baker can do nothing but shoot. Okay, okay, a little harsh, but you get my drift). It leads to a lot of sexy combinations and experimentation.

The depth of this team I think has to do more with the fact that the players aren't as versatile across the board as they have been the past 2-3 years. When you have Zion, RJ, Cam, and Tre, guys who are that good, it's just really really hard to not play those guys a ton, which leads to a perceived lack of depth. We just don't have those ultra talented lottery picks this season, so Coach K has needed to bring in Jack White more for his defensive versatility, or Joey Baker for his floor spacing, when last year, those guys just weren't needed as much because Zion already could do everything that Jack White brings to the table, and Cam Reddish was able to space the floor, while bring a lot more versatility than Joey Baker.

So in that respect, I view the 10 man rotation as both a positive, and a negative. The positive being that we are developing more guys so that they can possibly contribute further down the line. The negative aspect is that we don't have those lottery pick talents who can do it all. We need to find specialists who fit the situation more than we did in the past. I think given a choice, Coach K would still prefer to have 5-6 guys who can do everything.

[jv001]

The depth of this team I think has to do more with the fact that the players aren't as versatile across the board as they have been the past 2-3 years. When you have Zion, RJ, Cam, and Tre, guys who are that good, it's just really really hard to not play those guys a ton, which leads to a perceived lack of depth. We just don't have those ultra talented lottery picks this season, so Coach K has needed to bring in Jack White more for his defensive versatility, or Joey Baker for his floor spacing, when last year, those guys just weren't needed as much because Zion already could do everything that Jack White brings to the table, and Cam Reddish was able to space the floor, while bring a lot more versatility than Joey Baker.

So in that respect, I view the 10 man rotation as both a positive, and a negative. The positive being that we are developing more guys so that they can possibly contribute further down the line. The negative aspect is that we don't have those lottery pick talents who can do it all. We need to find specialists who fit the situation more than we did in the past. I think given a choice, Coach K would still prefer to have 5-6 guys who can do everything.

I think you are right about the talent level not being as good but I wonder if playing those 4 players so many minutes hurt our defense. I don't think any of us know for sure one way or the other but I know Zion's injury set us back in team development. I guess the coaching staff has a good idea if a player is playing every play as hard as possible. What's the old saying? Fatigue makes cowards of us all? I'm hoping some of our freshmen stick around for at least 2 years and we see a major jump in their play. But I won't bet on it. GoDuke!

[gep]

Some nice points. Would like to expand on a few:

-Raise your hand if thought Coach K would actually play 9 players, not to mention 10 players, during tough non-conference and the beginning of conference play. Coach K has said in the last 2-3 years he needed more depth (or to play more depth). Welp, it only took 2-3 years! Really enjoying the fact we have 2-3 total package players (Tre, Carey, possibly Cassius) mixed with a bunch of players who are one-sided or even one-dimensional (White can do everything but shoot, Baker can do nothing but shoot. Okay, okay, a little harsh, but you get my drift). It leads to a lot of sexy combinations and experimentation.

-I forgot how much I love watching "upperclassmen" grow, especially high potential sophomores. Remember watching Kennard turn from sub-par shooter to lights out shooter? Tre is turning from Double D (distributor/defender) to Mr. Everything. And Jack White is more Jack White than ever. Javin has looked good the last two games but he had a terrible start to the season. Goldwire and AOC have had some nice moments. Baker is a scoring machine!

-The SFA loss was bad. No way to sugar coat that. But I believe it was a great moment for Duke. It's something for Coach K to continue to motivate the team. If Duke lost to MSU at MSU, it would be completely understandable and not necessarily be a motivating game. SFA absolutely is.

If I recall correctly, Zoubs had a "normal" (for Zoubs) first-half of his senior season... then blew up at the Maryland game in February... and was consistent after that, all the way to the NC. So Javin had a terrible start to the season. No reason to think that Javin has turned his corner, just as Zoubs did his. GO DUKE!!!! GO JAVIN!!!!