Duke Football -- Offseason Discussion

[75Crazie]

I certainly do not know what the issue is but poor position coach performance is a reasonable guess. Hopefully Coach Cutcliffe takes a long, hard look at his staff this off season.

There is a piece in today's Nashville Tennessean that shows a different side to the coaching staff. The story discusses how four Nashville area players ended up committing to Duke. Some of the quotes from the profiled players (I am guessing the story itself is behind a paywall, and I hope it is not bad policy to post snippets from a story here):

(Knoxville native and Duke tight ends coach and offensive recruiting coordinator Jeff Faris) is the one that got me to go visit Duke and meet everyone else. He's so enthusiastic about Duke, and you can tell he's a genuine guy. He's a guy that means what he says. You could tell in talking to him that maybe there is something special up there and I should check it out. He has a genuine love between him and the recruits.

They stay in constant communication with me. They always texted me every week and saw how I was doing. It was very consistent.

It's really a family. All the coaches make you feel welcome. There is good hospitality from Coach (David Cutcliffe) to the lowest equipment person. They all treat you the same and are just cool people to be around.

Oh, it's beautiful. He's (Cutcliffe) got rings and pictures of all the players that played for him that went to the NFL. It's like, 'Oh my gosh.' You know, he's just a good dude.

You just know that this guy knows what he's doing. He's been doing it for 44 years. He's a guy you can put all your trust into.

I just thought it might be nice to see a different side of things. Sports fans seem to lose a lot of perspective when demanding that certain people be fired and lose their jobs. I for one tend to admire Cutcliffe for his loyalty to his staff, and tend to believe that there are a lot of things behind the scenes that we are not privy to that are behind some results that seem inexplicable. And there could well be an immediate price to pay, in loyalty from the players, if staff were to get fired. Just some food for thought.

[budwom]

I am in the same place - I am not sure how much is talent vs. position coaching vs scheme vs play calls. I just know that something is not working - we have had pretty poor OL performance the past 2 years. I am hopeful that we have recently recruited more athletic OL - Holman, Monk, Carr, Barton and likely a couple of others. But they still have to be coached and put in positions to succeed.

Jim could probably tell us the answer if he would quit being so subtle.

Yes, tough to discern the problem among the possible causes you mention, but thus far the solution has eluded Cut...it would be interesting to hear the coaches talk among themselves...glad you mention scheme, this is often lost in discussions about playcalling...our general scheme seems to be outmoded at this point, in a world of high octane offense, the dink and dunk is not leading edge.

[OldPhiKap]

There is a piece in today's Nashville Tennessean that shows a different side to the coaching staff. The story discusses how four Nashville area players ended up committing to Duke. Some of the quotes from the profiled players (I am guessing the story itself is behind a paywall, and I hope it is not bad policy to post snippets from a story here):

I just thought it might be nice to see a different side of things. Sports fans seem to lose a lot of perspective when demanding that certain people be fired and lose their jobs. I for one tend to admire Cutcliffe for his loyalty to his staff, and tend to believe that there are a lot of things behind the scenes that we are not privy to that are behind some results that seem inexplicable. And there could well be an immediate price to pay, in loyalty from the players, if staff were to get fired. Just some food for thought.

Thanks, that is an important side of the story too.

[Bob Green]

Sports fans seem to lose a lot of perspective when demanding that certain people be fired and lose their jobs.

The sports coaching profession is a volatile environment. I remain of the opinion Duke should build a statue of Coach Cutcliffe at the entrance to Wallace Wade Stadium but I equally believe he has a responsibility to take a long, hard look at his staff this off season. Improvement is needed so every aspect of the program should be reviewed.

[75Crazie]

The sports coaching profession is a volatile environment. I remain of the opinion Duke should build a statue of Coach Cutcliffe at the entrance to Wallace Wade Stadium but I equally believe he has a responsibility to take a long, hard look at his staff this off season. Improvement is needed so every aspect of the program should be reviewed.

So true, and it is true of any profession. I apologize for quoting your previous post as a lead-in to my post, but it was the most recent in the thread and I was lazy in trying to find a better post to quote. My comments were primarily directed at those on this board who are straight-out advocating the firing of staff, and nothing in your quoted post obviously called for that.

[Bob Green]

So true, and it is true of any profession. I apologize for quoting your previous post as a lead-in to my post, but it was the most recent in the thread and I was lazy in trying to find a better post to quote. My comments were primarily directed at those on this board who are straight-out advocating the firing of staff, and nothing in your quoted post obviously called for that.

No problem. I have no issue with you quoting my post. In the end, we all have the same desire - a clean, successful program.

[jimsumner]

Yes, tough to discern the problem among the possible causes you mention, but thus far the solution has eluded Cut...it would be interesting to hear the coaches talk among themselves...glad you mention scheme, this is often lost in discussions about playcalling...our general scheme seems to be outmoded at this point, in a world of high octane offense, the dink and dunk is not leading edge.

John Latina was perhaps the best teacher Cut has had on his staff at Duke. Look at the work he did with Laken Tomlinson, Matt Skura, Lucas Patrick, Perry Simmons, Dave Harding, Takoby Cofield, et. al.

These guys all got better and maximized their potential at Duke.

But Latina lost his taste for recruiting and Duke helped nudge him into retirement. His replacements have been perhaps more adept on the recruiting trail but none have been able to develop talent as well.

Hence my "if Duke can coach them up" and "Duke can return to," suggesting both uncertainty and a recognition of some slippage.

Jim Bridge is a football lifer. Duke is his ninth stop. He played tight end at college and coached special teams and tight ends at Duke before being assigned to OL.

Look at the prep class that reached its true senior year at Duke this season. Robert Kraeling, Jaylen Miller, Julian Santos and Liam Smith were all highly-regarded, Kraeling perhaps the top-ranked OL recruit during Cut's Duke tenure. This was supposed to have been a transformative class of OL.

Yet, none were starters in their fourth year. All but Smith had been starters but lost those spots.

I do not think it is unfair to suggest that they did not live up to their prep reputation, although Kraeling and Miller could be in the mix for the vacant starting spot at OG. Whether this is on them or on the coaching or a combination of the two is a question for debate. But four under-achieving players in the same class is not a good trend.

And the year before Duke brought in only Zach Baker and Reno Rosene on the OL. Baker started as a fifth-year, while Rosene never panned out.

And Will Taylor, Jake Rimmer and Patrick Leitten have seen their careers severely curtailed by injuries.

Getting Jack Wohlabaugh as a transfer was huge and Holman and Monk clearly showed potential. And Rakavius Chambers is a keeper.

But I do not think it unfair or inaccurate to suggest that Duke can and must do better in recruiting and developing offensive linemen if it's going to compete for Coastal Division titles.

[HereBeforeCoachK]

John Latina was perhaps the best teacher Cut has had on his staff at Duke. Look at the work he did with Laken Tomlinson, Matt Skura, Lucas Patrick, Perry Simmons, Dave Harding, Takoby Cofield, et. al.

These guys all got better and maximized their potential at Duke.

But Latina lost his taste for recruiting and Duke helped nudge him into retirement. His replacements have been perhaps more adept on the recruiting trail but none have been able to develop talent as well.

Hence my "if Duke can coach them up" and "Duke can return to," suggesting both uncertainty and a recognition of some slippage.

Jim Bridge is a football lifer. Duke is his ninth stop. He played tight end at college and coached special teams and tight ends at Duke before being assigned to OL.

Look at the prep class that reached its true senior year at Duke this season. Robert Kraeling, Jaylen Miller, Julian Santos and Liam Smith were all highly-regarded, Kraeling perhaps the top-ranked OL recruit during Cut's Duke tenure. This was supposed to have been a transformative class of OL.

Yet, none were starters in their fourth year. All but Smith had been starters but lost those spots.

I do not think it is unfair to suggest that they did not live up to their prep reputation, although Kraeling and Miller could be in the mix for the vacant starting spot at OG. Whether this is on them or on the coaching or a combination of the two is a question for debate. But four under-achieving players in the same class is not a good trend.

And the year before Duke brought in only Zach Baker and Reno Rosene on the OL. Baker started as a fifth-year, while Rosene never panned out.

And Will Taylor, Jake Rimmer and Patrick Leitten have seen their careers severely curtailed by injuries.

Getting Jack Wohlabaugh as a transfer was huge and Holman and Monk clearly showed potential. And Rakavius Chambers is a keeper.

But I do not think it unfair or inaccurate to suggest that Duke can and must do better in recruiting and developing offensive linemen if it's going to compete for Coastal Division titles.

That right there in red is the CRUX of the issue. Not the only one, but a big one. 4 in one class is not a recruiting service mistake. It is a lack of coaching in terms of player development, and a scheme/play calling that does not put the players in position to be successful....one or both. Thanks for that perspective.

[DukeDTD]

John Latina was perhaps the best teacher Cut has had on his staff at Duke. Look at the work he did with Laken Tomlinson, Matt Skura, Lucas Patrick, Perry Simmons, Dave Harding, Takoby Cofield, et. al.

These guys all got better and maximized their potential at Duke.

But Latina lost his taste for recruiting and Duke helped nudge him into retirement. His replacements have been perhaps more adept on the recruiting trail but none have been able to develop talent as well.

Hence my "if Duke can coach them up" and "Duke can return to," suggesting both uncertainty and a recognition of some slippage.

Jim Bridge is a football lifer. Duke is his ninth stop. He played tight end at college and coached special teams and tight ends at Duke before being assigned to OL.

Look at the prep class that reached its true senior year at Duke this season. Robert Kraeling, Jaylen Miller, Julian Santos and Liam Smith were all highly-regarded, Kraeling perhaps the top-ranked OL recruit during Cut's Duke tenure. This was supposed to have been a transformative class of OL.

Yet, none were starters in their fourth year. All but Smith had been starters but lost those spots.

I do not think it is unfair to suggest that they did not live up to their prep reputation, although Kraeling and Miller could be in the mix for the vacant starting spot at OG. Whether this is on them or on the coaching or a combination of the two is a question for debate. But four under-achieving players in the same class is not a good trend.

And the year before Duke brought in only Zach Baker and Reno Rosene on the OL. Baker started as a fifth-year, while Rosene never panned out.

And Will Taylor, Jake Rimmer and Patrick Leitten have seen their careers severely curtailed by injuries.

Getting Jack Wohlabaugh as a transfer was huge and Holman and Monk clearly showed potential. And Rakavius Chambers is a keeper.

But I do not think it unfair or inaccurate to suggest that Duke can and must do better in recruiting and developing offensive linemen if it's going to compete for Coastal Division titles.

Thanks for all the insights and observations. Great point about the class that just reached their academic senior year - you are right that many of us thought that class was going to be our future OL.

Several of our "misses" seem to have been good drive blockers, but slow of foot - I have the impression that our staff has not put enough value on lateral movement/foot quickness in our OL, and particularly OT recruiting until the past two classes. Edge rushers (see Rumph, Chris and Dimukeje, Vic for examples) are so quick now that OT MUST be really agile and sound in his kick sets, jump sets and slides.

[OldPhiKap]

Duke’s schedule next year seems to have:

Three games we should be heavily favored (Middle Tenn. St., Elon and Charlotte all @ Wallace Wade)

One game we should be big underdogs (@ ND)

And . . . six conference games that are all winnable or losable (@ GT, MIA, Pitt and NC St.; hosting UNC, UVA, VT and Wake).

So, 8-4 is not unreasonable. Neither is 5-7. We can either compete in the conference against that schedule or we have real problems.

I like our slate, all thing considered.

[devildeac]

Duke’s schedule next year seems to have:

Three games we should be heavily favored (Middle Tenn. St., Elon and Charlotte all @ Wallace Wade)

One game we should be big underdogs (@ ND)

And . . . six conference games that are all winnable or losable (@ GT, MIA, Pitt and NC St.; hosting UNC, UVA, VT and Wake).

So, 8-4 is not unreasonable. Neither is 5-7. We can either compete in the conference against that schedule or we have real problems.

I like our slate, all thing considered.

Yep. The team that thrashed VT and demolished GT in the first half could show up or the @#$% that lost 49-6 to Syracuse and 49-14 to UVa could reappear. (or whatever those two @#$show scores were)

[tteettimes]

I have been a Duke fan all my fan days...which dates back to Bill Murray, the” Lonesome End”,Worth Lutz Dick Groat ETC.
I went to the ORANGE BOWL games in Miami on the silver Meteor/Star....
As a teenager I caught the city bus out to the Chapel....walked over and sold concessions...walked those stadium steps from top to bottom over and over...what great memories I have...
but alas...hope...I have none for anything more than maybe seven wins...and I always pray to beat those ...from Chapel Hill ...
optimism here is amazing...I hope it happens...how happy we would be!!

[Bob Green]

Charlotte vs Buffalo in the Bahamas Bowl just started. Duke host Charlotte on September 19, 2020.

[HereBeforeCoachK]

Charlotte vs Buffalo in the Bahamas Bowl just started. Duke host Charlotte on September 19, 2020.

With the crowd at Atlantis in the Bahamas, Charlotte is getting tuned into WW atmosphere...

[sagegrouse]

Returner Damond Philyaw-Johnson earned 4th team A-A with the Phil Steele A-A Team. Past Duke winners seem to include some NFL players --

Duke – Phil Steele All-America Honorees
2013 – Jamison Crowder, PR, (2nd)
2013 – DeVon Edwards, KR, (3rd)
2014 – Jeremy Cash, S, (2nd)
2014 – Laken Tomlinson, OG, (3rd)
2015 – Jeremy Cash, S, (1st)
2015 – Matt Skura, C, (4th)
2017 – Joe Giles-Harris, LB, (3rd)
2019 – Damond Philyaw-Johnson, KR, (4th)

So, who is Phil Steele?

"Phil Steele is nationally known as one of the best football analyst in the entire country. His superior knowledge of the game has landed him on the voting committee for every major post season awards including the prestigious Heisman Trophy."

[budwom]

and off goes WR Aaron Young to the transfer portal...definitely one of our fleetest WRs, we got him the ball all of 29 times this season, good for second place among WRs...can't blame him.

[Acymetric]

and off goes WR Aaron Young to the transfer portal...definitely one of our fleetest WRs, we got him the ball all of 29 times this season, good for second place among WRs...can't blame him.

He put his name in last year too and ended up withdrawing it.

[devildeac]

and off goes WR Aaron Young to the transfer portal...definitely one of our fleetest WRs, we got him the ball all of 29 times this season, good for second place among WRs...can't blame him.

Not enough bubble screens...

[Bob Green]

Not enough bubble screens...

Aaron Young is a legitimate downfield threat. He has size, speed and has demonstrated a great set of hands. The only downside is his struggles to stay healthy.

[devildeac]

Aaron Young is a legitimate downfield threat. He has size, speed and has demonstrated a great set of hands. The only downside is his struggles to stay healthy.

Totally agree with your assessment and wish we had thrown downfield to him more.