Page 8 of 10 FirstFirst ... 678910 LastLast
Results 141 to 160 of 194
  1. #141
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Durham
    Quote Originally Posted by arnie View Post
    https://apnews.com/APTop25CollegeBasketballPoll

    We fell to No. 3 behind Baylor - somewhat predicted
    it's kind of head scratching how the one loss is being treated. ESPN had an article the other day about how baylor is easily the best team in the country, which given the desparity in the computer numbers, is hardly indisputable.

    Duke is unfortunatly punished right now due to the weak ACC...and MSU getting their doors blown off didn't help things. A win against UL this weekend would go a long way in helping prove that we're actually as good as the computers say, and hopefully finally drive the narrative away from SFA.

    In any case, there's little doubt in my mind that Duke is being judged more harshly than they ought right now...especially given we're 5-0 with 3 30+ point wins.
    Dear kindly Sergeant Swofford
    You gotta understand
    It's just a class was offered
    every student in the land!
    Our students all are flunkies
    Our teachers all are chumps
    Golly Moses, a total garbage dump!

    Gee, Officer Swofford
    We're down on our knees
    'Cause we don't want to take down such a banner as these
    Gee, Officer Swofford
    What are we to do?
    Gee, Officer Swofford
    Swoff you!

  2. #142
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Vermont
    Lying in the weeds among the top five is not a bad place to be...I couldn't really care less whether we are ranked 1, 2 or 3 as long as we keep winning.

  3. #143
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Hot'Lanta... home of the Falcons!
    Quote Originally Posted by uh_no View Post
    it's kind of head scratching how the one loss is being treated. ESPN had an article the other day about how baylor is easily the best team in the country, which given the desparity in the computer numbers, is hardly indisputable.
    You cannot find a computer that has Duke lower than #3 or maybe #4 and the vast majority have us #1. Baylor is routinely #5-#8 and you can find several computers who have them outside the top 10.

    But none of this matters. Duke would be a mortal lock to be a #1 seed in our preferred region if the tournament were today. Get past Louisville this weekend and it starts to become very difficult to come up with reasonable scenarios where Duke is not a #1 seed.

    -Jason "Kansas, SFA, and Ga Tech are the only games we have played where the outcome was in doubt at all with 5 minutes to go, right? I'm trying to think if there were any others" Evans
    I don't know what you are doing right now, but if you aren't listening to the DBR Podcast, you're doing it wrong.

  4. #144
    Quote Originally Posted by atoomer0881 View Post
    So Baylor jumps Duke this week to #2, while we slide to #3.
    https://apnews.com/APTop25CollegeBasketballPoll

    No disrespect to Baylor as they are playing very, very well right now. But really don't understand how they jump us. It feels like straight up disrespect to Duke. Baylor went into #22 Texas Tech and won, as they should have. And they went into #4 Kansas and pulled off an "upset." When 4 beats 3, they can move to 3. We went on the road to Georgia Tech, who Kenpom rates as having the 25th best defense in the country, and pulled out a gutty win and then came home to play a crappy Wake Forest team and win by over 40 points. How do you justify dropping us? Especially when you read an article like this (great read btw) from one of the AP Voters (https://collegebasketball.nbcsports...-gonzaga-duke/), we are literally an overtime buzzer-beater away from being 16-0 (5-0) with a top 4 offense and defense on Kenpom and the largest scoring margin in college basketball (21.5 ppg). I feel like this team is continuing to quietly roll on all cylinders with absolutely no respect from the media. It honestly reminds me a lot of 2015 -- except rather than Kentucky getting all the praise, it's literally just every other top 5 team except Duke.
    It's probably more just disrespect of Stephen F Austin than of Duke. I've noticed weird human rankings of us all season since the SFA loss.

    Even if it continues, no big deal. All that matters is that we are likely the #1 seed in the East region if the tournament started today. Hopefully that continues to be the case.

    For me, it's all about Bracket Matrix, not the AP or coaches' polls.

  5. #145
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Durham
    Quote Originally Posted by JasonEvans View Post
    You cannot find a computer that has Duke lower than #3 or maybe #4 and the vast majority have us #1. Baylor is routinely #5-#8 and you can find several computers who have them outside the top 10.

    But none of this matters. Duke would be a mortal lock to be a #1 seed in our preferred region if the tournament were today. Get past Louisville this weekend and it starts to become very difficult to come up with reasonable scenarios where Duke is not a #1 seed.

    -Jason "Kansas, SFA, and Ga Tech are the only games we have played where the outcome was in doubt at all with 5 minutes to go, right? I'm trying to think if there were any others" Evans
    georgetown was a bit of a nailbiter in the last minute...but that game was overshadowed by the next game...

    Don't get me wrong, baylor has a heck of a team and resume, and duke is relatively untested recently compared to baylor.
    Dear kindly Sergeant Swofford
    You gotta understand
    It's just a class was offered
    every student in the land!
    Our students all are flunkies
    Our teachers all are chumps
    Golly Moses, a total garbage dump!

    Gee, Officer Swofford
    We're down on our knees
    'Cause we don't want to take down such a banner as these
    Gee, Officer Swofford
    What are we to do?
    Gee, Officer Swofford
    Swoff you!

  6. #146
    Quote Originally Posted by arnie View Post
    https://apnews.com/APTop25CollegeBasketballPoll

    We fell to No. 3 behind Baylor - somewhat predicted
    Which one of our sixteen missed free throws against Stephen Freakin Austin is now in the running for costliest FT of all time?

    This sounds like a paraphrase of the old Cleveland State story: uNC looses at home to Clemson and the pollsters punish Duke for it!

  7. #147
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    New Bern, NC unless it's a home football game then I'm grilling on Devil's Alley
    Quote Originally Posted by uh_no View Post
    Duke is unfortunatly punished right now due to the weak ACC.
    And Gonzaga is rewarded for winning in the powerhouse WCC.

    I'm ok with getting jumped by Baylor; they have a standout record with some excellent wins, but Gonzaga is going to irritate me 'til no end.
    Q "Why do you like Duke, you didn't even go there." A "Because my art school didn't have a basketball team."

  8. #148
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Location
    Dallas, TX
    Clearly, Gonzaga with it's #242 strength of schedule is the superior team, especially with their impressive 5 point win over Pepperdine at home. Crushing ACC teams by 40 on the road is way out of style.

    Quote Originally Posted by cakerace View Post
    Which one of our sixteen missed free throws against Stephen Freakin Austin is now in the running for costliest FT of all time?
    Of all time? Seriously? Remember when we lost to Michigan State by 1 in the NCAA tournament . . . literally like 8 months ago? Come on, regular season rankings mean nothing.
    Last edited by kAzE; 01-13-2020 at 01:24 PM.

  9. #149
    Quote Originally Posted by kAzE View Post
    Clearly, Gonzaga with it's #242 strength of schedule is the superior team, especially with their impressive 5 point win over Pepperdine at home. Crushing ACC teams by 40 on the road is way out of style.



    Settle down, there. Just about any free throw in the post season is worth 1000 times any regular season free throw.
    I also think that that SFA loss might have been the closest thing to a "good" loss as there can be.

  10. #150
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Cary, NC
    A number of pollsters subscribe to the theory of “if the #1 team doesn’t lose, they will not drop from #1 no matter what.” I don’t particularly agree with this, but it’s a common philosophy. However, the same pollsters have no problem dropping a team from #2 to #3 without losing, which seems inconsistent to me.

    Duke, Gonzaga, and Baylor all have a case for #1. Each has one loss. We have the best computer rankings but also the worst loss. Baylor has the most Q1 wins and is #1 in the NET. Gonzaga has the weakest strength of schedule but also the “best” loss.

    I’m not going to sweat it too much; by the time March gets here we will have much more data to work with and a better case for who the #1’s should be.

  11. #151
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Durham
    Quote Originally Posted by robed deity View Post
    I also think that that SFA loss might have been the closest thing to a "good" loss as there can be.
    how is SFA a good loss? Sure they're not the 250 ranked team people thought they were, but they're still outside the top 100 teams in the country.

    This was the equivalent of duke losing to a 16 seed. At home.

    I'm not sure I can see I can paint that as a good loss in any stretch.
    Dear kindly Sergeant Swofford
    You gotta understand
    It's just a class was offered
    every student in the land!
    Our students all are flunkies
    Our teachers all are chumps
    Golly Moses, a total garbage dump!

    Gee, Officer Swofford
    We're down on our knees
    'Cause we don't want to take down such a banner as these
    Gee, Officer Swofford
    What are we to do?
    Gee, Officer Swofford
    Swoff you!

  12. #152
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Cary, NC
    Quote Originally Posted by CameronBornAndBred View Post
    And Gonzaga is rewarded for winning in the powerhouse WCC.
    Gonzaga and Duke each have three quadrant 1 wins. They only have one Q2 win while we have three. But their lone loss was against a good Michigan team (Q1) while ours was a Q3. I believe that if SFA is able to move up to 75 in the NET, it will become a Q2 loss. Currently they are 89.

    Gonzaga’s overall SOS is weak and I do believe that we have the better resume. The pressure is on them to go undefeated in conference because if they do take a loss then it will be difficult to make up ground.

  13. #153
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Undisclosed
    Quote Originally Posted by uh_no View Post
    how is SFA a good loss? Sure they're not the 250 ranked team people thought they were, but they're still outside the top 100 teams in the country.

    This was the equivalent of duke losing to a 16 seed. At home.

    I'm not sure I can see I can paint that as a good loss in any stretch.
    I assume the poster meant that the loss focused the team. At least that is how I read it.
    "We're only tourists in this life
    Only tourists but the view is nice"

    -- David Byrne

  14. #154
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Mechanicsburg, PA
    Quote Originally Posted by uh_no View Post
    how is SFA a good loss? Sure they're not the 250 ranked team people thought they were, but they're still outside the top 100 teams in the country.

    This was the equivalent of duke losing to a 16 seed. At home.

    I'm not sure I can see I can paint that as a good loss in any stretch.
    I took it as “good” in the sense of a wake-up call that got the team’s attention and resulted in more wins on the season- plus didn’t hurt conference standings or postseason chances. You can argue it might ultimately affect seeding if Duke loses a few more games, but other than the immediate embarrassment may not be very costly...

  15. #155
    Quote Originally Posted by uh_no View Post
    how is SFA a good loss? Sure they're not the 250 ranked team people thought they were, but they're still outside the top 100 teams in the country.

    This was the equivalent of duke losing to a 16 seed. At home.

    I'm not sure I can see I can paint that as a good loss in any stretch.
    I mean sure. But they've played and coached their butts off since and have made a few adjustments. Would it have been better to lose at Mich St? Or Kansas? Georgetown? I kind of like having those wins in the bank. Not sure I'd trade a conference loss either.

    Or course you're right that it's a "bad loss" by any statistical measure, but it may not mean all that much in the long run, and it has sort of helped Duke fly under the radar, inasmuch as Duke can.

  16. #156
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Durham
    Quote Originally Posted by AGDukesky View Post
    I took it as “good” in the sense of a wake-up call that got the team’s attention and resulted in more wins on the season- plus didn’t hurt conference standings or postseason chances. You can argue it might ultimately affect seeding if Duke loses a few more games, but other than the immediate embarrassment may not be very costly...
    I'm not sure I agree totally, as the team came out equally lackluster against an equally bad winthrop team, with the game tied 32-32 16 minutes in, and only a 4 point game with 9:30 to go, before pulling away slightly. Including the close game against GT the week earlier, many of us were very worried about the game against MSU. It's really starting at that game that we've played spectacularly.
    Dear kindly Sergeant Swofford
    You gotta understand
    It's just a class was offered
    every student in the land!
    Our students all are flunkies
    Our teachers all are chumps
    Golly Moses, a total garbage dump!

    Gee, Officer Swofford
    We're down on our knees
    'Cause we don't want to take down such a banner as these
    Gee, Officer Swofford
    What are we to do?
    Gee, Officer Swofford
    Swoff you!

  17. #157
    Quote Originally Posted by uh_no View Post
    This was the equivalent of duke losing to a 16 seed. At home.
    It doesn't really matter, but I'm going to keep pushing back against this point as long as it's being made. SFA is miles better than a 16-seed. They just are. If they make the tournament - and they are definitely favorites to win their conference tournament - they will be a 13 or 14-seed. There is virtually no scenario in which SFA qualifies for the tournament and gets a 16-seed.

    Now, it doesn't mean that losing to them wasn't a "bad loss." It just helps to calibrate that SFA is a lot better than some think they are.

  18. #158
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Durham
    Quote Originally Posted by Hingeknocker View Post
    It doesn't really matter, but I'm going to keep pushing back against this point as long as it's being made. SFA is miles better than a 16-seed. They just are. If they make the tournament - and they are definitely favorites to win their conference tournament - they will be a 13 or 14-seed. There is virtually no scenario in which SFA qualifies for the tournament and gets a 16-seed.

    Now, it doesn't mean that losing to them wasn't a "bad loss." It just helps to calibrate that SFA is a lot better than some think they are.
    they lost at home last week to #292 Texas A&M Corpus Christi, and have lost by double digits to the other two potential tournament teams they've played. If they keep losing games like that, and then win their conference tournament, they could easily slip down to a 16. Gardner webb was ranked 163.

    They're ranked 122 or so...lets look at the rankings of seeds from last year
    13:73, 89,106,76
    14:77, 96,113,124
    15:161,137,126,152

    13 seed seems way out of the picture. 14/15 is where they'd live today, depending on other AQ, and they could easily slip down to GW territory, given they've climbed to where they are.

    Also note that the rankings given here will be artificially suppressed due to all those teams losing in the tournament. If anyone wants to download the pre-tourney data and dig it up, feel free.

    In any case, it's totally plausible for SFA to slip down into the 160+ rank and end up as a 16, perhaps unlikely given what we've seen of them, but "virtually no scenario" is way too strong a statement.

    And regardless if it is a 14, 15, or 16 seed, it's still a very bad loss for what we want to believe and the computers claim is the best team in the country.
    Dear kindly Sergeant Swofford
    You gotta understand
    It's just a class was offered
    every student in the land!
    Our students all are flunkies
    Our teachers all are chumps
    Golly Moses, a total garbage dump!

    Gee, Officer Swofford
    We're down on our knees
    'Cause we don't want to take down such a banner as these
    Gee, Officer Swofford
    What are we to do?
    Gee, Officer Swofford
    Swoff you!

  19. #159
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Mechanicsburg, PA
    Quote Originally Posted by uh_no View Post
    I'm not sure I agree totally, as the team came out equally lackluster against an equally bad winthrop team, with the game tied 32-32 16 minutes in, and only a 4 point game with 9:30 to go, before pulling away slightly. Including the close game against GT the week earlier, many of us were very worried about the game against MSU. It's really starting at that game that we've played spectacularly.
    Understood but Winthrop was the next game so the team was in shock still and really pressing (and then Stanley gets injured on top of things). That one game hangover was the outlier.

  20. #160
    scottdude8's Avatar
    scottdude8 is online now Contributor, Zoubek disciple, and resident Wolverine
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Toronto
    FWIW, there are at least SOME of the talking heads/analysts I've heard recently who have stated the obvious: if it weren't for the SFA blip, this whole "there's no great teams this year" storyline would be for naught and Duke would be the consensus best team in the country. That said, I don't begrudge AP voters for punishing us for that: after all, they can't ignore that the event happened. The committee won't be able to either come March. But, as many have mentioned, the various respected computer metrics do seem to be showing some separation between us and the other top teams right now. Humans can and are obviously swayed by outliers; computers, not so much.

    It's also worth remembering that the randomness of the ACC regular season schedule was kind to us this year: we only play Louisville and FSU once a piece, both at home. We also only play Virginia once, but on the road. If we take care of business and claim the No. 1 seed in the ACC Tourney, I think everything else will sort itself out quite nicely.
    Scott Rich on the front page

    Trinity BS 2012; University of Michigan PhD 2018
    Duke Chronicle, Sports Online Editor: 2010-2012
    K-Ville Blue Tenting 2009-2012

    Unofficial Brian Zoubek Biographer
    If you have questions about Michigan Basketball/Football, I'm your man!

Similar Threads

  1. 2020 Final Four
    By szstark in forum Elizabeth King Forum
    Replies: 4
    Last Post: 08-29-2019, 07:13 AM
  2. AP and Coaches' Polls
    By DoubleDuke Dad in forum Elizabeth King Forum
    Replies: 18
    Last Post: 01-01-2019, 02:11 AM
  3. Cutcliffe Extended Through 2020-21
    By BD80 in forum Elizabeth King Forum
    Replies: 10
    Last Post: 05-01-2017, 05:46 PM
  4. AP and Coaches' Polls
    By sagegrouse in forum Elizabeth King Forum
    Replies: 99
    Last Post: 02-27-2017, 03:21 PM
  5. Human polls - Duke AP/Coaches #1 - this week, anyway
    By JasonEvans in forum Elizabeth King Forum
    Replies: 54
    Last Post: 02-22-2011, 02:58 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •