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  1. #21
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Winston-Salem, NC
    Quote Originally Posted by HereBeforeCoachK View Post
    Uh, I think your facts are wrong on 2012. I seem to remember a 4-8 in there somewhere. And we may be headed to another one. As for "must see" TV, only one really made that category, the 2013 Peach, although the Pin Stripe might fit that too. Certainly the Detroit snoozer bowl and last year were not.

    If we can't have a thread like this, started with the POLITE QUESTION...not statement, QUESTION...should Cut retire for his own good and own legacy...then there's no forum, it's just a boy band fan site.
    My mistake. You're right - Duke was 4-8 in 2016, the year we upset Notre Dame at Notre Dame when Devon Edwards blew out his knee. I had forgotten that season.

    Every bowl game was must-watch TV for me. I loved the blowout wins, and the heart-breaking losses were incredible games. Duke was prepared and showed up for every bowl game.

  2. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by richardjackson199 View Post
    My mistake. You're right - Duke was 4-8 in 2016, the year we upset Notre Dame at Notre Dame when Devon Edwards blew out his knee. I had forgotten that season.

    Every bowl game was must-watch TV for me. I loved the blowout wins, and the heart-breaking losses were incredible games. Duke was prepared and showed up for every bowl game.

    FTR, I have no fault in any bowl game preparation. A couple were spectacular...and yes most of the games were exciting...but I also know that the program has been in decline for six years, and nothing on the close horizon indicates a turn around. And I think that a polite discussion about that on this forum is extremely appropriate.
    Last edited by Bob Green; 11-10-2019 at 04:02 PM.
    Don't waste your time on House of Cards S6!
    -We found out Frank was critical to making anyone else in the show interesting...not a surprise...

  3. #23
    After seeing this question in a forum header for the second time in three weeks, I cannot help but think that the intent behind the OPs was to really ask "Is it time for Cut to be forced out?" Because nobody can realistically think that his retirement decision is in any way guided by opinion on this board.

    Broken record, but it bears saying again: Cutcliffe has a lifetime pass from me for the service he has provided to Duke. He has earned the right to retire on HIS decision, not that of an over-zealous fan group. Critique his performance? Fine, that is what any coach signs up for. But this particular discussion is pointless, not to mention absurd.

  4. #24
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    New York, NY
    No. But he should fire the OC. Loyalty in the face of adversity is honorable. Stubbornness masquerading as loyalty is not.

    - Chillin
       

  5. #25
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Vermont
    Right now Duke is arguably the worst team in the ACC based on recent play. We can cement that standing this week vs Syracuse. Our offense is beyond pitiful. It's not even clear what they're trying to do.
    Personally I don't think Cut should be fired, nor will he be...but if he doesn't make significant changes to his offensive staff, we're going to continue to decline. Right now his mantra that "we compete for championships" has become pretty mockable.
    We're bad and getting worse.

    I know we'll continue our bickering, but I feel compelled to put in a good word for our man hallcity who started the thread, because unlike a number of people on this board, he's been a dedicated fan for decades, attending the games thru the worst of times. He knows a mess when he sees one.

  6. #26
    No? I mean cmon, when we opened this season, more than a few of us thought this could be a crazy rough year, with our offense losing its star QB as well as basically all of its receiving yards, our OL having potential but not being studs, and our D losing its two biggest pieces in Humphreys and JGH. A 4-5 win season was always very possible, especially with two of our OOC games being Bama and ND.

    Our hopes were raised by an incredible start, but we overperformed in those games honestly, especially the VT one where VT just shat the bed hilariously, but this was always a very possible outcome, and it actually happening isn't a cause for long term panic.

    Next year we'll again have a new QB, but it'll be one who has actual experienced skill players, and a D that is a lot more experienced. Also a schedule that doesn't include Bama OOC, and should have an extra OOC win. Duke should be a bowl team again, and that's basically the level of this program, which is a GOOD thing. Let's not go overboard lol.
    <devildeac> anyone playing drinking games by now?
    7:49:36<Wander> drink every qb run?
    7:49:38<loran16> umm, drink every time asack rushes?
    7:49:38<wolfybeard> @devildeac: drink when Asack runs a keeper
    7:49:39 PM<CB&B> any time zack runs, drink

    Carolina Delenda Est

  7. #27
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Derm
    Please
    Close
    This
    Thread
    Now

    Or after we get a new OC.
       

  8. #28
    Answer: no
       

  9. #29
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Durham
    Quote Originally Posted by hallcity View Post
    There may just be fixed limits on what Duke football can achieve. There’s just no excitement about Duke football. Attendance is terrible if the opponent doesn’t bring at least 10,000 fans. We’re not getting 4* much less 5* athletes. There’s no reason for anyone to have much hope for even an eight win season any year in the future.
    Agree. There absolutely are fixed limits to what Duke Football can achieve. I was against the expansion of Wallace Wade and I have long hoped and dreamed that Duke could drop out of the ACC (for football only) and join a conference (Ivy?) where the schools are more closely-aligned with Duke’s academic standards and culture.
       

  10. #30
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Norfolk, VA
    Quote Originally Posted by Steven43 View Post
    I have long hoped and dreamed that Duke could drop out of the ACC (for football only) and join a conference (Ivy?) where the schools are more closely-aligned with Duke’s academic standards and culture.
    This post is hogwash!

    There is absolutely no reason Duke should drop out of the ACC.
    Bob Green
    DBR Survivor Football Champion
    2010 & 2016

  11. #31
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Durham
    Quote Originally Posted by Bob Green View Post
    This post is hogwash!

    There is absolutely no reason Duke should drop out of the ACC.
    Whatever, dude. You have your opinion, I have mine. And I was talking strictly about football only.
       

  12. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by Steven43 View Post
    Whatever, dude. You have your opinion, I have mine. And I was talking strictly about football only.
    Bob Green is the most football wise poster on this board. Be careful tossing stones.
       

  13. #33
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Steamboat Springs, CO
    Quote Originally Posted by Steven43 View Post
    Agree. There absolutely are fixed limits to what Duke Football can achieve. I was against the expansion of Wallace Wade and I have long hoped and dreamed that Duke could drop out of the ACC (for football only) and join a conference (Ivy?) where the schools are more closely-aligned with Duke’s academic standards and culture.
    Probably there are limits. But we aren't the worst team in the conference over the past eight years. Including partial results for this year, Duke is 27-34 in ACC play since (and including) the 2012 season. We have been to a bowl game six of the past seven years and won our last three. The nine years we had Franks and Roof, our ACC record was 6-66; in fact, Franks finished his career 0-30 in the ACC; Roof finished his 0-24. Now that was awful.

    With help from influential and wealthy alums and with a willing administration, we were able to make huge strides in returning Duke to competitiveness in football. Maybe we've peaked; maybe we haven't, but we have won a lot of games the last few years.

    Moreover, the ACC is very beneficial to Duke athletics and athletes. It is very strong in hoops and many, many of the so-called Olympic sports. The economics help pay for our very expensive sports program.

    Ivy League? Forget the freezing, frickin' Ivy League! They don't want us, and we don't want them. In fact, there is a concept of "Ivy-plus" to refer to the strongest undergraduate universities in the US of A. It's the eight Ivies plus Stanford, Chicago, MIT and Duke. I like belonging to that club, but I don't want to play them in football.

    Now, if you want an example of how bad it can get, I refer you to the athletics of my graduate university, the Rice Owls. They were stranded when the Southwest Conference disbanded thirty years ago. Four of the eight SWC schools went to the Big 12, joined later by TCU. Two are in the second-tier AAC. Rice is in the third-tier Conference USA -- and this year is at the bottom of even that league.
    Sage Grouse

    ---------------------------------------
    'When I got on the bus for my first road game at Duke, I saw that every player was carrying textbooks or laptops. I coached in the SEC for 25 years, and I had never seen that before, not even once.' - David Cutcliffe to Duke alumni in Washington, DC, June 2013

  14. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by hallcity View Post
    I am proud of what Coach Cutcliffe has done for Duke football. It’s more than I imagined anyone could do. If he retires now, he goes out as one of if not the greatest coaches in Duke football history. I want more. He wants more. There may just be fixed limits on what Duke football can achieve.

    That said, we’re dead in the water. We may win another couple of games and go to a bowl this year (or even sneak in with five wins) but there’s just no excitement about Duke football. Attendance is terrible if the opponent doesn’t bring at least 10,000 fans. We’re not getting 4* much less 5* athletes. There’s no reason for anyone to have much hope for even an eight win season any year in the future.

    I’m certainly not convinced that a new head coach will do that much better but we’ve got to inject some hope into the program even if it turns out to be false hope.

    Age will probably force Cutcliffe’s retirement in the next two or three years anyway. Wouldn’t it be best for all if he just announces his retirement before the Wake or Miami game? I think he’ll go out with a lot more glory now than if he waits two or three years.
    Yes Cut will eventually retire - but hope is usually washed up after a few losses. A new coach will take years before he can instill a new system and recruit his guys. Duke has gone down that road before. Duke football is what it is. It is competitive now - but just middling. Perhaps that is all it can ever be except for 1 or 2 great years every 5 years or so- but a sustained winner? I am not convinced. Still it is much more fun to watch than the decade before Cut and every so often they surprise. Duke is not going to attract a superstar coach and if by chance they get one- that person will be lured away with more money and resources. Cut is a capable coach- a good fit for Duke. He has made Duke better and should stay as long as he wants. He has earned that in my opinion.
       

  15. #35
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Princeton, NJ
    Quote Originally Posted by sagegrouse View Post
    Probably there are limits. But we aren't the worst team in the conference over the past eight years. Including partial results for this year, Duke is 27-34 in ACC play since (and including) the 2012 season. We have been to a bowl game six of the past seven years and won our last three. The nine years we had Franks and Roof, our ACC record was 6-66; in fact, Franks finished his career 0-30 in the ACC; Roof finished his 0-24. Now that was awful.
    How does 0-30 plus 0-24 = 6-66?

  16. #36
    Quote Originally Posted by sagegrouse View Post
    Probably there are limits. But we aren't the worst team in the conference over the past eight years. Including partial results for this year, Duke is 27-34 in ACC play since (and including) the 2012 season. We have been to a bowl game six of the past seven years and won our last three. The nine years we had Franks and Roof, our ACC record was 6-66; in fact, Franks finished his career 0-30 in the ACC; Roof finished his 0-24. Now that was awful.

    With help from influential and wealthy alums and with a willing administration, we were able to make huge strides in returning Duke to competitiveness in football. Maybe we've peaked; maybe we haven't, but we have won a lot of games the last few years.

    Moreover, the ACC is very beneficial to Duke athletics and athletes. It is very strong in hoops and many, many of the so-called Olympic sports. The economics help pay for our very expensive sports program.

    Ivy League? Forget the freezing, frickin' Ivy League! They don't want us, and we don't want them. In fact, there is a concept of "Ivy-plus" to refer to the strongest undergraduate universities in the US of A. It's the eight Ivies plus Stanford, Chicago, MIT and Duke. I like belonging to that club, but I don't want to play them in football.

    Now, if you want an example of how bad it can get, I refer you to the athletics of my graduate university, the Rice Owls. They were stranded when the Southwest Conference disbanded thirty years ago. Four of the eight SWC schools went to the Big 12, joined later by TCU. Two are in the second-tier AAC. Rice is in the third-tier Conference USA -- and this year is at the bottom of even that league.
    Good summary. Cutcliffe has certainly benefitted from an Administration and current AD that got their head out of the sand and ended one of the worst football jokes in Power 5 history. And, he was a great hire, no doubt about it.

    He has also benefited from the relatively recent bowl explosion, where losing records in a conference coupled with playing several OOC dogs can get you to 6 wins and automatic bowl. I bring this up, because Mike McGee and even Red Wilson had numerous ACC winning records and records of 6-5, 5-5-1, 4-5-2 and 5-6 that were more bowl worthy than some of Cut’s teams. And none of those coaches ever sniffed a bowl game. Also, Spurrier’s 1988 team was 7-3-1 and did not make it. We played some ridiculous OOC schedules in the 1970’s that made several of records more impressive.

    I’m convinced Cut will retire from Duke when he thinks it’s time; but sadly, if McGee, Wilson and others were given more admin support and operated under today’s “easy to qualify for a bowl times”; they may have had longer, more respected coaching careers.

  17. #37
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Undisclosed
    Quote Originally Posted by Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15 View Post
    Bob Green is the most football wise poster on this board. Be careful tossing stones.
    Not only wise, he consistently travels great distances to attend games and fill a seat in Wally Wade. His voice has my respect.

    But if we’re cleaning out old cobwebs, that Polish guy coaching basketball has only gotten past the elite eight once in the last nine years. Our talent level correlated to much better results. Time for him to step aside too, let’s stop pretending that the program is at the level of my personal expectations.
    "We're only tourists in this life
    Only tourists but the view is nice"

    -- David Byrne

  18. #38
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Durham
    Quote Originally Posted by Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15 View Post
    Bob Green is the most football wise poster on this board. Be careful tossing stones.
    Tossing stones? What are you taking about?
       

  19. #39
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Raleigh
    Quote Originally Posted by freshmanjs View Post
    How does 0-30 plus 0-24 = 6-66?
    A very Devil-ish question...
    [redacted] them and the horses they rode in on.

  20. #40
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Undisclosed
    Quote Originally Posted by devildeac View Post
    A very Devil-ish question...
    BDBE5653-7153-4E13-9FE5-72C98999CA6C.jpg
    "We're only tourists in this life
    Only tourists but the view is nice"

    -- David Byrne

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