Premier League (Fantasy too)

[Phredd3]

Yup. He's a cancer at this point.

Man Utd was so energetic yesterday. This isn't a turning point just yet, but it's a step in the right direction.

Man City is going to run away with the Premier League title this year. My guess is they win it by 15+ points.

They aren't even top of the league. Maybe Arsenal really are that good.

[duke74]

They aren't even top of the league. Maybe Arsenal really are that good.

Certainly hope so. But way too early to tell. Easy start to the campaign.

[flyingdutchdevil]

They aren't even top of the league. Maybe Arsenal really are that good.

Arsenal are pretty good. They aren't as good as Liverpool or Man City. Both these teams aren't playing well right now but they're incredible coaches will figure it out.

I still think Arsenal are going to be 4 or 5 in the League. My order is Man City, Liverpool, Tottenham, Arsenal, Chelsea, no idea, no idea, no idea, Man Utd.

[duke74]

Arsenal are pretty good. They aren't as good as Liverpool or Man City. Both these teams aren't playing well right now but they're incredible coaches will figure it out.

I still think Arsenal are going to be 4 or 5 in the League. My order is Man City, Liverpool, Tottenham, Arsenal, Chelsea, no idea, no idea, no idea, Man Utd.

Well that's back to Europe, but I'd prefer 4 of course. COYG

[Phredd3]

Arsenal are pretty good. They aren't as good as Liverpool or Man City. Both these teams aren't playing well right now but they're incredible coaches will figure it out.

I still think Arsenal are going to be 4 or 5 in the League. My order is Man City, Liverpool, Tottenham, Arsenal, Chelsea, no idea, no idea, no idea, Man Utd.

FWIW, I agree. I still think that Man City and Liverpool are top by a bit, despite Liverpool's weak play to start the season. Tottenham, Arsenal, and Chelsea are the next tier, and I don't yet see enough to place them in any particular order, except to say that Chelsea is probably the weakest (but I have a hard time saying that about a Tuchel-coached team). Unless they make some dramatic improvements, Man U will not qualify for European play.

BTW, what's up with the Hammers this season? They challenged for top six last year, and they have yet to score a point in the PL this season.

[duke74]

FWIW, I agree. I still think that Man City and Liverpool are top by a bit, despite Liverpool's weak play to start the season. Tottenham, Arsenal, and Chelsea are the next tier, and I don't yet see enough to place them in any particular order, except to say that Chelsea is probably the weakest (but I have a hard time saying that about a Tuchel-coached team). Unless they make some dramatic improvements, Man U will not qualify for European play.

BTW, what's up with the Hammers this season? They challenged for top six last year, and they have yet to score a point in the PL this season.

Because Nate is now the manager. (A Ted Lasso reference for those who watch)

[flyingdutchdevil]

FWIW, I agree. I still think that Man City and Liverpool are top by a bit, despite Liverpool's weak play to start the season. Tottenham, Arsenal, and Chelsea are the next tier, and I don't yet see enough to place them in any particular order, except to say that Chelsea is probably the weakest (but I have a hard time saying that about a Tuchel-coached team). Unless they make some dramatic improvements, Man U will not qualify for European play.

BTW, what's up with the Hammers this season? They challenged for top six last year, and they have yet to score a point in the PL this season.

Agree with your tiers. And that's what makes this race so exciting. Liverpool and Man City are going to the CL next year. I don't think anyone is betting against that.

But between Arsenal, Tottenham, and Chelsea, there is going to be an odd man out. Tottenham has the best attacking line, Arsenal is the best team, and Chelsea has the best coach. But Tottenham has a weak defense, Arsenal are good at every position but rarely elite, and Chelsea are a mess at half the positions and the post-Abramavich era hasn't gone well.

And to add insult to injury, you have this WC smack in the middle of the season, which will help deeper teams and punish those who rely on a few key players.

[Kdogg]

Champions League and Europa League draws are complete.

IMHO, Spurs got the easiest draw. Liverpool's group have a couple of teams in transition and both Rangers & Napoli are tough road games but if they get healthy I like their chances. City has Dortmund to content with but not much else. I have no feel for Chelsea yet. Too many defensive lapses in the early games. I don't know which way they are going.

For Europa both Arsenal and United got favorable draws. They should both advance.

[duke74]

Gunners top of the table (for now). Only four matches into the campaign, and an easy start. But fun nevertheless.

[Phredd3]

Gunners top of the table (for now). Only four matches into the campaign, and an easy start. But fun nevertheless.

They have looked very good. Yes, they've had a pretty easy start, but last season they lost a number of theoretically "easy" games, so this is a definite improvement. I still don't think they are quite ready to challenge for the title over the long haul, but there's definitely a chance.

[duke74]

They have looked very good. Yes, they've had a pretty easy start, but last season they lost a number of theoretically "easy" games, so this is a definite improvement. I still don't think they are quite ready to challenge for the title over the long haul, but there's definitely a chance.

Agree. We lost similar matches to start (and end) last year. And agree with the year end assessment. I'd be thrilled with a top 4.

[75Crazie]

My Foxes are in free-fall and appear to be paying for my admitted schadenfreude in the bad start of ManU this year. With the Fates aligned against me, I fully expect the Gunners to get stomped later today.

[OldPhiKap]

Tuchel out at Chelsea.

https://twitter.com/chelseafc/status...-6VZ9YEGFYQPpA

[flyingdutchdevil]

Tuchel out at Chelsea.

https://twitter.com/chelseafc/status...-6VZ9YEGFYQPpA

Absolutely shocking. A world-class coach. He won them the Champions League!!!

[Kdogg]

Something must have been brewing between him and the new owners. They are sixth in the table with four games played. I think it's more the owners wanting a clean slate and a slow start (and a one loss in the Champions League) gave them the opportunity. Fan's aren't going to be happy.

[OldPhiKap]

Absolutely shocking. A world-class coach. He won them the Champions League!!!

… and they sit sixth in the table, only 5 points out of the top. It’s not like they are cratering, at least in results.

It’s gotta be palace intrigue. Unhappy players, etc. and that thing with Conte a few weeks ago was . . . odd.

[Phredd3]

… and they sit sixth in the table, only 5 points out of the top. It’s not like they are cratering, at least in results.

It’s gotta be palace intrigue. Unhappy players, etc. and that thing with Conte a few weeks ago was . . . odd.

This is crazy. I agree, it has to be palace intrigue. What on earth can their plan possibly be? And they just spent, what, $250M on new players? Just a stunning move.

[Gooch]

… and they sit sixth in the table, only 5 points out of the top. It’s not like they are cratering, at least in results.

It’s gotta be palace intrigue. Unhappy players, etc. and that thing with Conte a few weeks ago was . . . odd.

Resident Chelsea fan here (am I the only one?)…I didn’t watch the Champions League match yesterday, but the fan forums were bemoaning lack of effort/bad attitude on the pitch. Including some gifs of players rolling their eyes at teammates. In prior matches they have just squeaked by to get results with no joy or verve. I’m shocked but think a coaching change might be for the best, especially if they can get Graham Potter from Brighton.

[flyingdutchdevil]

Resident Chelsea fan here (am I the only one?)…I didn’t watch the Champions League match yesterday, but the fan forums were bemoaning lack of effort/bad attitude on the pitch. Including some gifs of players rolling their eyes at teammates. In prior matches they have just squeaked by to get results with no joy or verve. I’m shocked but think a coaching change might be for the best, especially if they can get Graham Potter from Brighton.

Tuchel clearly didn't love his team, as I believe he lost/sold more key players and bought more key players than any team in the history of the Premier League this past summer.

And I think Todd B has been a pretty awful owner since he started (case in point: he appointed himself Head of Operations at Chelsea. Whaaaaaaaat?).

And a bunch of offensive players haven't worked out (Ziyech, Timo, Pulisic).

But Tuchel is a top 5 coach in the world (okay, maybe top 10). You don't fire him after a half dozen games.

[mph]

Tuchel clearly didn't love his team, as I believe he lost/sold more key players and bought more key players than any team in the history of the Premier League this past summer.

And I think Todd B has been a pretty awful owner since he started (case in point: he appointed himself Head of Operations at Chelsea. Whaaaaaaaat?).

And a bunch of offensive players haven't worked out (Ziyech, Timo, Pulisic).

But Tuchel is a top 5 coach in the world (okay, maybe top 10). You don't fire him after a half dozen games.

I think the only one of those 3 who were given substantial minutes at their preferred position was Timo.

As to the reason for Tuchel’s firing, my best guess is he was losing the locker room. I watched most of Chelsea’s games over Tuchel’s tenure and he changes lineups and tactics so frequently that it’s not hard to see why the team struggled to find offensive rhythm. Other than Sterling (too small of a sample size but early signs were positive), was there a another attacking player who didn’t underperform under Tuchel? Maybe Mount? Ziyech, Pulisic, Timo, Lukaku, Hudson-Odoi, and even Havertz have all played better under other managers or for their national teams. At some point, it’s fair to question whether Chelsea had an unlucky run of overrated players or if Tuchel just failed to get the best out of them.

Several of these players or their parents expressed frustration with Tuchel. Time will tell, but it think Boehly was right to make the move sooner rather than later.