2019-20 DWBB Season

[CameronBornAndBred]

^LOL at your reference to "fluid offense"...I've forgotten what that was.

Only fluid in our offense is diesel for the tractor.
(I still have no idea what a tractor offense is.)

[sagegrouse]

Only fluid in our offense is diesel for the tractor.
(I still have no idea what a tractor offense is.)

The late Tractor Traylor of Michigan? But to run that tractor offense, you have to be 290+ lbs.

[jimsumner]

Look, nobody is saying Coach P doesn't rub a lot of people the wrong way, though she seems to have mellowed. But maybe the mellowing has cost her also. I'm sure Geno and Pat have ticked off a lot of people (and parents). But winning tends to cure most ills.

Interesting point. A media friend of mine who pops up at Duke on occasion thinks that McCallie's largely successful efforts to be kinder and gentler have made it more difficult for her to motivate her team.

Not sure I agree. But I can't rule it out out of hand.

[hallcity]

Interesting point. A media friend of mine who pops up at Duke on occasion thinks that McCallie's largely successful efforts to be kinder and gentler have made it more difficult for her to motivate her team.

Not sure I agree. But I can't rule it out out of hand.

It’s not like she was getting good or even acceptable results earlier.

[jimsumner]

It’s not like she was getting good or even acceptable results earlier.

Duke made the Elite Eight four years in a row and won three ACC Tournaments through 2013. That would seem to be acceptable to me. Maybe even good. Certainly not the next level that many hoped she would achieve when Duke hired her.

[uh_no]

It’s not like she was getting good or even acceptable results earlier.

i'm not sure i agree here. she never made it to the level of uconn, ND, and stanford at the time, as evidenced by the bow outs in the elite 8 and the regular blow outs vs. uconn, but at the time the program was regularly ranked in the top 10 and at worst winning for ACC championships. As I note below, I think some of that was propped up by a league which didn't have any of the perennial powerhouses, but Duke largely took care of business.

I think the current state is a combination of a lot of factors, including the ability of the coach, the investigation, the optics of slamming former players who'd transfered (how easy would that be to recruit against?), and word of mouth (former players speaking negatively about the coach like some did is not helpful), and lastly, the addition of ND and UL to the ACC. Duke had won 4 straight regular season titles before ND/UL joined, and 0 since. The addition of two top schools gave duke a better regular season measuring stick, as well as made it very difficult to win titles...which hurts recruiting...a vicious cycle.

So its a lot of factors.

[CameronBornAndBred]

i'm not sure i agree here. she never made it to the level of uconn, ND, and stanford at the time, as evidenced by the bow outs in the elite 8 and the regular blow outs vs. uconn, but at the time the program was regularly ranked in the top 10 and at worst winning for ACC championships. As I note below, I think some of that was propped up by a league which didn't have any of the perennial powerhouses, but Duke largely took care of business.

I think the current state is a combination of a lot of factors, including the ability of the coach, the investigation, the optics of slamming former players who'd transfered (how easy would that be to recruit against?), and word of mouth (former players speaking negatively about the coach like some did is not helpful), and lastly, the addition of ND and UL to the ACC. Duke had won 4 straight regular season titles before ND/UL joined, and 0 since. The addition of two top schools gave duke a better regular season measuring stick, as well as made it very difficult to win titles...which hurts recruiting...a vicious cycle.

So its a lot of factors.

The two biggest to me were the loss of two of our most successful recruiters. Joy Cheek (who I would love to see back) and Trisha Stafford-Odom (who I don't want to see ever again). They both brought in stratospheric classes.
Why the loathing for Stafford? Because she left Duke for UNC, jumping to a lateral position, and took her recruiting skills with her. While that will forever leave a bad taste in my mouth, there's a reason both happened, and I can only assume McCallie carries weight in each.
Since the loss of of the latter, Duke's recruiting has never been the same, and our success on the court has never been the same.

[uh_no]

The two biggest to me were the loss of two of our most successful recruiters. Joy Cheek (who I would love to see back) and Trisha Stafford-Odom (who I don't want to see ever again). They both brought in stratospheric classes.
Why the loathing for Stafford? Because she left Duke for UNC, jumping to a lateral position, and took her recruiting skills with her. While that will forever leave a bad taste in my mouth, there's a reason both happened, and I can only assume McCallie carries weight in each.
Since the loss of of the latter, Duke's recruiting has never been the same, and our success on the court has never been the same.

good point. definitely a loss not only due to the recruiting, but also I'm sure losing assistants under...such circumstances... also didn't attract other potential candidates to the job.

[dudog84]

Any chance they convince Coach P that this is the best route for her? Resign at the end of this year (next year is going to be a disaster with the loss of Haley, Kyra, and Leaonna) and you get to stay in the family. Her husband works at UNC, if she has gotten even a modicum of decent financial advice she is set for life after making a million a year for a while. Why move at this age? She's not a hot coaching prospect any more, where could she go? Certainly not anywhere approaching her current salary.

With the resume posted by sagegrouse above, Nina King certainly has the connections (and apparently the intellect) to make the right hire for the future of DWBB.

I'd only heard suppositions about her pay, but The Chronicle just confirmed that Coach P is making over $1.3 million per year. Why the heck is the coach* of a non-revenue sport making that kind of money? Maybe only Geno is worth that kind of money in the women's game. I'm astounded.

https://www.dukechronicle.com/articl...stem-endowment

*Edit that to under-performing coach.

[dukelifer]

I'd only heard suppositions about her pay, but The Chronicle just confirmed that Coach P is making over $1.3 million per year. Why the heck is the coach* of a non-revenue sport making that kind of money? Maybe only Geno is worth that kind of money in the women's game. I'm astounded.

https://www.dukechronicle.com/articl...stem-endowment

*Edit that to under-performing coach.

Yep- coaches salaries are ridiculous. Even K’s salary is excessive- but his value to Duke has been significant. Right now P is too expensive to fire and that should never be the case for a non- revenue generating sport.

[sagegrouse]

Yep- coaches salaries are ridiculous. Even K’s salary is excessive- but his value to Duke has been significant. Right now P is too expensive to fire and that should never be the case for a non- revenue generating sport.

Well, there's a market price, and you can decide whether you will pay it or find someone who will work for much less.

I read a year or so ago that the LOWEST salary for a baseball coach in the SEC was $500,000. I mean, you can have a pretty good life in Starkville MI, Auburn AL or College Station TX for that kind of money. Hmmm, ...maybe I should reconsider that statement.

[uh_no]

I'd only heard suppositions about her pay, but The Chronicle just confirmed that Coach P is making over $1.3 million per year. Why the heck is the coach* of a non-revenue sport making that kind of money? Maybe only Geno is worth that kind of money in the women's game. I'm astounded.

https://www.dukechronicle.com/articl...stem-endowment

*Edit that to under-performing coach.

she got a 200k raise in the last extension...I can only wonder what leverage she had...especially given G left because duke wouldn't pony up.

[msdukie]

I'd only heard suppositions about her pay, but The Chronicle just confirmed that Coach P is making over $1.3 million per year. Why the heck is the coach* of a non-revenue sport making that kind of money? Maybe only Geno is worth that kind of money in the women's game. I'm astounded.

https://www.dukechronicle.com/articl...stem-endowment

*Edit that to under-performing coach.

Women's basketball is not a non-revenue sport. The NCAA defines Football, Men's Basketball, and Women's Basketball, the only sports that give out full scholarship limits, as the three revenue sports. Being a revenue sport also means that a school budgets costs and game operations differently. However, just because you are a revenue sport, doesn't mean you are a profitable endeavor. At brief periods of time, Duke Women's Basketball has allegedly been slightly profitable. I'm sure that is not presently true.

Coach G was offered $1M allegedly by Duke after getting the $1M offer from Texas in 2007. And that is what the market demands.

[budwom]

Women's basketball is not a non-revenue sport. The NCAA defines Football, Men's Basketball, and Women's Basketball, the only sports that give out full scholarship limits, as the three revenue sports. Being a revenue sport also means that a school budgets costs and game operations differently. However, just because you are a revenue sport, doesn't mean you are a profitable endeavor. At brief periods of time, Duke Women's Basketball has allegedly been slightly profitable. I'm sure that is not presently true.

Coach G was offered $1M allegedly by Duke after getting the $1M offer from Texas in 2007. And that is what the market demands.

One could say that Coach P has turned her program into a non revenue sport, though.

[Stray Gator]

One could say that Coach P has turned her program into a non revenue sport, though.

Considering her salary, one might even surmise that under her reign it's devolved into a negative revenue sport.

[ehdg]

Coach G was offered $1M allegedly by Duke after getting the $1M offer from Texas in 2007. And that is what the market demands.

Yes but this came much too late imo!! Coach G should have been offered this money a year or so sooner and given an extension at the time and never have gotten to her contract expiring and getting offers from other schools!
I was very upset Alleva let her contract go that long and not offering her a raise till another school came a calling!!

[CameronBlue]

Yes but this came much too late imo!! Coach G should have been offered this money a year or so sooner and given an extension at the time and never have gotten to her contract expiring and getting offers from other schools!
I was very upset Alleva let her contract go that long and not offering her a raise till another school came a calling!!

A bit off topic but I recall an interview with Hatchell following the news of G's acceptance of the Texas job--unmistakable glee in her voice as she talked up the stature of the Texas program. Little wonder as Hatchell was getting beaten like a paisley drum by G, the Ivory Latta years to exception.

[devilseven]

A bit off topic but I recall an interview with Hatchell following the news of G's acceptance of the Texas job--unmistakable glee in her voice as she talked up the stature of the Texas program. Little wonder as Hatchell was getting beaten like a paisley drum by G, the Ivory Latta years to exception.

What is Coach McCallie's record against the cheats?

[EKU1969]

What is Coach McCallie's record against the cheats?

As of February 2019 her record against UNC was 18-11.

[CameronBlue]

As of February 2019 her record against UNC was 18-11.

After years of trailing UNC in the head to head, Duke has finally drawn within one victory of knotting up the series. Seems likely it factored into UNC's decision to show Hatchell the door.