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  1. #401
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Vermont
    K: "Apres Moi Le Deluge!"

    They couldn't win before me, they can't win after me! (yes, I know, it may be a bit more complicated than that, but let's keep things simple.)

  2. #402
    This loss is easy to explain. Tatum out. Mason sitting on the bench but for 1 minute of action. Bagley not picked up to play. Guys, it's all about Duke representation. And sadly, that game had none of it. Come on, Pop. Get with the program buddy! [All spoken slightly tongue in cheek]

  3. #403
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Steamboat Springs, CO
    Quote Originally Posted by subzero02 View Post
    Pop has 2 losses if you count the exhibition vs. Australia. It could very easily be 3 this time tomorrow.
    I don't count the Australia exhibition, but it still feels like we lost to Turkey and would have, if the Turks hadn't missed four consecutive free throws in the last seconds.
    Sage Grouse

    ---------------------------------------
    'When I got on the bus for my first road game at Duke, I saw that every player was carrying textbooks or laptops. I coached in the SEC for 25 years, and I had never seen that before, not even once.' - David Cutcliffe to Duke alumni in Washington, DC, June 2013

  4. #404
    Quote Originally Posted by subzero02 View Post
    Pop has 2 losses if you count the exhibition vs. Australia. It could very easily be 3 this time tomorrow.
    Turkey's massive choke (four missed free throws at the end of the game, right?) prevented 3 already.

  5. #405
    Quote Originally Posted by Troublemaker View Post
    I've primed a video of Stephen A Smith from last fall talking about Coach K's FIBA run here: https://youtu.be/bQm141JPudc?t=242

    I link it because it's the typical take from your average sports fan. Coach K was in a "privileged position" as the Team USA coach (I agree) and never should've been allowed to coach the team as long as he did (I disagree). The underlying assumption of course was that Coach K was the only beneficiary of the relationship, that any good coach could've gotten the same results and therefore Coach K received an unfair recruiting advantage without really adding anything to the mix.

    Hopefully these kinds of takes go away now (keeping in mind Calipari also failed with U19 team). Coach K is terrific at getting a team to play well together in a short period of time. He probably would've kept the offense simple from the very start of USA training camp; implementing an intricate scheme is actually a fool's errand given the timeframe of FIBA. He also would've helped the offense by having USA play at a faster pace than Pop did and by implementing a defensive scheme that tried to force turnovers leading to easy buckets. Those would be my 3 criticisms of Pop's run here.
    I like Coach Pop, and I will of course always root for Team USA, but a small part of me isn't too upset after this loss. Mostly because maybe K will now get more credit.

  6. #406
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Steamboat Springs, CO
    Quote Originally Posted by robed deity View Post
    I like Coach Pop, and I will of course always root for Team USA, but a small part of me isn't too upset after this loss. Mostly because maybe K will now get more credit.
    My one hope is that this spurs the best NBA players to play for Team USA at the Olympics in 2020.
    Sage Grouse

    ---------------------------------------
    'When I got on the bus for my first road game at Duke, I saw that every player was carrying textbooks or laptops. I coached in the SEC for 25 years, and I had never seen that before, not even once.' - David Cutcliffe to Duke alumni in Washington, DC, June 2013

  7. #407
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Boston, MA
    Quote Originally Posted by sagegrouse View Post
    My one hope is that this spurs the best NBA players to play for Team USA at the Olympics in 2020.
    I'm sure Coach Pop will fill the roster with talented, low maintenance All-Stars, or sans Antonio Brown attitudes.
    Criticism may not be agreeable, but it is necessary. It fulfils the same function as pain in the human body. It calls attention to an unhealthy state of things. - Winston Churchill

    President of the "Nolan Smith Should Have His Jersey in The Rafters" Club

  8. #408
    Weird. Internet posters over the last decade led me to believe that anyone could coach Team USA to gold.

  9. #409
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Hot'Lanta... home of the Falcons!
    I want to stress that even though I don't think they played well or smart down the stretch in this game, the guys who showed up and played as hard as they could in China for Team USA are to be praised for giving of themselves and representing their country with class and dignity. While I think Pops deserves a good bit of criticism for not figuring out how to make the deepest and most talented roster in the tournament into a more effective team (and for some of his rotation decisions) the folks who deserve our scorn... the folks who truly let our nation down... are the athletes who were given the option to wear their country's jersey and chose not to. "I want to prepare for the upcoming season" is a BS excuse in my book. Injury rehab is one thing (Klay, Durant, Boogie). I can even sorta understand folks who were exhausted from a deep playoff run like Curry, Kawhi, and Dray. But Lebron, AD, Kyrie, Westbrook, Harden, Paul George, Blake Griffin, Lillard, and many others deserve some blame for this result and should be ashamed of themselves... especially the ones of them who don't already have a decade or so of playing for Team USA under their belts.

    And, being perfectly honest, I think Bagley and Zion fall into this category as well -- especially because team USA badly needed competent big men. Shame on all of them. Representing your nation against other countries is an honor and a gift.

    -Jason "really disgusted at Colangelo and USA basketball for not figuring out a way to fix this problem" Evans
    I don't know what you are doing right now, but if you aren't listening to the DBR Podcast, you're doing it wrong.

  10. #410
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Mechanicsburg, PA
    Quote Originally Posted by Troublemaker View Post
    Turkey's massive choke (four missed free throws at the end of the game, right?) prevented 3 already.
    Right

  11. #411
    It took all of, what, one tournament post-K for the US to lose more times than Team USA lost during the entirety of K's tenure? Pretty telling sign of K's ability to get a) good players b) the right mix of players c) maximum cohesion and productivity out of the players he has.
    Now, the rest of the basketball world just needs to stfu about whether K is the best coach in the game. Duke may not win the championship every year, but he gets as much out of every team he puts on the floor as possible.

  12. #412
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Mechanicsburg, PA
    Quote Originally Posted by JasonEvans View Post
    I want to stress that even though I don't think they played well or smart down the stretch in this game, the guys who showed up and played as hard as they could in China for Team USA are to be praised for giving of themselves and representing their country with class and dignity. While I think Pops deserves a good bit of criticism for not figuring out how to make the deepest and most talented roster in the tournament into a more effective team (and for some of his rotation decisions) the folks who deserve our scorn... the folks who truly let our nation down... are the athletes who were given the option to wear their country's jersey and chose not to. "I want to prepare for the upcoming season" is a BS excuse in my book. Injury rehab is one thing (Klay, Durant, Boogie). I can even sorta understand folks who were exhausted from a deep playoff run like Curry, Kawhi, and Dray. But Lebron, AD, Kyrie, Westbrook, Harden, Paul George, Blake Griffin, Lillard, and many others deserve some blame for this result and should be ashamed of themselves... especially the ones of them who don't already have a decade or so of playing for Team USA under their belts.

    And, being perfectly honest, I think Bagley and Zion fall into this category as well -- especially because team USA badly needed competent big men. Shame on all of them. Representing your nation against other countries is an honor and a gift.

    -Jason "really disgusted at Colangelo and USA basketball for not figuring out a way to fix this problem" Evans
    Ashamed of themselves?! That is a bit harsh. This tournament is basically meaningless to America. The players obviously do not care that much. Fan interest was mild at best. In the big picture, the downside is much greater than the upside for players. Sure, ideally the USA would send its best team to every tournament, but I think the general state of our country shows a lack of pride (or less pride) in it by many people. I personally do not feel Iím in a place to judge them for skipping this non-mandatory, qualifying event...

  13. #413
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Mount Kisco, NY
    It's worth reading the quotes from Pop and a bunch of the players after the game...it shows you how much this meant to these guys and how tough the loss is for them to swallow:
    https://www.usab.com/news-events/new...ce-quotes.aspx

    I have had a blast watching this team come together and compete. I will watch the game against Serbia tomorrow, which is 100% for pride on both sides.

    The fact is that the World Cup is a tougher tournament than the Olympics and most of the rest of the world cares more about it than the US, including the US players and the US public. I do think you'll get a bunch of additional players to participate next year, which I think is tough for the guys who really played well this year but won't make the cut.

  14. #414
    Quote Originally Posted by roywhite View Post
    Just my opinion, but Coach K the great recruiter for Duke was also a great recruiter for the USA program. This was an off-year for interest in the FIBA tournament but somehow I think Coach K would have had more good players on this team.

    For that matter, I think Coach K would have been a better game coach for this group; the 4th quarter performance of this US team today was not good.
    Not really an apples to apples comparison because getting players for this tournament was more difficult due to being a year before the Olympics. So in an era where "load management" is the new big thing you are asking players to maybe play two full years of basketball. I have a hard time seeing K getting many top tier players that Pops and Kerr couldn't get.

  15. #415
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Lewisville, NC
    Quote Originally Posted by AGDukesky View Post
    Ashamed of themselves?! That is a bit harsh. This tournament is basically meaningless to America. The players obviously do not care that much. Fan interest was mild at best. In the big picture, the downside is much greater than the upside for players. Sure, ideally the USA would send its best team to every tournament, but I think the general state of our country shows a lack of pride (or less pride) in it by many people. I personally do not feel Iím in a place to judge them for skipping this non-mandatory, qualifying event...
    I suppose I understand these sentiments to some degree. But I wouldn't describe this as a "non-mandatory, qualifying event". It was a world championship for a very popular sport and "our game" as Coach K has described it when speaking to NBA players about playing in these championships. Note also that Coach K coached in 3 FIBA world championships and won gold in 2010 and 2014 after a bronze in 2006.

  16. #416
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Mount Kisco, NY
    Quote Originally Posted by roywhite View Post
    Note also that Coach K coached in 3 FIBA world championships and won gold in 2010 and 2014 after a bronze in 2006.
    Hey, don't skimp on K's bronze in the 1990 FIBA World Cup, a medal earned with an OT win against Puerto Rico, led by Kenny Andersen's 34.

    The gold medal game...Yugoslavia over the Soviets
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lRxkO48Fyag

  17. #417
    Quote Originally Posted by Billy Dat View Post
    It's worth reading the quotes from Pop and a bunch of the players after the game...it shows you how much this meant to these guys and how tough the loss is for them to swallow:
    https://www.usab.com/news-events/new...ce-quotes.aspx
    The USA win over Brazil was huge, as that already qualified us for the 2020 Olympics, as Pop mentions. (2 teams from the Americas qualify; obviously Argentina is one as they are in the semis).

    Also, hopefully that was a transcription error when Pop calls the French coach "Poulet" since his name is actually Collet. I remember Coach K catching a lot of flak early in his FIBA career for referring to an opposing player by his number instead of his name. This would be on par or worse.

  18. #418
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Cary, NC
    Quote Originally Posted by SlapTheFloor View Post
    Weird. Internet posters over the last decade led me to believe that anyone could coach Team USA to gold.
    Yep, and also that the unfair recruiting advantage he has enjoyed was simply handed over to him, with zero effort or risk incurred on his part.

  19. #419
    Quote Originally Posted by Natty_B View Post
    Not really an apples to apples comparison because getting players for this tournament was more difficult due to being a year before the Olympics. So in an era where "load management" is the new big thing you are asking players to maybe play two full years of basketball. I have a hard time seeing K getting many top tier players that Pops and Kerr couldn't get.
    No way to know, but I'm guessing K would have successfully recruited a couple more players that would have helped. He is an amazing salesman, and I mean that in the best way possible.

  20. #420
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Hot'Lanta... home of the Falcons!

    Jason is full of insane hot takes today!

    Quote Originally Posted by AGDukesky View Post
    Ashamed of themselves?! That is a bit harsh. This tournament is basically meaningless to America. The players obviously do not care that much. Fan interest was mild at best. In the big picture, the downside is much greater than the upside for players. Sure, ideally the USA would send its best team to every tournament, but I think the general state of our country shows a lack of pride (or less pride) in it by many people. I personally do not feel Iím in a place to judge them for skipping this non-mandatory, qualifying event...
    France sent their best... Argentina sent their best... Serbia sent their best... Greece sent their best. The US and Canada (and Ben Simmons of Australia) opted not to take it seriously. I'm glad they lost.

    So, as a result, the US will fail to medal in the World Championship of a sport we invented and in which we have always dominated. You can say no one cares, but I still say it is shameful that we care so little about the sport we have spread across the planet.

    Jerry Colangelo and USA Basketball, who clearly have zero spine and were unwilling to actually challenge NBA players to step up for their nation, deserve some scorn as well.

    -Jason "while I am at it, I should note that Canada needs to fire Rowan Barrett and the other folks running their team for not finding a way to convince RJ and other Canadians to compete... national team leaders, YOU HAD ONE JOB, and you failed miserably at it" Evans
    I don't know what you are doing right now, but if you aren't listening to the DBR Podcast, you're doing it wrong.

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