Great endings!

[Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15]

The movie, Serenity, that ended Firefly did a great job IMHO.
Justified had a solid ending.
Longmire had a good ending.

I like your taste in TV. What shows do you like that I have missed?

/sporks for good TV

[DU82]

Newhart. Best last scene ever.

[mkirsh]

Same here. Had never seen a single Firefly episode...and thoroughly enjoyed the movie. Definitely one of the best sci fi movies of last 20 years (up there with Edge of Tomorrow and Ex Machina).

Sopranos was frustrating for me because they wimped out. Does the ending mean that Tony was killed, or not? Some argue both ways. To do an ending where it's up to the viewer to decide what happens (life or death), to me, is a cop out. Show him die. Show him live. But don't do both.

I kind of like How I Met Your Mother's finale. Also greatly enjoyed that entire run. After Season 3, I thought it was in trouble, and then the last two seasons were consistently outstanding. My kids have now watched them all and really liked them.

And yes, Season 1 of Heroes was great television. Season 2 was dreadful.

Buffy also had an OK finale (that show needs a reboot!). And I actually really liked the ending to Star Trek Next Generation. Mainly because it brought back Q.

I think ambiguity can be ok if it's well done - see Inception, where we don't know if it was a dream or not, but we know that is the question we are supposed to ask. The Soprano's, to me at least, didn't set the table much for us to have the debate - it just stopped, played a Journey song that didn't have any connection to what was going on, and then fan theories about a guy in a members only jacket popped up weeks and months later. I get that people in the "Tony got shot" camp say that he could get popped at any time and never see it coming and that, plus the callback to death being black nothingness, is the genius of the scene, but as the viewer I would have liked the threat of death to be a little more present - have more people looking at him in the restaurant, show the guy in the jacket creeping towards the table more, etc before the cut. Maybe it was just too subtle for me. It's admittedly a fine line, and in the eye of the beholder, but I loved Inception and felt highly let down by the Sopranos.

[bjornolf]

Mrs. Crazy and I were huge fans of How I Met Your Mother. Given the nature of the show, a lot was riding on the finale, and it was going to have a hard time living up to expectations. We, like many others, kept track of all of the plot twists to make sure the story was consistent and leading up to an accurate ending. Overall, it was quite the let down, particularly since they had the first woman he married die young, which was too morbid.

I was also a huge Seinfeld fan and was generally underwhelmed by the finale. It made me feel bad about myself for laughing at all of their jokes and in some ways identifying with different aspects of the characters.

My wife hated the ending to HIMYM so much she won’t even watch reruns. She really liked that show, but it is dead to her now.

[bjornolf]

I never watched Firefly (pick your jaw up off the floor) so I came in to Serenity completely cold with no previous knowledge of the characters. I still think Serenity is one of the best sci-fi movies of the past 20 years.

If you liked Serenity you should really watch the show.

[OldPhiKap]

I think most of mine were already mentioned, but top five in order:

1. Newhart
2. Breaking Bad
3. Mary Tyler Moore Show
4. Carol Burnett Show
5. M*A*S*H*

Honorable mention:

* Johnny Carson's last Tonight Show
* Seinfeld
* Soprano's, I guess
* Six Feet Under (although I tuned out the last season or two, the way they wrapped it at the end was warmly appropriate)

[El_Diablo]

Sopranos was frustrating for me because they wimped out. Does the ending mean that Tony was killed, or not? Some argue both ways. To do an ending where it's up to the viewer to decide what happens (life or death), to me, is a cop out. Show him die. Show him live. But don't do both.

I think ambiguity can be ok if it's well done - see Inception, where we don't know if it was a dream or not, but we know that is the question we are supposed to ask. The Soprano's, to me at least, didn't set the table much for us to have the debate - it just stopped, played a Journey song that didn't have any connection to what was going on, and then fan theories about a guy in a members only jacket popped up weeks and months later. I get that people in the "Tony got shot" camp say that he could get popped at any time and never see it coming and that, plus the callback to death being black nothingness, is the genius of the scene, but as the viewer I would have liked the threat of death to be a little more present - have more people looking at him in the restaurant, show the guy in the jacket creeping towards the table more, etc before the cut. Maybe it was just too subtle for me. It's admittedly a fine line, and in the eye of the beholder, but I loved Inception and felt highly let down by the Sopranos.

You two should definitely check out the link bundabergdevil posted above. Part I, Section A, breaks down the scene very thoroughly and makes the case very convincingly that everything was subtly (yet deliberately) crafted to indicate that Tony was killed by the guy in the Members Only jacket coming out of the bathroom, and that the ten seconds of silence/blackness was Tony's final POV. It's not an invitation for the viewer to decide what happened; it's saying he's dead.

[wilson]

I was kind of mystified initially by the Sopranos ending, but still considered it (and still do) my favorite show of all time. I think it has aged well over the years, and I'd recommend the blog breakdown of the finale that bundabergdevil posted upthread. I re-watched The Sopranos in its entirety last year and if anything, enjoyed it even more the second time around.

To our running list here, I'd add that I found Zack & Kelly's wedding to be a very satisfying ending of Saved by the Bell.

[bjornolf]

I like your taste in TV. What shows do you like that I have missed?

/sporks for good TV

Gee, thanks. I don’t know what you’ve missed, so hard to answer that. Problem is that my wife says I try to justify my time spent by finding what I like in a show, so I tend to find something I like in almost every show or movie I watch. For example, I like the little campy moments they throw into Supernatural. The Scooby Doo episode is one of my favorite episodes of TV EVER (my boys don’t even watch Supernatural, but they like Scooby Doo, and they each watched that episode multiple times, laughing all the way through). Everybody’s seen some of my favorites like Stranger Things (mostly for all the 80s stuff), Narcos, TWD until the last couple seasons, Bodyguard on Netflix, Breaking Bad, early Better Call Saul, The Wire, Godless on Netflix, CB Strike, first season of True Detective.

That being said, I LOVE Bosch and Sneaky Pete on Prime. I think Hanna is more a guilty pleasure.

Do you like anime?

I LOVE the Harry Dresden Files books. DO NOT EVER WATCH THE TV SHOW. It almost ruined the books for me!

How about you?

[bjornolf]

I also liked Counterpart a lot, but it got canceled at a very inopportune time. That program showed a lot of promise.

I liked Banshee a lot. I liked Eureka, but I know it was a bit campy too.

[Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15]

Gee, thanks. I don’t know what you’ve missed, so hard to answer that. Problem is that my wife says I try to justify my time spent by finding what I like in a show, so I tend to find something I like in almost every show or movie I watch. For example, I like the little campy moments they throw into Supernatural. The Scooby Doo episode is one of my favorite episodes of TV EVER (my boys don’t even watch Supernatural, but they like Scooby Doo, and they each watched that episode multiple times, laughing all the way through). Everybody’s seen some of my favorites like Stranger Things (mostly for all the 80s stuff), Narcos, TWD until the last couple seasons, Bodyguard on Netflix, Breaking Bad, early Better Call Saul, The Wire, Godless on Netflix, CB Strike, first season of True Detective.

That being said, I LOVE Bosch and Sneaky Pete on Prime. I think Hanna is more a guilty pleasure.

Do you like anime?

I LOVE the Harry Dresden Files books. DO NOT EVER WATCH THE TV SHOW. It almost ruined the books for me!

How about you?

This would probably be best accomplished via PM, but maybe someone else will enjoy our tastes:

Arrested Development
30 Rock
Parks and Rec
Veep
Weeds
Casual
LetterKenny

Firefly
Battlestar Galactica
Game of Thrones
Stranger Things
The OA
Black Mirror

Longmire
Sherlock
The Chalet
Justified
The Good Wife
The Good Fight
Godless
Homeland
Fargo

I'm leaving many off, but that's my taste.

[bjornolf]

This would probably be best accomplished via PM, but maybe someone else will enjoy our tastes:

Arrested Development
30 Rock
Parks and Rec
Veep
Weeds
Casual
LetterKenny

Firefly
Battlestar Galactica
Game of Thrones
Stranger Things
The OA
Black Mirror

Longmire
Sherlock
The Chalet
Justified
The Good Wife
The Good Fight
Godless
Homeland
Fargo

I'm leaving many off, but that's my taste.

Definitely sounds like we have some in common. OA and Black Mirror are on my list to see. I liked Fargo but it kind of lost me near the end. I liked Sherlock, but it lost me after about four seasons. I really enjoyed BSG as a kid, and I enjoyed the new one as well. Have you seen Ozarks? I like that one too.

[Kdogg]

Mrs. Crazy and I were huge fans of How I Met Your Mother. Given the nature of the show, a lot was riding on the finale, and it was going to have a hard time living up to expectations. We, like many others, kept track of all of the plot twists to make sure the story was consistent and leading up to an accurate ending. Overall, it was quite the let down, particularly since they had the first woman he married die young, which was too morbid.

They released an alternate ending because of the backlash. It gives the proper happy ending. Also I don’t think the mother died too young. There was that scene with her and Tracy returned to the venue as older adults.

In the same vein, Chuck had an uncharacteristically cold ending.

They are not as popular but some of the SYFY channel shows have had very satisfying endings like Battlestar and more recently 12 Monkeys.

[bjornolf]

They released an alternate ending because of the backlash. It gives the proper happy ending. Also I don’t think the mother died too young. There was that scene with her and Tracy returned to the venue as older adults.

In the same vein, Chuck had an uncharacteristically cold ending.

They are not as popular but some of the SYFY channel shows have had very satisfying endings like Battlestar and more recently 12 Monkeys.

I liked Chuck, but not the ending. Loved Alias, until it got all weird at the end.

[mkirsh]

You two should definitely check out the link bundabergdevil posted above. Part I, Section A, breaks down the scene very thoroughly and makes the case very convincingly that everything was subtly (yet deliberately) crafted to indicate that Tony was killed by the guy in the Members Only jacket coming out of the bathroom, and that the ten seconds of silence/blackness was Tony's final POV. It's not an invitation for the viewer to decide what happened; it's saying he's dead.

Don't get me wrong, I loved the show, and I definitely went through that analysis a few years back. I guess it comes back to my point of too much subtlety - I feel that if you need a film degree and hundreds of hours to decipher the finale then maybe it was too subtle and nuanced for even the highly engaged viewer, and therefore doesn't connect with the audience in a way consistent with the quality of the rest of the show. Obviously this is a matter of opinion so I respect other's views, but this is how I felt at the conclusion of a show where I watched every episode from the beginning. And to your point that he's dead with no room for other interpretations, Chase has steadfastly refused to give the answer (even rejecting the idea that everything is coded on the screen). Here is an interesting article on his comments from January of this year, with select quotes below:

https://www.vanityfair.com/hollywood...s-is-tony-dead

He also batted away the idea that the episode contains hidden hints that might illuminate what really happened, calling the finale “no Da Vinci Code.

...

Months later, Chase was back at it again, telling USA Today as he promoted his new film, Not Fade Away, “People still ask me what happened [in the final scene]. They don’t ask me if Tony is alive or dead. But I know that’s where it’s going. My answer is, if I was going to tell you that I would have told you.”

“If he didn’t die that night he’s going to die very soon,” Chase said. “And the problem is the same: there are the number of minutes in life and they go like this,” he added, making a ticking sound. “They’re gone. And you don’t know when it’s coming. That’s all I wanted to say.”

[JNort]

Great Endings - Battlestar Galactica (the reboot). All the threads going back to the very first movie come together for one heck of a ride. I've watched the last few episodes a lot more than I have the rest of the series.

Bad Endings - Heroes. Ugh! What could have been the MCU for TV turned awful because the writers didn't know how to kill a bad villian.

Oof I haven't seen the last 4 episodes of BSG because it got so bad I said I didn't care how it ended..

[JNort]

Gee, thanks. I don’t know what you’ve missed, so hard to answer that. Problem is that my wife says I try to justify my time spent by finding what I like in a show, so I tend to find something I like in almost every show or movie I watch. For example, I like the little campy moments they throw into Supernatural. The Scooby Doo episode is one of my favorite episodes of TV EVER (my boys don’t even watch Supernatural, but they like Scooby Doo, and they each watched that episode multiple times, laughing all the way through). Everybody’s seen some of my favorites like Stranger Things (mostly for all the 80s stuff), Narcos, TWD until the last couple seasons, Bodyguard on Netflix, Breaking Bad, early Better Call Saul, The Wire, Godless on Netflix, CB Strike, first season of True Detective.

That being said, I LOVE Bosch and Sneaky Pete on Prime. I think Hanna is more a guilty pleasure.

Do you like anime?

I LOVE the Harry Dresden Files books. DO NOT EVER WATCH THE TV SHOW. It almost ruined the books for me!

How about you?

I just got into anime a year and a half ago after a recommendation from a friend. Boy o boy I don't know that anything can top the best animes.

[DU82]

Another "what the..." ending, perhaps the first, was St. Elsewhere. Mind blowing, or an FU to the viewers (actually, more accurately NBC)?

I liked Hill Street Blues' ending, in that it was just another day at the precinct and life continued. IIRC, other than Buntz, no other life changing things happened. (It's been a while so I may have forgotten something.)

(And, no spoilers, even 30+ years later. )

[El_Diablo]

Don't get me wrong, I loved the show, and I definitely went through that analysis a few years back. I guess it comes back to my point of too much subtlety - I feel that if you need a film degree and hundreds of hours to decipher the finale then maybe it was too subtle and nuanced for even the highly engaged viewer, and therefore doesn't connect with the audience in a way consistent with the quality of the rest of the show. Obviously this is a matter of opinion so I respect other's views, but this is how I felt at the conclusion of a show where I watched every episode from the beginning. And to your point that he's dead with no room for other interpretations, Chase has steadfastly refused to give the answer (even rejecting the idea that everything is coded on the screen). Here is an interesting article on his comments from January of this year, with select quotes below:

https://www.vanityfair.com/hollywood...s-is-tony-dead

Yeah, I agree that he actively avoids giving anything definitive on it, providing contradictory or vague statements on it all the time. Note that there are some quotes in that same article that seem to be indicating that Tony died:

-“All I wanted to do was present the idea of how short life is and how precious it is. The only way I felt I could do that was to rip it away.”
-“He was an extremely isolated, unhappy man. And then finally, once in a while he would make a connection with his family and be happy there. But in this case, whatever happened, we never got to see the result of that. It was torn away from him and from us.”

I do really enjoy this part of the interview from earlier this year though:

Sepinwall: But you said you didn’t try to plan too far ahead. When you said there was an endpoint, you don’t mean Tony at Holsten’s, you just meant, “I think I have two more years’ worth of stories in me.”

Chase: Yes. I think I had that death scene around two years before the end. I remember talking with [writer and executive producer] Mitch Burgess about it, but it wasn’t—it was slightly different. Tony was going to get called to a meeting with Johnny Sack in Manhattan, and he was going to go back through the Lincoln Tunnel for this meeting, and it was going to go black there and you never saw him again as he was heading back, the theory being that something bad happens to him at the meeting. But we didn’t do that.

Seitz: You realize, of course, that you just referred to that as a death scene.

[A long pause follows.]

Chase: F*** you guys.

[Seitz and Sepinwall explode with laughter. After a moment, Chase joins in for a good 30 seconds.]

Taken together, I think his comments over the years have made it relatively clear that (a) he thinks of himself as an auteur/artist and doesn't want to have to explain his art to anyone, (b) he wanted to have an ending in which Tony dies, but (c) he didn't want it to be presented as a "traditional" death scene.

[PackMan97]

Oof I haven't seen the last 4 episodes of BSG because it got so bad I said I didn't care how it ended..

I binge watched the entire series, so I imagine parts that drug for those watching in week to week didn't for me. It was by no means perfect, but I loved the idea of rouge cyclons looking to break the cycle and helping the humans.