Hatchell in trouble?

[CamrnCrz1974]

At this point, I stopped researching. I know you have your agenda, but this is the 2nd post in the last few days where you have blatantly mis-stated or distorted facts.

And in my previous post, statistics and omissions in your post and presented significant amounts of evidence to demonstrate that Duke WAS a threat to UConn and Tennessee during this time (while disproving your unwarranted assumptions and showing you the incomplete nature of your research).

Duke emerged as a massive threat to UConn and Tennessee from 2001-2007. Anything who says/think otherwise is revisiting history from an unsourced text.

As someone who grew up in connecticut and is and was a huge uconn women's fan, this is absolutely correct. you don't have the kind of spat they did over visiting fan seating for teams that aren't threats.

Exactly.

And had Gail Goestenkors stayed at Duke and not left for Texas, the landscape/trajectory of women's college basketball would have been completely different.

• Had Goestenkors stayed at Duke, Nneka Ogwumike (HS 2008: Top 5 recruit) would have attended Duke. This information came from Nneka herself, who stated this to Alana Beard (and Beard conveyed it to my Duke Athletic Department insider/source). Instead, Nneka Ogwumike went to Stanford.
• Had Goestenkors stayed at Duke, Chiney Ogwumike (HS 2010; #1 ranked recruit in her class) would have attended Duke. This information came from Nneka (Chiney's sister), who stated this to Alana Beard (and Beard conveyed it to my Duke Athletic Department insider/source). Instead, Chiney Ogwumike went to Stanford.
• Had Goestenkors stayed at Duke, Skylar Diggins (HS 2009; Top 3 recruit) likely would have gone to Duke (per my Duke Athletic Department insider/source). This was not as likely/guaranteed situation as the Ogwumike sisters; still, Duke would have been the favorite.

The two biggest beneficiaries of Gail Goesktenkors leaving Duke were Muffet McGraw (Notre Dame HC) and Tara Vanderveer (Stanford HC).

Notre Dame
Around the same time that Goestenkors left Duke (April 2007), Muffet McGraw hired Niele Ivey (May 2007) as an assistant coach and a primary recruiter -- McGraw had been targeting Diggins for a number of years (she was from South Bend), but Ivey was hired and became the closer. Diggins' two final schools? Notre Dame and Stanford.

Getting Diggins has had a domino effect for ND recruiting, with Ivey arguably being the best recruiter in the country. After Diggins' commitment -- and, in part, to play with Diggins -- came Kayla McBride (HS 2010; Top 20 recruit), Jewel Loyd (HS 2012; Top 3 recruit), and Michaela Mabrey (HS 2012; Top 20/25 recruit). After ND won the title in 2001, the Irish only made the Sweet 16 in three of the next eight years (2 first round losses; 3 second round losses). Diggins arrives? Sweet 16. Diggins and McBride? Two consecutive Final Fours/National Runner Up finishes. Loyd joins and makes it a trio? Final Four.

After Diggins graduated in 2013, the recruiting train kept rolling, especially since ND had three consecutive Final Four finishes. Next came Taya Reimer (HS 2013; Top 5 recruit); Lindsay Allen (HS 2013; Top 20/25 recruit); Brianna Turner (HS 2014; Top 5 recruit); Kathryn Westbeld (HS 2014; Top 15/20 recruit); Arike Ogunbowale (HS 2015; Top 10 recruit); Marina Mabrey (HS 2015; Top 20/25 recruit); Jackie Young (HS 2016; Top 10 recruit); etc. And this is not including Erin Boley (Top 10 player in HS 2016) and Ali Patberg (Top 20 player in HS 2015), both of whom ended up transferring (Boley transferred to Oregon after her freshman year and played in this year's Final Four; Patberg transferred to Indiana after her sophomore year at Notre Dame).

In the last 10 seasons (2009-10 through 2018-19), Notre Dame has 7 Final Four appearances (1 title; 5 Runner up finishes; 1 loss in the FF semis).

Stanford
After Goestenkors left Duke in 2007, Stanford made the 2008 Final Four, led by senior Candice Wiggins.

But with the commitments of both Ogwumike sisters (plus commitments from a slew of top 10 and top 25 players who later committed), Tara Vanderveer and the Cardinal have made 7 Final Four appearances (2 Runner Up finishes; 5 losses in the FF semis).

Before this, Stanford had started to slip off of the national radar (though was the top PAC 12 threat). Stanford had last made a Final Four appearance in 1997. From (and including) the time when Goestenkors took Duke to its first-ever Elite Eight appearance in 1998, which started a run of 7 Elite Eights and 4 Final Fours in 10 years, Stanford -- which won two titles in the 1990s and was a Final Four mainstay -- had 3 Elite Eights, 1 Sweet 16, and 6 First/Second Round losses.

Instead of Duke becoming the powerhouse program that had already threatened TN and UConn, had demonstrated sustained excellence and elite finishes, and was set to break through with a national title (and likely the first of multiple titles), Notre Dame and Stanford took over as the perennial Final Four contenders and challengers to UConn (though now Baylor, with two titles this past decade and three in the past 15 years is up there as well).

[miramar]

Resolved, that we don't need to discuss the issue when we should be making fun of Sylvia.

It takes all the fun away.

[Steven43]

Resolved, that we don't need to discuss the issue when we should be making fun of Sylvia.

It takes all the fun away.

Over what exactly should we be making fun of Sylvia Hatchell? Innuendo and rumors? Unsubstantiated quotes from anonymous players and players’ parents? Maybe we should just wait to see how this plays out before even starting to form an opinion.

[Indoor66]

Over what exactly should we be making fun of Sylvia Hatchell? Innuendo and rumors? Unsubstantiated quotes from anonymous players and players’ parents? Maybe we should just wait to see how this plays out before even starting to form an opinion.

Uuuummmmmm, nah, this is DBR.

[Steven43]

Uuuummmmmm, nah, this is DBR.

Haha. Nice. I got a chuckle out of that.

[DukieInKansas]

Over what exactly should we be making fun of Sylvia Hatchell? Innuendo and rumors? Unsubstantiated quotes from anonymous players and players’ parents? Maybe we should just wait to see how this plays out before even starting to form an opinion.

I believe her wardrobe is always up for a little humor.

[Steven43]

I believe her wardrobe is always up for a little humor.

Now THAT is 100% accurate.

[sagegrouse]

I believe her wardrobe is always up for a little humor.

Now THAT is 100% accurate.

Enough. We are guilty of beating a dead clothes-horse.

[Indoor66]

Enough. We are guilty of beating a dead clothes-horse.

We are. She took the dead horse's clothes.

[jv001]

We are. She took the dead horse's clothes.

Mr. ED???? GoDuke!

[devildeac]

Mr. ED???? GoDuke!

Of course, of course...

[OldPhiKap]

Dean knew.
Roy knew.
Sylvia knew.

9F 'em all.

[chris13]

Sylvia Hatchell resigned today

[uh_no]

Sylvia Hatchell resigned today

she meant something to the game at one point. performance wise she was past her prime. if any of the allegations are true, perhaps by decades.

[Steven43]

she meant something to the game at one point. performance wise she was past her prime. if any of the allegations are true, perhaps by decades.

Who knows if any of the allegations were accurate? We’ll never know. The UNC administration weighed their options and decided it wasn’t worth going to bat for Hatchell and forced her to resign.

It would have been interesting to see what would have happened if she had been 47 and consistently winning at a very high level instead of 67 and not.

[rocketeli]

She must of made some enemies, because they seemed bound and determined to get rid of her, even though they could have just not renewed her contract after another season. Maybe they just got so used to the idea that they would have to sacrifice women's basketball that when it didn't happen via the NCAA they just had to do it themselves. We probably will never know what the details were--the reported problems are ridiculous in terms of firing-if you were going to fire NCAA coaches for insensitive remarks and pressuring people to play, there wouldn't be a coach left with a job. But of course, if a company wants you gone--they met you at the door with HR and say you came in five minutes late twice last week and give us your keys.

Just a thought--I love mocking UNC as much or more than the next person, but I feel uncomfortable making fun of a elderly cancer survivor and hall of fame level performer for their looks. It's kinda mean and sexist and I think we should leave that for the "K-rat" fans from UNCheat.

[cspan37421]

Just a thought--I love mocking UNC as much or more than the next person, but I feel uncomfortable making fun of a elderly cancer survivor and hall of fame level performer for their looks. It's kinda mean and sexist and I think we should leave that for the "K-rat" fans from UNCheat.

Same here, w/r/t Dean Smith's nose.

However, her attire was freely chosen, so I think that's fair game.

[golfinesquire]

She must of made some enemies, because they seemed bound and determined to get rid of her, even though they could have just not renewed her contract after another season. Maybe they just got so used to the idea that they would have to sacrifice women's basketball that when it didn't happen via the NCAA they just had to do it themselves. We probably will never know what the details were--the reported problems are ridiculous in terms of firing-if you were going to fire NCAA coaches for insensitive remarks and pressuring people to play, there wouldn't be a coach left with a job. But of course, if a company wants you gone--they met you at the door with HR and say you came in five minutes late twice last week and give us your keys.

Just a thought--I love mocking UNC as much or more than the next person, but I feel uncomfortable making fun of a elderly cancer survivor and hall of fame level performer for their looks. It's kinda mean and sexist and I think we should leave that for the "K-rat" fans from UNCheat.

I bet there would be plenty of coaches left with jobs. Did you not see how careful K was with injuries this year? And some of the comments she was alleged to have made weren't’ just insensitive, they were downright racist. If her behavior, as the limited imfo has revealed, is the norm, then we have set the bar really low.

[OldPhiKap]

So — UNC was fine with her cheating, but not with her being tough on millennial players. Makes sense.

[miramar]

Well, at least for women's sports that don't make money.