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  1. #61
    Quote Originally Posted by Steven43 View Post
    Further proof that USA Today is an embarrassing joke. There is only one National Player of the Year and that is Zion Williamson.
    Yes but it’s printed in color... color!

    I remember back in the caveman days when they were good for 1 purchase a year — they day after selection Sunday... to grab a nice big colorful bracket.

  2. #62
    Quote Originally Posted by CDu View Post
    Zion is just on a whole other level.
    Absolutely, Zion is a generational talent and I'm not sure why everyone here does not completely agree! The difference between Zion and the second best player (probably RJ) in the upcoming draft may be the greatest in NBA draft history.

  3. #63
    Quote Originally Posted by Jeffrey View Post
    Absolutely, Zion is a generational talent and I'm not sure why everyone here does not completely agree!
    If you drew a Venn diagram of people who agree with this statement and everyone chiming in to say that RJ is also having an unprecedented freshman season, you would have one larger circle with a smaller circle completely inside the larger circle.
    Carolina delenda est

  4. #64
    Browsing through the archives this early morning trying to find a particular reference, I run across this gem of a thread. I had already forgotten how truly surprising it was that Zion came to Duke at all. Lots of folks figured it was Clemson, Kentucky, or UNC rather than come to our overcrowded roster.

    https://forums.dukebasketballreport...diction-thread

  5. #65
    Quote Originally Posted by Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15 View Post
    Browsing through the archives this early morning trying to find a particular reference, I run across this gem of a thread. I had already forgotten how truly surprising it was that Zion came to Duke at all. Lots of folks figured it was Clemson, Kentucky, or UNC rather than come to our overcrowded roster.

    https://forums.dukebasketballreport...diction-thread
    I hadn't recently thought about Zion's surprise commitment until last weekend. Watching Clemson fail to make the NCAA field left me feeling sorry for the Tigers. Now more so than ever, what Zion could have done for their program is probably excruciating for their fan base to contemplate. I really see Zion serving as one of Duke basketball's greatest ambassadors for decades to come.

  6. #66
    Quote Originally Posted by subzero02 View Post
    I hadn't recently thought about Zion's surprise commitment until last weekend. Watching Clemson fail to make the NCAA field left me feeling sorry for the Tigers. Now more so than ever, what Zion could have done for their program is probably excruciating for their fan base to contemplate. I really see Zion serving as a great ambassador for Duke basketball for decades to come.
    Zion would have inexorably changed the perception of Clemson basketball for a generation at least. And I really don't think that's hyperbole.

  7. #67
    Quote Originally Posted by cato View Post
    If you drew a Venn diagram of people who agree with this statement and everyone chiming in to say that RJ is also having an unprecedented freshman season, you would have one larger circle with a smaller circle completely inside the larger circle.

    Well yeah, if you restrict yourself to two dimensions.
    The University of North Carolina
    Where CHEATING is a Way of Life

  8. #68
    Quote Originally Posted by madscavenger View Post
    Well yeah, if you restrict yourself to two dimensions.
    *makes Inception sound*

    BWAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHH!!!!

    (but seriously, have a spork)

  9. #69
    Quote Originally Posted by OldPhiKap View Post
    I would rather congratulate RJ than argue why he shouldn't have gotten it. But that's just me.

    RJ had a great year and has been an outstanding representative of our institution. Well done, and congratulations.
    Exactly. This embarrassment of riches for Duke fans doesn’t seem worthy of outrage. Congrats to RJ!

  10. #70
    Quote Originally Posted by Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15 View Post
    Browsing through the archives this early morning trying to find a particular reference, I run across this gem of a thread. I had already forgotten how truly surprising it was that Zion came to Duke at all. Lots of folks figured it was Clemson, Kentucky, or UNC rather than come to our overcrowded roster.

    https://forums.dukebasketballreport...diction-thread
    Right and no one expected that Duke would be a marginal top 10 team without Zion but that is the reality. If Coach K “missed” on as many recruits as Roy missed on but managed to earn a #1 seed, no one would question him getting COY consideration. I despise the Cheaters but either Roy is consistently lucky or he’s doing something right.

  11. #71
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Quote Originally Posted by lotusland View Post
    I despise the Cheaters but either Roy is consistently lucky or he’s doing something right.
    Eh, Roy didn't do anything besides take advantage of Duke's misfortune and then mostly holding serve in other games. Personally I think UNC is at best a 2-seed (and they were 0-2 against fellow 2-seeds UK and Michigan). There are no statistical systems or gambling odds that I'm aware of that have UNC on the level of the 1-seeds Duke, UVA, and Gonzaga. It's just that while the selection committee did a good job discounting Duke's losses without Zion, they didn't do a good job discounting any opponent victories over Duke with Zion out.

    I've said this before, but I'm okay with giving Coach K and Roy incompletes instead of trying to grade what would've happened had Zion stayed healthy.

  12. #72
    Quote Originally Posted by lotusland View Post
    Right and no one expected that Duke would be a marginal top 10 team without Zion but that is the reality. If Coach K “missed” on as many recruits as Roy missed on but managed to earn a #1 seed, no one would question him getting COY consideration. I despise the Cheaters but either Roy is consistently lucky or he’s doing something right.
    I mean, yes, in principle, it has been shown that our lineup has a hole in it when Zion isn't playing. But, I feel that if this was a team that did not have Zion on its roster, things, well, just go differently. Meaning, our team played six games without him after having him on their squad for the previous few months. Meaning, if Zion is not a part of this team, everything develops in a different direction.

    Are we the overall number one seed of the tournament? Probably not. But, our team would simply have a different identity.
    Let's go Duke!

  13. #73
    Quote Originally Posted by Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15 View Post
    Browsing through the archives this early morning trying to find a particular reference, I run across this gem of a thread. I had already forgotten how truly surprising it was that Zion came to Duke at all. Lots of folks figured it was Clemson, Kentucky, or UNC rather than come to our overcrowded roster.

    https://forums.dukebasketballreport...diction-thread
    I just read through that Zion announcement thread and it’s HILARIOUS. I wish a mod would re-open it so that we could reply to previous comments. There were actually posters thinking Zion was going to chose Kentucky because of Drake!! I didn’t realize Drake was on the UK staff. I guess I should start keeping up with A Sea of Blue.
    Last edited by Steven43; 03-20-2019 at 10:04 AM.

  14. #74
    Quote Originally Posted by Troublemaker View Post
    I've said this before, but I'm okay with giving Coach K and Roy incompletes instead of trying to grade what would've happened had Zion stayed healthy.
    As a CEO, I do not agree with that wimpy mentality. I try to recruit and retain the best employees possible, but I should be graded on our actual results. No doubt, many CEOs have a plethora of excuses for why their results are lame. Their wimpy mentality is a significant part of the true reason their results are lame.

    To be clear, I know many CEOs who would be glad to make $9 million a year and be given an incomplete every time they lose a star player. They work hard to recruit and retain Board members with your outlook. I seriously doubt Coach K is one of them.

  15. #75
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Quote Originally Posted by Jeffrey View Post
    As a CEO, I do not agree with that wimpy mentality. I try to recruit and retain the best employees possible, but I should be graded on our actual results. No doubt, many CEOs have a plethora of excuses for why their results are lame. Their wimpy mentality is a significant part of the true reason their results are lame.

    To be clear, I know many CEOs who would be glad to make $9 million a year and be given an incomplete every time they lose a star player. They work hard to recruit and retain Board members with your outlook. I seriously doubt Coach K is one of them.
    Yeah, I don't even know what you're talking about. I think you're trying to stretch some sort of business life-lesson into a conversation where it would otherwise be irrelevant.

    Coach K's given "grade" is an A+ -- can't do better than an overall #1 seed. He was rewarded by those grading him, and I'm sure he's happy with that grade. All I'm saying is that UNC got an undeserved "A." You can disagree -- I can't see how -- but don't force an asinine business comparison. Thanks. You yourself are not asinine.

  16. #76
    Quote Originally Posted by Troublemaker View Post
    Yeah, I don't even know what you're talking about. I think you're trying to stretch some sort of business life-lesson into a conversation where it would otherwise be irrelevant.

    Coach K's given "grade" is an A+ -- can't do better than an overall #1 seed. He was rewarded by those grading him, and I'm sure he's happy with that grade. All I'm saying is that UNC got an undeserved "A." You can disagree -- I can't see how -- but don't force an asinine business comparison. Thanks. You yourself are not asinine.
    Yeah, I re-read his post three or four times and could not make heads nor tails of it. Maybe he’ll offer an explanatory post.

  17. #77
    Quote Originally Posted by Troublemaker View Post
    Yeah, I don't even know what you're talking about. I think you're trying to stretch some sort of business life-lesson into a conversation where it would otherwise be irrelevant.

    Coach K's given "grade" is an A+ -- can't do better than an overall #1 seed. He was rewarded by those grading him, and I'm sure he's happy with that grade. All I'm saying is that UNC got an undeserved "A." You can disagree -- I can't see how -- but don't force an asinine business comparison. Thanks. You yourself are not asinine.
    Heaven help the fool who does not realize Duke Basketball is a business. Duke has the second most profitable college basketball program making over $31,000,000 per year.

    UNC won two out of three against Duke and, IMO, deserves credit for the wins (not your "incomplete"). IMO, UNC earned a 1 seed and the ACC earned three 1 seeds.
    Last edited by Jeffrey; 03-20-2019 at 11:32 AM.

  18. #78
    Join Date
    Feb 2016
    Location
    Atlanta
    Quote Originally Posted by Steven43 View Post
    Yeah, I re-read his post three or four times and could not make heads nor tails of it. Maybe he’ll offer an explanatory post.
    CEO's don't have to explain themselves and never have to say "I'm sorry!"

  19. #79
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    NC
    Quote Originally Posted by Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15 View Post
    I mean, yes, in principle, it has been shown that our lineup has a hole in it when Zion isn't playing. But, I feel that if this was a team that did not have Zion on its roster, things, well, just go differently. Meaning, our team played six games without him after having him on their squad for the previous few months. Meaning, if Zion is not a part of this team, everything develops in a different direction.

    Are we the overall number one seed of the tournament? Probably not. But, our team would simply have a different identity.
    Not to mention that recruiting might have been different. Maybe we land EJ Montgomery if Zion doesn't come to Duke. Not that he would replace Zion at all, but he would give us another weapon among our post guys. And, like you said, we'd just have developed the team differently. Probably not as good as this team (because Zion is Zion), but not nearly the same as just this team today without Zion.

  20. #80
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Quote Originally Posted by Jeffrey View Post
    Heaven help the fool who does not realize Duke Basketball is a business. Duke has the second most profitable college basketball program making over $31,000,000.00 per year.
    And nowhere did I say that Duke basketball is not a business.

    But I still don't see why UNC deserves a 1 seed and Roy Williams deserves national COY, haha. What are the business reasons to reward UNC and Roy over others?

    I understand you're a CEO -- you, uh, drop that "fact"* frequently on here -- but that doesn't mean I can't disagree with whatever business comparison you're forcing into the conversation at any one time.

    * Technically, anyone can be anything on here. I've been a clown car mechanic before on DBR (and might still be)

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