MBB: Duke 70, ... Cheating Bastards 79 Post-Game Thread

[ns7]

the defense HAS been markedly worse since zion went out, I don't think there's a quesiton about that, but it's still largley been very good. I'm guessing abberations like the VT game would be less prominent if we had a whole year to design a defense around not having zion, vs covering the gap while he's out injured.

I did some quick math because I'm on my phone so it isn't the best analysis. The defense has been at 90.1 the last six games vs a season average of 88.1. The offense has been at a 110.5 the last six games vs a season average of 119.6.

I would say the defense is essentially in line with the season average but the offense is worse. Plus the game we are discussing was a better defensive effort than the season average.

[uh_no]

I did some quick math because I'm on my phone so it isn't the best analysis. The defense has been at 90.1 the last six games vs a season average of 88.1. The offense has been at a 110.5 the last six games vs a season average of 119.6.

I would say the defense is essentially in line with the season average but the offense is worse. Plus the game we are discussing was a better defensive effort than the season average.

90 is worse than 88. which would prove my point...which was only that the defense has been worse...nothing more nothing less...


That said, i'm not sure it's true anyway. on 2-20, before the carolina game...we were at 88.1. Effectively exactly where we are now. That That said, i'm confident we don't give up what we did to VT with zion on the floor.

That that that said, our turnover% is almost assuredly worse...which means even though we're compensating for the lack of turnovers in other areas on defense, which is great, we're not helping in generating the offense you point out is a problem.

[gep]

I’ve noticed RJ slacking on D as well, going all the way back to the Gonzaga game. But I willl say that the times I see him standing around and watching a layup are usually under the basket. When he’s out on the perimeter he does play hard D. So maybe he just feels like there’s no point in trying to contest underneath when his man or someone else’s man is already beat and he’s unlikely to do anything besides pick up a foul. Plus even though he doesn’t look like he’s working hard to box out, he does actually get a lot of rebounds so I’m willing to cut him some slack there.

I have to agree with others too, in an ideal world the guy could go 100% on both ends of the floor all the time, but when he’s playing 40 minutes a game and is our only offensive option, something has got to give.

I always thought that in many cases, if an opposing player already beat his man and is assured a layup, it doesn't quite make sense to try to challenge. At worst, commits a foul. At best, the opposing player misses. Otherwise, ends up on the floor, or way out of position. I recall seeing many defensive players just "let it go", which many times, makes sense to me.

And I think I've heard of many NBA players that can't go 100% on both ends of the court all the time. And RJ is playing almost the entire game every time... so maybe cut him some slack here too

[UrinalCake]

^ the other end of the spectrum would be when the defender leaves his man to try to block the shot, which he has very little chance of doing, and in the process leaves his own man wide open for a clear path to the offensive board and put back. This happened numerous times in the second half. No reason to go and challenge that shot, especially when the primary defender is already in good position. Just stay on your man and clean up the board. What RJ does - just standing there and watching - would literally be better than running over to the ball and forgetting your man.

[Wander]

Could RJ yet be the weakest link in the defense? It's possible...but more because we have a lot of really good defense players than because he is some exceptional liability.

IMO we have two elite defenders in Tre and Zion. When both are playing, our team defense is elite, and when one is playing, our team defense is still pretty good. If we ever had to play without both of them, I think the defensive liabilities of the other players would be exposed and our team defense would be bad-to-average. We'd look similar to the 2014 team and be similarly in danger of an early upset.

Of course, most teams probably would not be good at defense if you took away their two best defenders, so I'm not sure that the above statements mean anything horrible.

[uh_no]

IMO we have two elite defenders in Tre and Zion. When both are playing, our team defense is elite, and when one is playing, our team defense is still pretty good. If we ever had to play without both of them, I think the defensive liabilities of the other players would be exposed and our team defense would be bad-to-average. We'd look similar to the 2014 team and be similarly in danger of an early upset.

Of course, most teams probably would not be good at defense if you took away their two best defenders, so I'm not sure that the above statements mean anything horrible.

the 2014 team was the #1 offense in the country. This team wouldn't be.

[robed deity]

the 2014 team was the #1 offense in the country. This team wouldn't be.

That team was also the single worst defensive team I can remember under K. They just struggled to get stops against everyone. And yes, all the more frustrating because they could score at will.

[uh_no]

That team was also the single worst defensive team I can remember under K. They just struggled to get stops against everyone. And yes, all the more frustrating because they could score at will.

i had nightmares of opponents taking shots and rodney hood just staring at them as people ran around him to grab boards. I didn't, and still haven't, watched any of Duke's games from the tournament that year.

[ns7]

90 is worse than 88. which would prove my point...which was only that the defense has been worse...nothing more nothing less...


That said, i'm not sure it's true anyway. on 2-20, before the carolina game...we were at 88.1. Effectively exactly where we are now. That That said, i'm confident we don't give up what we did to VT with zion on the floor.

That that that said, our turnover% is almost assuredly worse...which means even though we're compensating for the lack of turnovers in other areas on defense, which is great, we're not helping in generating the offense you point out is a problem.

C'mon, you said markedly worse, and 90 over a six game span is not a statistically significant difference compared to a season average of 88. Like you said it hardly moved the overall average.

I agree that a lack of turnovers is hurting the offense.

[robed deity]

i had nightmares of opponents taking shots and rodney hood just staring at them as people ran around him to grab boards. I didn't, and still haven't, watched any of Duke's games from the tournament that year.

You mean the NCAA? Because there was 1, and it was very frustrating. As I remember, they played ok in the ACC, but simply couldn't get a stop against Virginia.

[uh_no]

You mean the NCAA? Because there was 1, and it was very frustrating.

That was the joke

[robed deity]

That was the joke

Ah, ha my bad. It's late-have Mercer..errr mercy on me.

[Skydog]

I'm glad I logged on this afternoon to see the latest about RJ. First, he was a ball hog and played out of control. Then he took too many bad shots. Of course once Zion went down and RJ showed us just how good he can be we've now discovered another fault in RJ's game. He doesn't play hard enough on the defensive end.

Maybe once RJ moves onto the pros folks around here will finally appreciate just how good a player this kid actually is.

I say I love the guy and he's absolutely magical on offense but also that when we give up easy layups/open threes he's usually the culprit and that somehow makes me an unappreciative RJ basher? Believe me I appreciate RJ - his offense single-handedly has kept us in and won us many games. I also think he's become one of the best drivers in traffic and finishers I've ever seen in college b-ball. The fact that I comment on what I see him doing or not doing on defense doesn't make me a hater. Lighten up.