Pats owner Robert Kraft caught in sex trafficking sting

[DUKIECB]

ESPN's Adam Schefter is reporting that Kraft isn't even the biggest name involved in the investigation but isn't saying who it is. If so, why would they single out Kraft?

As to the sex trafficking, I agree that is horrible if that was the situation and they should be trying to do something about it. As I said, I do not condone his behavior but as I also said it is a misdemeanor offense. When Jim Irsay of the Colts was suspended for 6 games and fined $500,000 by the league it was for illegal and repeated use of cocaine. I think this is apples and oranges. I cannot believe I'm defending Robert Kraft, I hate the Patriots.

[dudog84]

I’m also wondering if this wasn’t blown out of proportion

I think I see what you did there, but I'm not really sure.

[HereBeforeCoachK]

I’m also wondering if this wasn’t blown out of proportion

...I knew someone would push the envelope.....

[camion]

Not sure if you've been paying attention to the media lately, but the only way you will be spared is if you forcefully find some sand to put your head in.

Not sure if it's better, but here is something different.

[HereBeforeCoachK]

It appears some pruning has been done on this thread....

[J4Kop99]

This is part of a bigger sex-trafficking ring -- the details of which are pretty awful. Kraft happened to be involved and is a huge name and thus drawing a ton of attention to this. In a weird twist, the father of a childhood friend appeared on a list of people involved. Not good.

Interesting day in the news:

This happened, R. Kelly was indicted on 10 counts of criminal sexual abuse AND a federal judge ruled that federal prosecutors (under former U.S. Attorney Alex Acosta) broke the law when they concealed a plea agreement for victims involved in the Jeffrey Epstein case.

I'm sensing a particular theme here...

[OldPhiKap]

I'm sensing a particular theme here...

Bad day to have the initials "RK" and be a creep?


Allegedly, of course.

[HereBeforeCoachK]

Bad day to have the initials "RK" and be a creep?


Allegedly, of course.

Here's the hole in the story to me...I find it hard to believe that a man of his wealth wouldn't get his side orders in a more discreet situation.

[freshmanjs]

Ok I may get grilled for this but I'm not sure why this is a big deal. His wife is deceased so it's not like he's committing adultery and the charge is a simple misdemeanor. Big deal. I am in no way condoning his behavior but if this wasn't sexual in nature we wouldn't even be talking about it.

Because of human trafficking and forced engagement for the providers. Otherwise, I would agree.

[CrazyNotCrazie]

Because of human trafficking and forced engagement for the providers. Otherwise, I would agree.

I am the last guy to defend Kraft, but what does the human trafficking have to do with him, the alleged customer. I have never been to one of these places but I assume you don’t ask for a resume, working papers or anything else before beginning activities. So he could easily plead ignorance on that front.

His girlfriend is 39. Not sure how she will feel about this. Kraft is a pretty well known guy so the list of others involved who are more prominent then him is not that long.

[BD80]

I suspect his kids will be running the team in about a week or two. Buh-bye, Bob.

https://www.cnn.com/2019/02/22/us/ro...ion/index.html

Poor Tom Brady, another cell phone destroyed ...

[JNort]

ESPN's Adam Schefter is reporting that Kraft isn't even the biggest name involved in the investigation but isn't saying who it is. If so, why would they single out Kraft?

As to the sex trafficking, I agree that is horrible if that was the situation and they should be trying to do something about it. As I said, I do not condone his behavior but as I also said it is a misdemeanor offense. When Jim Irsay of the Colts was suspended for 6 games and fined $500,000 by the league it was for illegal and repeated use of cocaine. I think this is apples and oranges. I cannot believe I'm defending Robert Kraft, I hate the Patriots.

The other big name probably isn't related to sports I would guess. Politician maybe? Some big time entrepreneur or businessman?



---> Just read that John Childs was busted in this too. Could be him but his name isn't that well known around the public sphere. He's a billionaire who frequently donates large sums to Republican pacs

[Reilly]

... not sure why this is a big deal. His wife is deceased so it's not like he's committing adultery and the charge is a simple misdemeanor. Big deal. I am in no way condoning his behavior ...

This short piece (about pornography) by Princeton professor Robby George helps explain why some see crimes such as this as a big deal: https://www.firstthings.com/blogs/fi...d-civil-rights

"It reduces persons—creatures bearing profound, inherent, and equal dignity—to the status of objects. It robs a central aspect of our humanity—our sexuality—of its dignity and beauty. It ensnares some in addiction. It deprives others of their sense of self-worth. It teaches our young people to settle for the cheap satisfactions of lust, rather than to do the hard, yet ultimately liberating and fulfilling, work of love."

[freshmanjs]

I am the last guy to defend Kraft, but what does the human trafficking have to do with him, the alleged customer. I have never been to one of these places but I assume you don’t ask for a resume, working papers or anything else before beginning activities. So he could easily plead ignorance on that front.

His girlfriend is 39. Not sure how she will feel about this. Kraft is a pretty well known guy so the list of others involved who are more prominent then him is not that long.

Sure, he can plead ignorance. So what? It's obvious what is going on in places like that. The whole issue has been a major news story for a long time. It's far from a victimless crime. He knew or should have known that there was a good chance he was supporting / enabling trafficking.

[Indoor66]

Sure, he can plead ignorance. So what? It's obvious what is going on in places like that. The whole issue has been a major news story for a long time. It's far from a victimless crime. He knew or should have known that there was a good chance he was supporting / enabling trafficking.

That is a rather broad jump from customer to enabler of international activity. The Authorities had to investigate for years and you expect a customer to be aware of all of the facets of the enterprise? I do not condone his participation or involvement, but let's not ascribe culpability beyond the known alleged facts until some additional facts are revealed or alleged and proved.

It seems some are so quick to go all Duke Lacrosse on so many of the situations.

[HereBeforeCoachK]

Sure, he can plead ignorance. So what? It's obvious what is going on in places like that. The whole issue has been a major news story for a long time. It's far from a victimless crime. He knew or should have known that there was a good chance he was supporting / enabling trafficking.

Big big leap there...we don't even know if he's guilty...and if he's guilty, we don't know if the person involved was a victim of sex trafficking...and even if both are true, it's a bit dramatic to say he is supporting trafficking. That's like saying you are "supporting pesticides" when you buy an apple at the store...or "supporting tax evasion" when you pay cash for something at an open air market. Reducto ad absurdum.

[freshmanjs]

That is a rather broad jump from customer to enabler of international activity. The Authorities had to investigate for years and you expect a customer to be aware of all of the facets of the enterprise? I do not condone his participation or involvement, but let's not ascribe culpability beyond the known alleged facts until some additional facts are revealed or alleged and proved.

It seems some are so quick to go all Duke Lacrosse on so many of the situations.

You're right, I should have said if the allegations are true. I did believe the police claim that they have him on video. Of course, if that is not the case and he's innocent, then he's innocent. I'm sure you know this, but the authorities didn't have to investigate for years to know that human trafficking was involved. They had to build a provable case. That's a different thing. One doesn't need to "be aware of all facets of the enterprise" to avoid the enterprise. That seems like a very high bar. You can engage with any criminal enterprise as long as you aren't "aware of all facets"?

Big big leap there...we don't even know if he's guilty...and if he's guilty, we don't know if the person involved was a victim of sex trafficking...and even if both are true, it's a bit dramatic to say he is supporting trafficking. That's like saying you are "supporting pesticides" when you buy an apple at the store...or "supporting tax evasion" when you pay cash for something at an open air market. Reducto ad absurdum.

I put no moral judgment on paying for sex or being paid for sex. Fine with me if that's the extent of it. However, the idea that he had no clue that human trafficking was likely involved is totally absurd (if the allegations are true). Personally, I think they should legalize prostitution precisely because it would reduce incentive for trafficking.

[El_Diablo]

That is a rather broad jump from customer to enabler of international activity. The Authorities had to investigate for years and you expect a customer to be aware of all of the facets of the enterprise? I do not condone his participation or involvement, but let's not ascribe culpability beyond the known alleged facts until some additional facts are revealed or alleged and proved.

It seems some are so quick to go all Duke Lacrosse on so many of the situations.

Relax. Someone basically asked, “What’s the big deal here?” So people are explaining what the issue is. And yes, trafficking has indeed been alleged as part of the investigation, with several people arrested on sex trafficking and racketeering charges. The fact that the investigation took 4-5 months (I am not sure where you saw that it took years) is not really relevant. It is pretty clear from the articles that the investigation took that long because the police were casting a huge net (ensnaring hundreds of people at ten locations) and establishing detailed evidentiary records (going undercover, conducting interviews, getting warrants to install tracking and video surveillance devices, collecting napkins covered in seminal fluid, obtaining bank records, etc.), not because it took that long for them to suspect that something illegal was occurring.

Getting back to the issue of “what’s the big deal” with this situation:

Police said victims, identified in court records as Jane Does, lived inside the spas and worked as prostitutes. Some stayed for days, others for months.

None were allowed to leave on their own. They did not have their own vehicles and generally spoke Mandarin or Cantonese, not English.

Currey said many came from China on temporary work visas, indebted to the the brokers who helped them reach America, but believing legitimate jobs awaited them.

"Some of them are trying to make a better life for themselves," he said. "These people truly are stuck."

They were shamed, intimidated and taught not to speak to law enforcement or immigration officials.

Others answered what they thought were legitimate ads for masseuse jobs, but soon were pressured into doing more.

https://www.tcpalm.com/story/news/crime/indian-river-county/2019/02/21/human-trafficking-florida-massage-parlors-vero-beach-sebastian/2920354002/

[Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15]

Relax. Someone basically asked, “What’s the big deal here?” So people are explaining what the issue is. And yes, trafficking has indeed been alleged as part of the investigation, with several people arrested on sex trafficking and racketeering charges. The fact that the investigation took 4-5 months (I am not sure where you saw that it took years) is not really relevant. It is pretty clear from the articles that the investigation took that long because the police were casting a huge net (ensnaring hundreds of people at ten locations) and establishing detailed evidentiary records (going undercover, conducting interviews, getting warrants to install tracking and video surveillance devices, collecting napkins covered in seminal fluid, obtaining bank records, etc.), not because it took that long for them to suspect that something illegal was occurring.

Getting back to the issue of “what’s the big deal” with this situation:

Police said victims, identified in court records as Jane Does, lived inside the spas and worked as prostitutes. Some stayed for days, others for months.

None were allowed to leave on their own. They did not have their own vehicles and generally spoke Mandarin or Cantonese, not English.

Currey said many came from China on temporary work visas, indebted to the the brokers who helped them reach America, but believing legitimate jobs awaited them.

"Some of them are trying to make a better life for themselves," he said. "These people truly are stuck."

They were shamed, intimidated and taught not to speak to law enforcement or immigration officials.

Others answered what they thought were legitimate ads for masseuse jobs, but soon were pressured into doing more.

https://www.tcpalm.com/story/news/crime/indian-river-county/2019/02/21/human-trafficking-florida-massage-parlors-vero-beach-sebastian/2920354002/

There are more sordid details out there if anyone cares to learn them, but this wasn't anything that someone could pretend was a victimless crime. I am all for letting the process take control, but this is a lot more than a widower using some petty cash to indulge a woman engaging in the world's oldest profession. This is organized crime, human trafficking, and human rights abuses that anyone would want to have their name far, far, far away from.

Seriously, this isn't a case of people who need to lighten up. This is exploitation of the highest level of people who have zero recourse.

I know we live in are where Kraft will be the subject of deflation jokes, but I find the entire situation upsetting.

[budwom]

^ it is a mess. It will be most interesting to see how Jolly Roger Goodell deals with this, since he's supposed to monitor the sins of owners as well as players...I'm sure whatever he does will be reactive and wrongfooted.