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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Hot'Lanta... home of the Falcons!

    The end of OAD (in a few years)

    This has nothing to do with Zion, I tell ya... nothing. It is pure coincidence that the NBA leaked this to the public today, on a day where every sports commentator on the planet is talking about how absurd it is that athletes worth millions are forced to risk injury by playing for free.

    https://www.usatoday.com/story/sport...ld/2942228002/

    The NBA has submitted to the National Basketball Players Association a formal proposal that will lower the draft-eligible age to 18 from 19, a person with knowledge of the proposal told USA TODAY Sports.

    The person requested anonymity because he was not authorized to publicly discuss discussions between the league and the union.

    The NBPA and its executive director, Michele Roberts, planned to review the proposal Monday at a post-All-Star weekend meeting in the Bahamas.

    The league and union have had informal discussions about lowering the age limit, and NBA commissioner Adam Silver is on record saying the current 19-year-old age limit is not working for the league or college basketball.

    This is the first step in formal negotiations to lower the age limit by the 2022 draft. The issue is collectively bargained between the NBA and NBPA, and both sides need to agree to any rule change.
    Why are you wasting time here when you could be wasting it by listening to the latest episode of the DBR Podcast?

  2. #2
    It's worth noting that Zion and RJ said in a recent interview they would have come to college regardless of any 1-and-done rule.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Location
    Winston Salem, NC
    Quote Originally Posted by bludevil_33 View Post
    It's worth noting that Zion and RJ said in a recent interview they would have come to college regardless of any 1-and-done rule.
    Even if it meant staying in college for 2 or 3 years? I'll believe it when I see it when a super player like our current freshmen stay for that long. Most high school players think they are ready when they are seniors in hs. GoDuke!

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by bludevil_33 View Post
    It's worth noting that Zion and RJ said in a recent interview they would have come to college regardless of any 1-and-done rule.
    And it's also worth noting that Zion was no higher than 7th pick coming out of HS...now he's number one pick. Now he's even more famous because of Duke. He'll sign for more money and make a ton more endorsements thanks to a year at Duke.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Clifton, VA
    Quote Originally Posted by HereBeforeCoachK View Post
    And it's also worth noting that Zion was no higher than 7th pick coming out of HS...now he's number one pick. Now he's even more famous because of Duke. He'll sign for more money and make a ton more endorsements thanks to a year at Duke.
    Well said and thank you for pointing this out. Zion also seems to be having the time of his life.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    Carolina Beach
    Love to see ⚾ rule. But something in the timeline that would prevent last minute declarations that leave a college team no time to recover.

  7. #7
    Over 95% of division I basketball players will not play in the NBA. Each one of these kids should be asked prior to the start of each season, do you wish to stay in college and play basketball with no compensation (beyond a scholarship) or would you prefer to leave college and pursue other opportunities. This is progressively becoming a push for compensation - with a refusal to acknowledge the free choice not to participate. This may not be true for five kids in the class who are currently compelled to play one year of college, but for the significant majority of kids college basketball will not be a segue into the NBA. My sympathy for college athletes who play basketball and lament the lack of compensation is nil.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Washington DC
    Quote Originally Posted by HereBeforeCoachK View Post
    And it's also worth noting that Zion was no higher than 7th pick coming out of HS...now he's number one pick. Now he's even more famous because of Duke. He'll sign for more money and make a ton more endorsements thanks to a year at Duke.
    Being on Espn twice a week this year is more than he will be on Espn/TNT next year.

    Duke is good branding for these kids.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Durham
    Quote Originally Posted by 1991 duke law View Post
    Over 95% of division I basketball players will not play in the NBA. Each one of these kids should be asked prior to the start of each season, do you wish to stay in college and play basketball with no compensation (beyond a scholarship) or would you prefer to leave college and pursue other opportunities. This is progressively becoming a push for compensation - with a refusal to acknowledge the free choice not to participate. This may not be true for five kids in the class who are currently compelled to play one year of college, but for the significant majority of kids college basketball will not be a segue into the NBA. My sympathy for college athletes who play basketball and lament the lack of compensation is nil.
    This is exactly it. The g-league (and someone's cited contract of duval)...it turns out the market for minor league basketball outside of the school name is 50-100k a year...which is probably around the value of their scholarship.

    What are you going to do? Give up the scholarship value and go play in the g-league for a few pennies?

    It's supply and demand, and outside of the few guys like zion, as you say, these guys that would otherwise be making comparatively little in the g-league simply don't have anything to dangle over the schools. Even if every power 5 starter bailed, there is an abundance of players who could be brought in, coached up, and battle eachother...maybe the overall quality of play is lower...but fans are still going to want their team to win.

    Yeah I feel for guys like zion who have to make tough choices...but there's always the g-league. Those top handful of guys would make the league anyway...they just realize the choice to go to college is still a substantially better deal than the g-league.
    1200. DDMF.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    New Bern, NC unless it's a home football game then I'm grilling on Devil's Alley
    Quote Originally Posted by bludevil_33 View Post
    It's worth noting that Zion and RJ said in a recent interview they would have come to college regardless of any 1-and-done rule.
    I'd say that too if I were having fun and had no other option.

    Ugh, '22? Grrr...hopefully the G-League changes still entice a few first. Happy to see the guys we've had do what they do, but I can't wait to actually follow a team again. Bring back the 90's!
    Q "Why do you like Duke, you didn't even go there." A "Because my art school didn't have a basketball team."

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    Berkeley, CA
    Prepare for the new OAD - 17 year olds reclassifying so they can do a year of college instead of a fourth year of HS for better exposure. Reclassification has already been trending up, and if you are going to be an amateur until you are 18, wouldn't you rather spend a year getting free gear, free travel, and national exposure in college than playing in a HS gym?

    I'm only partially joking - seems like with most things involving a lot of money on the line, changing rules will usually have unintended consequences and it'll continue to be a race for maximizing profit (sorry, "revenue") for the NCAA and schools, and a race for elite prospects to find the most direct path to actually getting paid for their skills.

    I'm glad things are changing - the current system is basically the worst of all worlds and IMO has really ruined a lot of what's great about CBB. I hope we can get back to seeing players grow, thrive, and develop over a longer time horizon. But as long as there's zero money/endorsements for players in high school and college (despite all the money generated off them) and huge payouts in NBA, I think there's a fundamental injustice to the system that will continue to lead to bad outcomes (i.e. Adidias scandal, UNC academic fraud, probably a lot of stuff we'll never learn about) and won't go away with a simple tweak to draft age.
    “Turning down the Lakers was tough, but it is always good to renew your vows to the loves of your life.”
    -Coach K

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by superdave View Post
    Being on Espn twice a week this year is more than he will be on Espn/TNT next year.

    Duke is good branding for these kids.
    A fact, a totally undeniable fact, that gets lost in some of these debates. So are a lot of other schools, and certainly a different set of schools in football. Oklahoma football changed a young man's career sport.

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by DUKIE V(A) View Post
    Well said and thank you for pointing this out. Zion also seems to be having the time of his life.
    yes he does, which seems to escape J Will, Pippen, and all the morons on Tony Riali's show....he's having the time of his life, and Duke nation is having the times of our lives watching him...WIN WIN WIN...

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by bludevil_33 View Post
    It's worth noting that Zion and RJ said in a recent interview they would have come to college regardless of any 1-and-done rule.
    Quote Originally Posted by CameronBornAndBred View Post
    I'd say that too if I were having fun and had no other option.
    Have to say I'm with CameronBornandBred on this one. I love having RJ and Zion on the team and they represent the school wonderfully...I don't doubt for a second they're having moments and memories they wouldn't have anywhere else playing together in college.

    And Jabari Parker really agonized (really!) about staying in school for another year (he even wrote a short piece for ESPN about it), as did Wendell Carter. They *loved* playing for Duke and K. But you know all these guys have people in their ears telling them that the opportunity cost of staying is just too much if you have the option to go pro. (and as it turns out for Jabari, given his subsequent and extremely unfortunate ACL injuries, it's good he went pro when he did)

    If RJ and Zion had the chance to go, the voices from outside would have been too strong. They would have gone. I feel really lucky as a Duke fan we can enjoy them on this current special team, but won't begrudge the NBA and NCAA if they eventually allow future kids go straight to the NBA or G-League out of high school.

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by KandG View Post
    If RJ and Zion had the chance to go, the voices from outside would have been too strong. They would have gone. I feel really lucky as a Duke fan we can enjoy them on this current special team, but won't begrudge the NBA and NCAA if they eventually allow future kids go straight to the NBA or G-League out of high school.
    So, Zion goes out of HS...no higher than 7th pick...considered just a dunker...or Zion goes after one year at Duke, is the most famous player on the planet perhaps, and is the number one draft. Uh, in salary and endorsements he's making mega millions more by investing a year at Duke. These rankings out of HS are often flawed, and more HS players have bombed in the NBA than OADs.

    I think the NBA should allow the kids to go...but in the long run, many many of them are better off with a year in college.

  16. #16
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Cary, NC
    Quote Originally Posted by HereBeforeCoachK View Post
    And it's also worth noting that Zion was no higher than 7th pick coming out of HS...now he's number one pick. Now he's even more famous because of Duke. He'll sign for more money and make a ton more endorsements thanks to a year at Duke.
    I was having this debate with a buddy yesterday - we were discussing where Zion would have been drafted in a world where the OAD rule didn't exist and he had chosen to go straight out of high school. My buddy said he would have been the #1 pick regardless, and that he's wasting his time at Duke. My recollection was that his final ranking was #3 or #4 after making a bit of a jump over the summer. Prior to the summer he was in the 6-8 range. There were concerns about his skill level and his shooting ability, and some felt that his low level of high school competition didn't provide a gauge of his true abilities. So I argued that he would have been drafted around #5, factoring in upperclassmen who came out as well as international players but also factoring in the combine where he would have shown out really well.

    The difference in rookie salary between #1 and #5 is not insignificant. Plus there's the obvious marketing boon, which would have already existed to an extent but not to the level that it does now. He would have grown his brand during his rookie year in the pros, but I would argue that he will earn more in endorsements in his first year after leaving Duke than he would have earned in years 1-2 after leaving straight from high school.

    With all that said, I am all in favor of ditching the OAD rule. Give kids the choice to do what they and their families decide is best for themselves.

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by UrinalCake View Post
    I was having this debate with a buddy yesterday - we were discussing where Zion would have been drafted in a world where the OAD rule didn't exist and he had chosen to go straight out of high school. My buddy said he would have been the #1 pick regardless, and that he's wasting his time at Duke. My recollection was that his final ranking was #3 or #4 after making a bit of a jump over the summer. Prior to the summer he was in the 6-8 range. There were concerns about his skill level and his shooting ability, and some felt that his low level of high school competition didn't provide a gauge of his true abilities. So I argued that he would have been drafted around #5, factoring in upperclassmen who came out as well as international players.

    The difference in rookie salary between #1 and #5 is not insignificant. Plus there's the obvious marketing boon, which would have already existed to an extent but not to the level that it does now. He would have grown his brand during his rookie year in the pros, but I would argue that he will earn more in endorsements in his first year after leaving Duke than he would have earned in years 1-2 after leaving straight from high school.

    With all that said, I am all in favor of ditching the OAD rule. Give kids the choice to do what they and their families decide is best for themselves.
    Zion was maybe 3-4-5 college recruit, but with foreign players and upperclassmen, I believe no higher than 7th for the draft...and the money is significantly different. And the exposure at Duke this season for him is many many times greater than he would have for a lottery team in the NBA basement. There's no comparison, and thus his year in college is netting him millions (and we're winning too). I'm happy for all involved.

  18. #18
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Boston, MA
    So Coach K is retiring in 2022. Good to know! Plenty of time to plan
    Criticism may not be agreeable, but it is necessary. It fulfils the same function as pain in the human body. It calls attention to an unhealthy state of things. - Winston Churchill

    President of the "Nolan Smith Should Have His Jersey in The Rafters" Club

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by UrinalCake View Post
    I was having this debate with a buddy yesterday - we were discussing where Zion would have been drafted in a world where the OAD rule didn't exist and he had chosen to go straight out of high school. My buddy said he would have been the #1 pick regardless, and that he's wasting his time at Duke. My recollection was that his final ranking was #3 or #4 after making a bit of a jump over the summer. Prior to the summer he was in the 6-8 range. There were concerns about his skill level and his shooting ability, and some felt that his low level of high school competition didn't provide a gauge of his true abilities. So I argued that he would have been drafted around #5, factoring in upperclassmen who came out as well as international players but also factoring in the combine where he would have shown out really well.

    The difference in rookie salary between #1 and #5 is not insignificant. Plus there's the obvious marketing boon, which would have already existed to an extent but not to the level that it does now. He would have grown his brand during his rookie year in the pros, but I would argue that he will earn more in endorsements in his first year after leaving Duke than he would have earned in years 1-2 after leaving straight from high school.

    With all that said, I am all in favor of ditching the OAD rule. Give kids the choice to do what they and their families decide is best for themselves.
    Zion would not have gone #1 prior to Duke. RJ probably would have gone #1; he had already proven himself with FIBA, etc. They scouts had not seen enough of Zion against good competition. He was injured during the Nike Hoops Classics and injured in the McDonald's All American game. Nasser Little out played everybody in the McDonald's game.

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by flyingdutchdevil View Post
    So Coach K is retiring in 2022. Good to know! Plenty of time to plan
    Coach K is retiring in 2023, right after his grandson Michael Savarino graduates and LeBron James, Jr. goes #1 in the NBA Draft

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