MBB: Duke 94, NC State 78 Post-Game Thread

[Bluedevil114]

ESPN has the magic technology which turns my 50 inch screen into a 32 inch one...painfully annoying

I get the split screens are annoying and the interview with Tyus was longer than needed. But remember it does help to continue to help in recruiting and in the Duke brand. Casual watches or kids thinking about committing to Duke can see the Brotherhood is real. They can hear and learn that Tre was ready to commit to Duke before Tyus. They can see the energy and excitement from Quinn and also see celebrities like Lebron and Roy Jones Jr. enjoying the game. It was great after a few choice words from Gary Trent Jr. about how he was untilized last year that he was back in Cameron. Offense was great, the defense was not as strong but I think it was a product of the strategy versus State. Duke was just the better team yesterday. Zion is just the better player on the planet everyday.

[freshmanjs]

What was reason for the “twenty four” chant? Or at least that’s what it sounded like from my seat.

[cspan37421]

... there seems to be ZERO conflict with those to stars...

Apple Newton?

[cspan37421]

What was reason for the “twenty four” chant? Or at least that’s what it sounded like from my seat.

State's woeful offense output in recent game vs. Va Tech. That was for the entire game.

[moonpie23]

with those to stars...

dangit....the editing sunset clause...

[CDu]

What was reason for the “twenty four” chant? Or at least that’s what it sounded like from my seat.

State scored just 24 against Va Tech.

[DukieInBrasil]

What was reason for the “twenty four” chant? Or at least that’s what it sounded like from my seat.

State managed to score all of 24 pts in an entire game vs. VaTech, and managed to shoot a scintillating 16.7% on FGs. I'm sure the Crazies were reminding State of that ineptitude.

[cspan37421]

dangit...the editing sunset clause...

Can't spork you, gotta spread the love, but I was going to say, "come on in, the water's fine!"

[Steven43]

It shows excellence in several facets of the game..Simple

It’s absolutely not simple at all, nor does it show “excellence”. If you watch Westbrook play you will see how he slacks on defense in order to get cheap virtually uncontested rebounds. You will see him try to get cheap assists by urging teammates to shoot after he passes to them even though they don’t have a good shot and they would create a better shot by passing to someone else. You will see him badly miss shot after shot in an attempt to get double-digits in points.

If you are a shooting guard or point guard and you shoot the ball as poorly as Westbrook does and you’re also a terrible FT shooter for your position you’re not a great player. Overall,the triple double seems to me to be one of the least meaningful stats in basketball in determining one’s worth as a player.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=f_sJ78aSQ6Q

https://www.google.com/amp/s/aminoapps.com/c/nba/amp/blog/why-russell-westbrook-is-overrated/PJ3g_PZZumud8B51KWqMl83wBBn5QxZ7z6x

https://www.google.com/amp/s/foxsportsradio.iheart.com/alternate/amp/2018-04-07-westbrook-is-the-most-overrated-player-in-the-nba/

[fathippo]

Congratulations to Coach K for get back to .500 against a Keatts coached State team

I see you worded it to disqualify the 2016 Duke tournament win over the Keatts coached UNCW team.

[UrinalCake]

Whatever happened to Durant coming to the game? They never showed him and I haven’t seen any explanation online.

Loved to see all the alums in the crowd and the locker room. These guys are millionaire stars but when they come back to Duke they just look like regular dudes. Really feels like watching guys come back home to see their families. And on a side note, is Amile gonna get a contract? He’s done about everything possible in the G league.

[Steven43]

Whatever happened to Durant coming to the game? They never showed him and I haven’t seen any explanation online.

Loved to see all the alums in the crowd and the locker room. These guys are millionaire stars but when they come back to Duke they just look like regular dudes. Really feels like watching guys come back home to see their families. And on a side note, is Amile gonna get a contract? He’s done about everything possible in the G league.

Kevin Durant was planning to come last night?! From my vantage point at the game I think I saw Floyd Mayweather sitting next to Quinn Cook, which was quite bizarre, if true, but I didn’t see Durant. I’m going to watch a replay later today. Maybe they mentioned who was at the game during the telecast.

Sorry if someone has already discussed this stuff earlier in the thread. I haven’t read the whole thing; I’ve been skipping around.

[tbyers11]

It’s absolutely not simple at all, nor does it show “excellence”. If you watch Westbrook play you will see how he slacks on defense in order to get cheap virtually uncontested rebounds. You will see him try to get cheap assists by urging teammates to shoot after he passes to them even though they don’t have a good shot and they would create a better shot by passing to someone else. You will see him badly miss shot after shot in an attempt to get double-digits in points.

If you are a shooting guard or point guard and you shoot the ball as poorly as Westbrook does and you’re also a terrible FT shooter for your position you’re not a great player. Overall,the triple double seems to me to be one of the least meaningful stats in basketball in determining one’s worth as a player.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=f_sJ78aSQ6Q

https://www.google.com/amp/s/aminoap...83wBBn5QxZ7z6x

https://www.google.com/amp/s/foxspor...er-in-the-nba/

I don't agree with you that Russell Westbrook is overrated. But I do agree that his apparent affinity for achieving triple doubles just for triple double's sake is not the best look.

However, I think that is apples and oranges to celebrating a college player getting a triple double in 38 minutes (78 possessions). 23 points, 11 rebounds, 10 assists is darn impressive even if the round number counting stats are a bit arbitrary. Throw in 6-6 FT, and ZERO turnovers with a 24% usage rate and an ORTG of 149 for context and it is even more impressive.

I think we can praise RJ's triple double as a cool and rare feat on its own merits. I mean if it wasn't cool why would Ice Cube have talked about "messing [radio edit] around and getting a triple double" in one of his most iconic songs

[Monmouth77]

It’s absolutely not simple at all, nor does it show “excellence”. If you watch Westbrook play you will see how he slacks on defense in order to get cheap virtually uncontested rebounds. You will see him try to get cheap assists by urging teammates to shoot after he passes to them even though they don’t have a good shot and they would create a better shot by passing to someone else. You will see him badly miss shot after shot in an attempt to get double-digits in points.

If you are a shooting guard or point guard and you shoot the ball as poorly as Westbrook does and you’re also a terrible FT shooter for your position you’re not a great player. Overall,the triple double seems to me to be one of the least meaningful stats in basketball in determining one’s worth as a player.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=f_sJ78aSQ6Q

https://www.google.com/amp/s/aminoap...83wBBn5QxZ7z6x

https://www.google.com/amp/s/foxspor...er-in-the-nba/

I don't watch the Thunder play enough to take issue with your specific observations about Russell Westbrook, though obviously he is a great basketball player (sounds like you mainly dispute whether he is MVP-candidate level good). And, in general, a high usage player at the PG position in the NBA who plays close to every minute of a 48 minute game has lots of opportunities to influence a game through scoring, passing and rebounding.

But let's get real, especially in college, in a maximum 40 minute game, on a team stocked with athletes who can rebound, and playing next to a pass-first guard like Tre Jones, the fact that Barrett filled the stat sheet with double digit assists and rebounds yesterday (to go with his usual high scoring output) is phenomenal. It is why it has only happened a handful of times in Duke history.

Barrett is as well-rounded an offensive player as Duke has ever had. He's a willing passer, great in transition, scores at all three levels, can finish through contact, rebounds in traffic, and hits the three at a high enough percentage to open up the lane for athletic drives into the paint. He doesn't need to rack up "triple doubles" to prove his excellence, but his triple-double yesterday displayed his excellence and is a good shorthand stat to point to what he does on the court offensively: everything.

[fathippo]

Kevin Durant was planning to come last night?! From my vantage point at the game I think I saw Floyd Mayweather sitting next to Quinn Cook, which was quite bizarre, if true, but I didn’t see Durant. I’m going to watch a replay later today. Maybe they mentioned who was at the game during the telecast.

Sorry if someone has already discussed this stuff earlier in the thread. I haven’t read the whole thing; I’ve been skipping around.

It was Mayweather next to Quin. He had quite the entourage. With his history hopefully it is a one time thing. Durant would have been hard to miss, so I assume he stayed in Charlotte.

[roywhite]

Barrett is as well-rounded an offensive player as Duke has ever had. He's a willing passer, great in transition, scores at all three levels, can finish through contact, rebounds in traffic, and hits the three at a high enough percentage to open up the lane for athletic drives into the paint. He doesn't need to rack up "triple doubles" to prove his excellence, but his triple-double yesterday displayed his excellence and is a good shorthand stat to point to what he does on the court offensively: everything.

Agree. A few stats

For the season, 99 assists vs 70 turnovers (the only starter other than Tre to have a positive ratio)
In Conference only games -- shooting 43% FG, 37% 3-pt, 74.6% FT
Also in Conference only games -- 7.4 rebounds and 4.1 assists/game

https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb...duke/2019.html

[Steven43]

I don't watch the Thunder play enough to take issue with your specific observations about Russell Westbrook, though obviously he is a great basketball player (sounds like you mainly dispute whether he is MVP-candidate level good). And, in general, a high usage player at the PG position in the NBA who plays close to every minute of a 48 minute game has lots of opportunities to influence a game through scoring, passing and rebounding.

But let's get real, especially in college, in a maximum 40 minute game, on a team stocked with athletes who can rebound, and playing next to a pass-first guard like Tre Jones, the fact that Barrett filled the stat sheet with double digit assists and rebounds yesterday (to go with his usual high scoring output) is phenomenal. It is why it has only happened a handful of times in Duke history.

Barrett is as well-rounded an offensive player as Duke has ever had. He's a willing passer, great in transition, scores at all three levels, can finish through contact, rebounds in traffic, and hits the three at a high enough percentage to open up the lane for athletic drives into the paint. He doesn't need to rack up "triple doubles" to prove his excellence, but his triple-double yesterday displayed his excellence and is a good shorthand stat to point to what he does on the court offensively: everything.

I really was not intending this as a commentary on Barrett. I was just talking about the triple double — my most disliked basketball stat — in a general sense. I don’t think it’s a very telling way to judge whether or not Barrett, or anyone else, played great last night or on any other night. It’s a very crude statistic at best. Zion Williamson is BY FAR the best player in college basketball and completely dominates games without getting anywhere close to a triple double.

I rue the day Kevin Durant left OKC (with good reason — he was sick of having Westbrook as a teammate) and Westbrook then decided to take his selfish game to an even more selfish level by trying to goose his stats to achieve the relatively meaningless statistic of “triple double”. The league and the sport has been the worse for it.

[Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15]

It was Mayweather next to Quin. He had quite the entourage. With his history hopefully it is a one time thing. Durant would have been hard to miss, so I assume he stayed in Charlotte.

Mayweather turns my stomach but is a cultural icon that resonates with lots of people. Surprised to see him yesterday. Surprised to see him next to Quinn. I don't see it "rubbing off" on Cook.

[Troublemaker]

It’s absolutely not simple at all, nor does it show “excellence”. If you watch Westbrook play you will see how he slacks on defense in order to get cheap virtually uncontested rebounds. You will see him try to get cheap assists by urging teammates to shoot after he passes to them even though they don’t have a good shot and they would create a better shot by passing to someone else. You will see him badly miss shot after shot in an attempt to get double-digits in points.

If you are a shooting guard or point guard and you shoot the ball as poorly as Westbrook does and you’re also a terrible FT shooter for your position you’re not a great player. Overall,the triple double seems to me to be one of the least meaningful stats in basketball in determining one’s worth as a player.

This is wrong, as the numbers show differently. On RJ Bell's podcast (Bell is a sports gambling radio host who often appears on Colin Cowherd's show), his team did the research and provided the following numbers. In the past 3 NBA seasons (basically since Westbrook became a triple-double machine), OKC:

(1) wins 76% of the time and is additionally 68% against the spread when Westbrook gets a triple-double.
(2) wins only 45% of the time and is additionally 36% against the spread when Westbrook does NOT get a triple-double.

On its face, it's absurd to think that a player getting a triple-double is meaningless and doesn't help his team win. But now you have the stats. DevilWin is correct for saying that it's simple. When you can get points but also lots of rebounds and lots of assists, you almost certainly are helping your team win. In Westbrook's case, he's additionally helping his team exceed expectations (in the form of the point spread) when he gets a triple-double. Does Westbrook stat-hunt rebounds and assists to maintain his averages and streaks, and is it tacky? Yes and yes. But he's also helping his team win.

The Stitcher link to RJ Bell's podcast is here: https://www.stitcher.com/podcast/pregame/e/58781528 (The stats are given out at the 24:30 timestamp)

[AtlDuke72]

I really was not intending this as a commentary on Barrett. I was just talking about the triple double — my most disliked basketball stat — in a general sense. I don’t think it’s a very telling way to judge whether or not Barrett, or anyone else, played great last night or on any other night. It’s a very crude statistic at best. Zion Williamson is BY FAR the best player in college basketball and completely dominates games without getting anywhere close to a triple double.

I rue the day Kevin Durant left OKC (with good reason — he was sick of having Westbrook as a teammate) and Westbrook then decided to take his selfish game to an even more selfish level by trying to goose his stats to achieve the relatively meaningless statistic of “triple double”. The league and the sport has been the worse for it.

I am getting the impression that you don’t care for Westbrook