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Thread: Zion!

  1. #241
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
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    Steamboat Springs, CO
    Quote Originally Posted by BandAlum83 View Post
    Okafor made the basketball look like a nerf ball. Just sayin’
    There is a cast of Okafor's hand in Cameron, and it is awesome.
    Sage Grouse

    ---------------------------------------
    'When I got on the bus for my first road game at Duke, I saw that every player was carrying textbooks or laptops. I coached in the SEC for 25 years, and I had never seen that before, not even once.' - David Cutcliffe to Duke alumni in Washington, DC, June 2013

  2. #242
    Quote Originally Posted by MChambers View Post
    I certainly agree that Zion is a strong defender. I don't think he's gotten enough credit for that this year, other than for his blocks. He's great defending guards at the three point line and he's also becoming a very good help defender. That to me is what separates him from the other amazing OADs at Duke in the last decade.
    He's great at some things on the defensive end, like making open court steals (sometimes in conjunction with Tre)...as well as blocking shots, and defensive rebounding. I don't really see a weakness on D.
    Don't waste your time on House of Cards S6!
    -We found out Frank was critical to making anyone else in the show interesting...not a surprise...

  3. #243
    People are always saying "I wonder what it would look like to see Lebron play in college." IMO, this is what it looks like.

  4. #244
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    Santa Clara, CA
    Quote Originally Posted by Billy Dat View Post
    I was very high on Ben Simmons as a defender when he was entering the league. I think he can be Defensive POY one year. I don't see Zion reaching that level but he can be an all-league defender, an on and off the ball impact guy.
    IMHO I think the analysis isn't far off. When thinking on the pro level, I believe what Zion needs to work on defensively is not to always overcommit on D. In college, this is working out fine as the competition level is lower. His instincts are good, and he can be overly aggressive and usually win the skirmish. But in the pros where everything, including speed and ability, picks up, he could get beat more often when overcommitting. He can use his size and quickness to force his man into errors to get the stop, not necessarily trying to go for the spectacular play for the block or the steal. I'm not saying his D is a weakness. I am saying it is something for him to work on (along with outside shooting and FTs). Zion will be #1 in the draft. But like most all #1 picks, he will have things to work on in the NBA.

    9F
    Bucket List - Throw a party when Duke MBB has a winning record against Carolina.

  5. #245
    Quote Originally Posted by Wander View Post
    People are always saying "I wonder what it would look like to see Lebron play in college." IMO, this is what it looks like.
    Quote Originally Posted by kako View Post
    IMHO I think the analysis isn't far off. When thinking on the pro level, I believe what Zion needs to work on defensively is not to always overcommit on D. In college, this is working out fine as the competition level is lower. His instincts are good, and he can be overly aggressive and usually win the skirmish. But in the pros where everything, including speed and ability, picks up, he could get beat more often when overcommitting. He can use his size and quickness to force his man into errors to get the stop, not necessarily trying to go for the spectacular play for the block or the steal. I'm not saying his D is a weakness. I am saying it is something for him to work on (along with outside shooting and FTs). Zion will be #1 in the draft. But like most all #1 picks, he will have things to work on in the NBA.

    9F
    I enjoy watching Zion play on both sides of the ball, and have been amazed at his defensive chops on display so far.
    I think both of these comments indicate that Zion has room to grow, which he assuredly does, but i think Zion will be able to learn these things or intuitively feel his way to approach these skills with a fresh perspective. I don't see why he wouldn't be able to become a all-NBA level defender, or even DPOY. He would have to improve in several areas, but dude is amazing already.

  6. #246
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Washington, DC area
    Quote Originally Posted by MChambers View Post
    I certainly agree that Zion is a strong defender. I don't think he's gotten enough credit for that this year, other than for his blocks. He's great defending guards at the three point line and he's also becoming a very good help defender. That to me is what separates him from the other amazing OADs at Duke in the last decade.
    One on one, he's solid to awesome.

    He sometimes over-commits going after steals and finds himself way out of position, though, leaving the rest of the team scrambling (often unsuccessfully) to cover/recover.

    I want to see him get better judgment on when to go for it.

    The times he comes over to double team (high) the other team's PG while Tre is closely guarding are the ones I most like! The two of them together are really tough...

    -jk

  7. #247
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    Correct side of the Durham/CH border

    You’ve got to be kidding

    “Coach said no 3s.” - Zion on The Block

  8. #248
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    Honolulu

    Dabo and K talking Zion

    ESPN posted an excerpt of an appearance by Dabo Swinney on Coach K's radio show that will air (or has aired ... stupid time zones) on ESPNU Radio, which is a thing that exists, I guess.

    Coach and Dabo got to talking about Zion playing football, about which Dabo said:

    "I'd put [Williamson] at tight end or wideout or [defensive] end or wherever he wanted to play. We might even play him at quarterback."
    But my favorite part of the article is actually this tidbit at the end:

    Despite his commitment to basketball, LSU reportedly offered him a football scholarship when he was in high school.

    "I thought, 'Hell, why not, he's probably the best damn tight end to ever live,'" former LSU tight ends coach Eric Mateos told ESPN.

    Mateos said that Ed Orgeron told him to find the "best athletes in the country," and Williamson was on that list.

  9. #249
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Forest Hills, NY
    LeBron on Zion. Great quote: “Coach K is my guy...” Also mentions our offer to his son.

    https://nypost.com/2019/02/15/lebron...pasteboard_app

  10. #250
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Washington, D.C.

    Zion

    Zion is so good he schooled Nick Horvath in pickup games last summer.

  11. #251
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Location
    Raleigh, NC
    From ESPN, LeBron’s thoughts on Zion and the UVA game.

    http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/2...ion-williamson

  12. #252
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Forest Hills, NY
    Quote Originally Posted by TKG View Post
    From ESPN, LeBron’s thoughts on Zion and the UVA game.

    http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/2...ion-williamson
    For the NY Post's take, see my post (no. 249) above.

  13. #253
    Is it just me or does anyone else see Zion being a Draymond Green style player in the NBA, with more offensive upside?

    Zion is still young and will continue to grow as a player but when I see his game, I see a lot of Green. Being able to guard all 5 positions, the energy he plays with, etc...

    It is so fun to watch these kids grow under K and then continue to grow in the NBA.

    Go Duke...

  14. #254
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Boston, MA
    Quote Originally Posted by DBGoins View Post
    Is it just me or does anyone else see Zion being a Draymond Green style player in the NBA, with more offensive upside?

    Zion is still young and will continue to grow as a player but when I see his game, I see a lot of Green. Being able to guard all 5 positions, the energy he plays with, etc...

    It is so fun to watch these kids grow under K and then continue to grow in the NBA.

    Go Duke...
    Green adds incredible D, leadership, playmaking, and 3pt shooting to his team.

    I truly believe Zion will be inferior to Green's D (because Green is a top 5 defender in the league) and Green's 3pt shooting. As for leadership and playmaking, that's TBD.

    However, Zion is a better ball handler, scorer from anywhere else on the court, rebounder, etc etc. Basically, I think they are quite different players despite both being amazing at the 5 in small ball line-ups.
    Criticism may not be agreeable, but it is necessary. It fulfils the same function as pain in the human body. It calls attention to an unhealthy state of things. - Winston Churchill

    President of the "Nolan Smith Should Have His Jersey in The Rafters" Club

  15. #255
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Steamboat Springs, CO
    Quote Originally Posted by flyingdutchdevil View Post
    Green adds incredible D, leadership, playmaking, and 3pt shooting to his team.

    I truly believe Zion will be inferior to Green's D (because Green is a top 5 defender in the league) and Green's 3pt shooting. As for leadership and playmaking, that's TBD.

    However, Zion is a better ball handler, scorer from anywhere else on the court, rebounder, etc etc. Basically, I think they are quite different players despite both being amazing at the 5 in small ball line-ups.
    If you watch Duke play, Zion on offense is a gravitational field. The entire court changes when he has the ball, given his ability to make incredibly fast and strong moves, pass to open players, and shoot. In the NBA that seems to occur with LeBron and maybe a few others. Whether Zion brings that capability to the NBA is unknown, of course, but he is still only 18 years old.
    Sage Grouse

    ---------------------------------------
    'When I got on the bus for my first road game at Duke, I saw that every player was carrying textbooks or laptops. I coached in the SEC for 25 years, and I had never seen that before, not even once.' - David Cutcliffe to Duke alumni in Washington, DC, June 2013

  16. #256
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Washington, D.C.

    Green comp

    Quote Originally Posted by flyingdutchdevil View Post
    Green adds incredible D, leadership, playmaking, and 3pt shooting to his team.

    I truly believe Zion will be inferior to Green's D (because Green is a top 5 defender in the league) and Green's 3pt shooting. As for leadership and playmaking, that's TBD.

    However, Zion is a better ball handler, scorer from anywhere else on the court, rebounder, etc etc. Basically, I think they are quite different players despite both being amazing at the 5 in small ball line-ups.
    Green wasn't a three point shooter until his junior year at MSU. Let's see how Zion's shot develops.

  17. #257
    Quote Originally Posted by flyingdutchdevil View Post
    Green adds incredible D, leadership, playmaking, and 3pt shooting to his team.

    I truly believe Zion will be inferior to Green's D (because Green is a top 5 defender in the league) and Green's 3pt shooting. As for leadership and playmaking, that's TBD.

    However, Zion is a better ball handler, scorer from anywhere else on the court, rebounder, etc etc. Basically, I think they are quite different players despite both being amazing at the 5 in small ball line-ups.
    I would be very disappointed if Zion's NBA career is comparable to Green's, but I've always thought Green is one of the most overrated players in the league. Put him on a normal team, and I don't think he ever sniffs star status. Green is not a good shooter. At all. From anywhere. He only ever has to shoot ridiculously wide open standstill 3-pointers, layups, and post-ups when he gets a guard switched on to him. Even with that, he's 23% from 3 and 42% overall this year. I think Curry would shoot 80% if he just got to shoot Green's 3-point opportunities. Green had one fairly good and efficient year as a scorer in 2015-16 and otherwise has been a very poor shooter and scorer throughout his career. He averages 6.9 rebounds per game for his career and 7.6 this year, so nothing special there. He is a very good defensive player, but I still think he's overrated on that end. For all the hype about being able to defend LeBron, James always put up enormous numbers against Green. Green is an outstanding passer, but it certainly helps to play with Curry, Thompson, and Durant. Leadership? Didn't his own team have to suspend him, besides earning his own suspension from the League in the Finals this year? Green averages 9.1 ppg on 43.7% shooting for his career. Zion's sweat could do better than that!

  18. #258
    Quote Originally Posted by sagegrouse View Post
    If you watch Duke play, Zion on offense is a gravitational field. The entire court changes when he has the ball, .
    Actually, I think the entire court changes when he's simply on the court, ball or not...his "gravitational field" is a great metaphor...
    Don't waste your time on House of Cards S6!
    -We found out Frank was critical to making anyone else in the show interesting...not a surprise...

  19. #259
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Raleigh, NC
    The description I heard yesterday was that Zion could be Green on steroids. I think because of Green's polarizing personality he doesn't get as much credit as he could. He's a game changer because of his ability to guard so many guys (bigger and smaller than him) and his willingness to do the dirty work. Zion is a much better athlete than Green so he could grow into doing what Green does...but have so much more to his game because of his athleticism. Not to mention Zion's fantastic attitude.

    I still think the modern day comp is still LeBron. Sure you can poke holes in that (LeBron's more of a distributor, etc) but I think the LeBron comparison is the only one that comes close because of the gravitational pull they both have on the court. LeBron has it off the court as well and I could see Zion growing into having a similar sphere of influence. He's such a good kid, even having one year at Duke I think will help solidify his foundation and it's gong to be fun to see what kind of adult he becomes.

  20. #260
    Quote Originally Posted by DBGoins View Post
    Is it just me or does anyone else see Zion being a Draymond Green style player in the NBA, with more offensive upside?

    Zion is still young and will continue to grow as a player but when I see his game, I see a lot of Green. Being able to guard all 5 positions, the energy he plays with, etc...

    It is so fun to watch these kids grow under K and then continue to grow in the NBA.

    Go Duke...
    It's a good comparison with the bolded part being understated. The team that drafts Zion #1 will want him to be the offensive fulcrum, the primary playmaker on offense. I think he'll be able to do that Giannis-style where if you surround Zion with 4 shooters, he'll either score at the rim or find the open guy. On defense, Draymond is one of the greatest defenders of all-time, so Zion probably won't be quite that good, but you're right that he should be able to guard all 5 positions and Zion-at-the-5 projects to be a devastating look.

    Personality-wise, I'm hoping that Zion will be more likable and will do less nutcracking on the court.

    Quote Originally Posted by flyingdutchdevil View Post
    Green adds incredible D, leadership, playmaking, and 3pt shooting to his team.

    I truly believe Zion will be inferior to Green's D (because Green is a top 5 defender in the league) and Green's 3pt shooting. As for leadership and playmaking, that's TBD.

    However, Zion is a better ball handler, scorer from anywhere else on the court, rebounder, etc etc. Basically, I think they are quite different players despite both being amazing at the 5 in small ball line-ups.
    Should be noted that Green is only shooting 23% from three this season and is only at 32% for his career. Zion could be worse, of course, but I'd give him a solid chance to match that.

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