2020 Presidential Election

[budwom]

^ Younguns rarely fail to disappoint when it comes to turning out to vote. Might this year be different? I have no clue whatsoever...

[dudog84]

^ Younguns rarely fail to disappoint when it comes to turning out to vote. Might this year be different? I have no clue whatsoever...

I would like to see if their numbers are poor in regards to population, or registered voters. Seems to me if you register then you plan to vote.

[sagegrouse]

Per the Hatch Act, no. The Hatch Act explicitly applies to all executive branch employees, except for the President and Vice President, and prohibits such employees from engaging in various forms of partisan political activity (such as campaigning for a candidate while using their official titles or fundraising for a political campaign). The purpose is to prevent executive branch employees from misusing their positions to benefit candidates they like.

Whether that gets enforced at all is another matter, but the law is actually pretty clear here.

The Hatch Act has exceptions, which frees up Cabinet and other officials for certain activities:

It provides that persons below the policy-making level in the executive branch of the federal government must not only refrain from political practices that would be illegal for any citizen, but must abstain from "any active part" in political campaigns, using this language to specify those who are exempt:

(i) an employee paid from an appropriation for the Executive Office of the President; or
(ii) an employee appointed by the President, by and with the advice and consent of the Senate, whose position is located within the United States, who determines policies to be pursued by the United States in the nationwide administration of Federal laws.

[camion]

The Hatch Act has exceptions, which frees up Cabinet and other officials for certain activities:

It provides that persons below the policy-making level in the executive branch of the federal government must not only refrain from political practices that would be illegal for any citizen, but must abstain from "any active part" in political campaigns, using this language to specify those who are exempt:

(i) an employee paid from an appropriation for the Executive Office of the President; or
(ii) an employee appointed by the President, by and with the advice and consent of the Senate, whose position is located within the United States, who determines policies to be pursued by the United States in the nationwide administration of Federal laws.

Interesting. Where would temporary appointees not confirmed by the Senate fall?

[budwom]

I would like to see if their numbers are poor in regards to population, or registered voters. Seems to me if you register then you plan to vote.

You have to register AND vote? Ha, maybe that explains it...honestly, I have no idea, but in the past they just haven't turned out in very large numbers...

[jimsumner]

^ Younguns rarely fail to disappoint when it comes to turning out to vote. Might this year be different? I have no clue whatsoever...

If you go to the trouble to register why not go to the trouble to vote?

[budwom]

If you go to the trouble to register why not go to the trouble to vote?

Can't answer that, but evidently a lot of young people failed to vote in the Dem primaries...nationwide, we always have a lot of registered voters who fail to vote...

[CrazyNotCrazie]

If you go to the trouble to register why not go to the trouble to vote?

Because when a good looking member of the other gender standing on the Bryan Center walkway asks you to register, you do it. But that person isn't driving you to the polling place and/or filling out the paperwork to get an absentee ballot.

[YmoBeThere]

Registering to vote can be done coincident with other activities such as getting your driver's license. Or it used to be that way. Lining up and voting or getting a mail in ballot sent to you, filling it out and then mailing it takes additional "work". I track processes where members of the association I work for must take action to save money. The fallout at each step is not insignificant. When you have a more steps, naturally, the more fall out.

[lotusland]

Money is fungible. It really doesn't matter.

I’m probably the only one cracking up over this comment but I forwarded a screenshot to two buddies who had a very loud drunk argument years ago over whether or not winnings from a gas station scratch off lottery ticket were to be shared. Person 2 remained in the car but gave person 1 cash for gas and a drink. Person 1 also bought a scratch off that paid-off $80. Person 2 insisted that his money was “fungible” so he was due $40 from the winning ticket. The argument carried over until we arrived at my house. My neighbor came over to see what the problem was as person 2 was screaming “it’s fungible you idiot” to person 1 on my back deck. Good times.

[dudog84]

I’m probably the only one cracking up over this comment but I forwarded a screenshot to two buddies who had a very loud drunk argument years ago over whether or not winnings from a gas station scratch off lottery ticket were to be shared. Person 2 remained in the car but gave person 1 cash for gas and a drink. Person 1 also bought a scratch off that paid-off $80. Person 2 insisted that his money was “fungible” so he was due $40 from the winning ticket. The argument carried over until we arrived at my house. My neighbor came over to see what the problem was as person 2 was screaming “it’s fungible you idiot” to person 1 on my back deck. Good times.

I would have given him back the money for the gas and drink. Heck no on the $40.

'course it also depends on how good a friend he was, and how big a jerk he became arguing about it. Might have been zero.

[Bluedog]

The BLM movement currently has pretty solid majority support according to polls, with white voters having a slim majority that support it. If BLM voices that convey the below (and if looting/destruction of businesses occur with regularity) drown out those that are advocating for social justice, and criminal justice reform, and other policy based reforms, then I could see suburban white voters being alienated from D's as fairly or not, it's viewed in those lens. This also brings to light the BLM advocates are not a monolith -- and many supporters have different perspectives. Those not as embedded in the movement can choose to focus on those particular voices that they choose to and ascribe it to the entire movement.

https://www.nbcchicago.com/news/loca...y/2320365/?amp

“I don’t care if someone decides to loot a Gucci or a Macy’s or a Nike store, because that makes sure that person eats,” Ariel Atkins, a BLM organizer, said. “That makes sure that person has clothes.”

“That is reparations,” Atkins said. “Anything they wanted to take, they can take it because these businesses have insurance.”

For the record, the mayor of Chicago, Lori Lightfoot (of course a Democrat, who also happens to be black and gay) was unequivocal in her condemnation of the "criminals" and how organized crime does nothing to help anybody. She wants them arrested and prosecuted. It wasn't an offshoot of ongoing protests in this case and was a social media organized rampage of the fancy stores in Chicago. She's currently infighting a bit with the State's Attorney, Kim Foxx (of Jussie Smollett fame), for dropping charges similar in nature to these in recent history (felony robberies). So, again not a single "voice" among two black liberal women.

Obviously, Chicago and IL aren't going red, but people read these stories throughout the country. Not sure it helps Trump, but may have some impact downballot if the narrative/story shifts. Clearly Trump in his ads will play on these themes.

[SouthernDukie]

T

Obviously, Chicago and IL aren't going red, but people read these stories throughout the country. Not sure it helps Trump, but may have some impact downballot if the narrative/story shifts. Clearly Trump in his ads will play on these themes.

Oh, you can bet your sweet bippy it helps Trump if that's how the narrative is framed nationally. Add to that the recent EO from Trump and now the fight over College Football, and my bet is that any sizable lead Biden had is shrinking quickly. I'll be very interested to see polling that takes these recent issues into consideration.

How can this not be helping Trump with that independent vote that will certainly care about "safety" (from violence and looting), money in their pocket, and a very passionate American pastime? And how will Biden counter these developments?

Again, not advocating for anything. Just asking questions and analyzing the developments.

[nmduke2001]

Oh, you can bet your sweet bippy it helps Trump if that's how the narrative is framed nationally. Add to that the recent EO from Trump and now the fight over College Football, and my bet is that any sizable lead Biden had is shrinking quickly. I'll be very interested to see polling that takes these recent issues into consideration.

How can this not be helping Trump with that independent vote that will certainly care about "safety" (from violence and looting), money in their pocket, and a very passionate American pastime? And how will Biden counter these developments?

Again, not advocating for anything. Just asking questions and analyzing the developments.

I think the money and football are easy for Binden to counter. For money, he just has to point out that the payroll tax only benefits those people that actually have a paycheck. You could also sprinkle in some thoughts on reducing social security. You can also stand on a soap box and tell anyone that will listen that Larry Kudlow, Trump's economic adviser, is again pushing for a reduction of the capital gains tax. How does this help people that are struggling and unemployed? It doesn't, it helps the rich.

For football, you simply blame the whole thing on the federal response. You show commercials with foreign leaders taking the pandemic seriously at the beginning and then flash forward to today with those same countries having live sports with fans. Then you switch to Trump saying things from March and April and then show empty college football stadiums. Add a voice over that says something like, "If Trump took this seriously in April, we'd be getting ready for tailgates today but he didn't and now we can't enjoy one of the best American past times."

The violence is harder. I wrote a long time ago up thread that Biden needed to get ahead of the "Defund the Police" issue. He still has some time but he needs to hit it hard.

[SouthernDukie]

I think the money and football are easy for Binden to counter. For money, he just has to point out that the payroll tax only benefits those people that actually have a paycheck. You could also sprinkle in some thoughts on reducing social security. You can also stand on a soap box and tell anyone that will listen that Larry Kudlow, Trump's economic adviser, is again pushing for a reduction of the capital gains tax. How does this help people that are struggling and unemployed? It doesn't, it helps the rich.

For football, you simply blame the whole thing on the federal response. You show commercials with foreign leaders taking the pandemic seriously at the beginning and then flash forward to today with those same countries having live sports with fans. Then you switch to Trump saying things from March and April and then show empty college football stadiums. Add a voice over that says something like, "If Trump took this seriously in April, we'd be getting ready for tailgates today but he didn't and now we can't enjoy one of the best American past times."

The violence is harder. I wrote a long time ago up thread that Biden needed to get ahead of the "Defund the Police" issue. He still has some time but he needs to hit it hard.

Great points. I agree about those being the most effective counters, but I still wonder if just the symbolism alone of Trump getting out there first on these issues doesn't bake in sentiment among many voters. I realize he has the advantage of the bully pulpit as it is, but Biden has to get moving or he's going to see his lead vanish completely, imho.

[dudog84]

Oh, you can bet your sweet bippy it helps Trump if that's how the narrative is framed nationally. Add to that the recent EO from Trump and now the fight over College Football, and my bet is that any sizable lead Biden had is shrinking quickly. I'll be very interested to see polling that takes these recent issues into consideration.

How can this not be helping Trump with that independent vote that will certainly care about "safety" (from violence and looting), money in their pocket, and a very passionate American pastime? And how will Biden counter these developments?

Again, not advocating for anything. Just asking questions and analyzing the developments.

1. Biden polls better than Trump on "safety".
2. That money in their pocket is not going to materialize. Even if it does, it's not going to last long. Congress actually has some power (of the purse) here.
3. Maybe I'm just not as passionate about football, but I still believe most people care more about the health of their grandparents, parents, children, loved ones, maybe even friends, and surely themselves than they do about football. Come November 3, we'll be rolling on 250,000 deaths and probably be in the midst of the expected fall surge. Many more with lingering effects. There's going to be at most 2 degrees of separation between everyone in this country and someone who has been deeply affected by COVID.

Yes, usually "It's the economy, stupid". In 2020, "It's COVID, stupid". Not to mention that the economy is inextricably linked to COVID as well.

[nmduke2001]

Great points. I agree about those being the most effective counters, but I still wonder if just the symbolism alone of Trump getting out there first on these issues doesn't bake in sentiment among many voters. I realize he has the advantage of the bully pulpit as it is, but Biden has to get moving or he's going to see his lead vanish completely, imho.

Agreed. I would have the football commercial ready to run this week. It's important in the south. If you're Biden, you really need to play the blame game with Trump. I saw an article yesterday that Buzzfeed was asking 2016 Trump voters that are not voting for him this election, to give them a reason why. There were a lot of "no football this year. He should have taken Covid more seriously." If Biden can push that narrative, I think it helps his cause. Trump was smart to get ahead of it a bit.

[AustinDevil]

Great points. I agree about those being the most effective counters, but I still wonder if just the symbolism alone of Trump getting out there first on these issues doesn't bake in sentiment among many voters. I realize he has the advantage of the bully pulpit as it is, but Biden has to get moving or he's going to see his lead vanish completely, imho.

What are you talking about with respect to "getting out there first" on further economic relief? The House passed its next-stage bill in May. Moreover, I wonder if now that Trump has gotten out there with a personal promise that he alone is providing economic relief, how that's going to play out as the promise falls apart even before lawsuits (e.g., states already balking at contributing 25% of the added unemployment aid).

[Devilwin]

The BLM movement currently has pretty solid majority support according to polls, with white voters having a slim majority that support it. If BLM voices that convey the below (and if looting/destruction of businesses occur with regularity) drown out those that are advocating for social justice, and criminal justice reform, and other policy based reforms, then I could see suburban white voters being alienated from D's as fairly or not, it's viewed in those lens. This also brings to light the BLM advocates are not a monolith -- and many supporters have different perspectives. Those not as embedded in the movement can choose to focus on those particular voices that they choose to and ascribe it to the entire movement.

https://www.nbcchicago.com/news/loca...y/2320365/?amp

“I don’t care if someone decides to loot a Gucci or a Macy’s or a Nike store, because that makes sure that person eats,” Ariel Atkins, a BLM organizer, said. “That makes sure that person has clothes.”

“That is reparations,” Atkins said. “Anything they wanted to take, they can take it because these businesses have insurance.”

For the record, the mayor of Chicago, Lori Lightfoot (of course a Democrat, who also happens to be black and gay) was unequivocal in her condemnation of the "criminals" and how organized crime does nothing to help anybody. She wants them arrested and prosecuted. It wasn't an offshoot of ongoing protests in this case and was a social media organized rampage of the fancy stores in Chicago. She's currently infighting a bit with the State's Attorney, Kim Foxx (of Jussie Smollett fame), for dropping charges similar in nature to these in recent history (felony robberies). So, again not a single "voice" among two black liberal women.

Obviously, Chicago and IL aren't going red, but people read these stories throughout the country. Not sure it helps Trump, but may have some impact downballot if the narrative/story shifts. Clearly Trump in his ads will play on these themes.

Is Ms Atkins serious?


















.0

[YmoBeThere]

There were a lot of "no football this year. He should have taken Covid more seriously." If Biden can push that narrative, I think it helps his cause. Trump was smart to get ahead of it a bit.

At least from my perspective, Biden doesn't appear to have pushed much of anything. I said it a week or two ago, there is a point where letting Trump inflict damage to himself is no longer a sufficient strategy.