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  1. #8521
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    St. Louis, MO

    Twitter and Trump

    I am embarrassed to say I went off on my dad one time when he said that Trump has to use Twitter because it’s the only way he can get the truth out. I asked him if he had ever read Trump’s Twitter feed; the answer, of course, was no. I am relaying this because I think it provides some insight into how Trump will play the feud with Twitter to his advantage. This whole thing will be twisted into some sort of Deep State conspiracy theory, “they” are attempting to silence Trump and keep him from getting “the truth” out. The same people who think masks and stay at home orders interfere with their civil liberties will view this as an attack on free speech. What this means, of course, is that those who are solidly in his corner will remain so; hopefully they will not be incited to violence on his behalf. The question is, how will this whole thing play out with people like my dad, people who watch Fox News religiously but have never looked at Twitter a day in their life? Will any of these people (the 70+ demographic) be swayed by the Trump vs Twitter feud? Part of me thinks my dad is tiring of Trump’s antics, and public opinion polls seem to support that others do not approve of his handling of SARS-CoV-2. Will Twitter sway anyone one way or the other?

    My dad does think the ones protesting masks and stay at home orders are ridiculous; I wonder what would happen if someone read a few of Trump’s tweets to him. You know, the ones where he encourages them and pushes baseless conspiracy theories. I know just the person who will be ready with Twitter if it ever comes up again...

  2. #8522
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Vermont
    Quote Originally Posted by Steven43 View Post
    ‘Game Change’ sounds like a book I really need to read. I didn’t know about it before you mentioned it. Care to sell me your copy?

    By the way, what is the scoop on Abrams? Why do you think she would be a bad choice? She’s not on my preferred list, so I don’t have a dog in this fight. I just want your honest opinion. Thanks.
    without getting into details and politics, Game Change was fascinating because once the people charged with prepping Palin for debates started working with her, (all Republicans, of course) they were flabbergasted (not an exaggeration) about how little she knew about world and national events...and despite their best efforts to prep her, she remained disinterested. Really an interesting read.

  3. #8523
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    St. Louis, MO

    Klobuchar

    Initially, I didn’t like Klobuchar. She ultimately won me over, and I do think she has the experience for the job. I think she is someone that could work effectively with the Senate. The current situation might change her status. I agree that Cory Booker would’ve been a good choice if Biden hadn’t already said he would pick a woman. Kamala Harris and Elizabeth Warren have been mentioned a lot, and Warren is being mentioned often as someone who would help Biden win the election.

    The question for the group is, how important is it for the VP to have some familiarity with the Senate? It does seem to me that you’d want someone who can effectively lobby the Senate on the President’s behalf, and an experienced Senator would be just the person to do that. Of the past (pick a number) five VPs, which have been the best/most effective, and what did they do before becoming VP? If the answer is that the best ones have been former Senators, who could simultaneously help Biden win and work effectively with the Senate and House?

    I’ve talked myself into a new answer: Kamala Harris. I’ve been thinking about the older, more moderate demographic and forgetting another very large demographic: the millennials. My nephew lived with me last summer for an internship, and I made him watch the debates. He liked Harris a lot. She was his pick of the bunch. If Harris someone who could get the younger generation excited enough to make them vote, and if she could help with Biden’s domestic policy vision, she would be a great pick.

  4. #8524
    Quote Originally Posted by ArkieDukie View Post
    Initially, I didn’t like Klobuchar. She ultimately won me over, and I do think she has the experience for the job. I think she is someone that could work effectively with the Senate. The current situation might change her status. I agree that Cory Booker would’ve been a good choice if Biden hadn’t already said he would pick a woman. Kamala Harris and Elizabeth Warren have been mentioned a lot, and Warren is being mentioned often as someone who would help Biden win the election.

    The question for the group is, how important is it for the VP to have some familiarity with the Senate? It does seem to me that you’d want someone who can effectively lobby the Senate on the President’s behalf, and an experienced Senator would be just the person to do that. Of the past (pick a number) five VPs, which have been the best/most effective, and what did they do before becoming VP? If the answer is that the best ones have been former Senators, who could simultaneously help Biden win and work effectively with the Senate and House?

    I’ve talked myself into a new answer: Kamala Harris. I’ve been thinking about the older, more moderate demographic and forgetting another very large demographic: the millennials. My nephew lived with me last summer for an internship, and I made him watch the debates. He liked Harris a lot. She was his pick of the bunch. If Harris someone who could get the younger generation excited enough to make them vote, and if she could help with Biden’s domestic policy vision, she would be a great pick.
    Yes, and Millennials really dislike Biden, from my conversations with coworkers. They will vote for him, but Harris would make it an easier sell.
       

  5. #8525
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Norfolk, VA
    Quote Originally Posted by ArkieDukie View Post
    I’ve talked myself into a new answer: Kamala Harris. I’ve been thinking about the older, more moderate demographic and forgetting another very large demographic: the millennials. My nephew lived with me last summer for an internship, and I made him watch the debates. He liked Harris a lot. She was his pick of the bunch. If Harris someone who could get the younger generation excited enough to make them vote, and if she could help with Biden’s domestic policy vision, she would be a great pick.
    I disagree. Kamala Harris is polarizing. Biden doesn’t need a VP to get him votes, he needs a VP who will not lose him votes. Harris would be a bad choice.
    Bob Green

  6. #8526
    Quote Originally Posted by OldPhiKap View Post
    I agree with this, although governors seem to be popular launching points. Not many presidents since WW II were first elected with national elected experience:

    Trump - no political experience at all
    Obama - barely (never served a full term)
    W - no
    Clinton -no
    GHWB - yes, lots
    Reagan - no
    Carter - no
    Nixon - yes, a good bit
    LBJ - yes, lots
    Kennedy - yes
    Eisenhower - none
    Truman - yes

    So, only 1 of the last 7, and 5 of the last 12.

    ETA - having said that, Abrams cannot be under serious consideration. It is an MSNBC fantasy with no real basis IMHO.

    I'll take issue with your last three.

    1. Kennedy had been a Lt. in the navy in WWII, a congressman and a junior Senator from Mass prior to his run. No executive or foreign relations experience.

    2. Eisenhower had been one of about 5 ever Generals of the Army (5 Stars) and had been Supreme Allied Commander for the European Theater in WWII and had interacted with all the Political leaders of the era. That seems to me to be extensive administrative, executive and foreign policy experience.

    3. Truman had been a back bench Senator from Missouri prior to being selected as Roosevelt's VP running mate for 1944 when the Dem party became disenchanted with Henry Wallace and decided to replace him. He had no executive or relevant foreign policy experience.

  7. #8527
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Undisclosed
    Quote Originally Posted by Indoor66 View Post
    I'll take issue with your last three.

    1. Kennedy had been a Lt. in the navy in WWII, a congressman and a junior Senator from Mass prior to his run. No executive or foreign relations experience.

    2. Eisenhower had been one of about 5 ever Generals of the Army (5 Stars) and had been Supreme Allied Commander for the European Theater in WWII and had interacted with all the Political leaders of the era. That seems to me to be extensive administrative, executive and foreign policy experience.

    3. Truman had been a back bench Senator from Missouri prior to being selected as Roosevelt's VP running mate for 1944 when the Dem party became disenchanted with Henry Wallace and decided to replace him. He had no executive or relevant foreign policy experience.
    I don’t disagree with any of this, I was merely logging elected federal miles. Kennedy and Truman had some elected federal experience but were still pretty green by most standards; Eisenhower had no elected experience but conquered Europe with international players.

  8. #8528
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    St. Louis, MO
    Quote Originally Posted by Bob Green View Post
    I disagree. Kamala Harris is polarizing. Biden doesn’t need a VP to get him votes, he needs a VP who will not lose him votes. Harris would be a bad choice.
    I do agree that Harris is polarizing and would lose votes, but would she lose more than she would gain? Not trying to be contrary; I am still mulling. Amongst people like my dad, she is definitely polarizing and would cost votes. But, would Biden have a legitimate shot at these votes in the first place? I’d like to think it could happen, but I’m not convinced.

    Quote Originally Posted by budwom View Post
    without getting into details and politics, Game Change was fascinating because once the people charged with prepping Palin for debates started working with her, (all Republicans, of course) they were flabbergasted (not an exaggeration) about how little she knew about world and national events...and despite their best efforts to prep her, she remained disinterested. Really an interesting read.
    Palin is the textbook example of a VP candidate costing votes. I was undecided until hearing the VP debate and seeing what an absolute imbecile Palin is. Given McCain’s age, I didn’t want someone like that in the VP seat, and I didn’t want her to EVER have a chance of becoming President. (Side bar: first time I saw Palin, my first thought was, it’s really too bad Tina Fey isn’t on SNL any more; she could be Palin’s twin. Little did I know she would come back just to play Palin.)

  9. #8529
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Steamboat Springs, CO
    Quote Originally Posted by Indoor66 View Post
    I'll take issue with your last three.

    1. Kennedy had been a Lt. in the navy in WWII, a congressman and a junior Senator from Mass prior to his run. No executive or foreign relations experience.

    2. Eisenhower had been one of about 5 ever Generals of the Army (5 Stars) and had been Supreme Allied Commander for the European Theater in WWII and had interacted with all the Political leaders of the era. That seems to me to be extensive administrative, executive and foreign policy experience.

    3. Truman had been a back bench Senator from Missouri prior to being selected as Roosevelt's VP running mate for 1944 when the Dem party became disenchanted with Henry Wallace and decided to replace him. He had no executive or relevant foreign policy experience.
    IMHO, where the H got lost in Hawaii after WW II, Kennedy had a lot of international experience -- not only his wartime service overseas, but his international travels as a young congressman, where he would request to meet with independence groups on his visits to colonies, and his service on the Senate Foreign Relations Committee.

    You are right that Henry Wallace lost support among many in the Democratic Party during his time as VP. Truman was best known for the "Truman Committee" to investigate corruption and inefficiency among contractors. From the US Senate web site:
    No senator ever gained greater political benefits from chairing a special investigating committee than did Missouri's Harry S. Truman.

    In 1940, as World War II tightened its grip on Europe, Congress prepared for eventual U.S. involvement by appropriating $10 billion in defense contracts. Early in 1941, stories of widespread contractor mismanagement reached Senator Truman. In typical fashion, he decided to go take a look. During his 10,000-mile tour of military bases, he discovered that contractors were being paid a fixed profit no matter how inefficient their operations proved to be. He also found that a handful of corporations headquartered in the East were receiving a disproportionately greater share of the contracts.

    Convinced that waste and corruption were strangling the nation's efforts to mobilize itself for the war in Europe, Truman conceived the idea for a special Senate Committee to Investigate the National Defense Program.
    Sage Grouse

    ---------------------------------------
    'When I got on the bus for my first road game at Duke, I saw that every player was carrying textbooks or laptops. I coached in the SEC for 25 years, and I had never seen that before, not even once.' - David Cutcliffe to Duke alumni in Washington, DC, June 2013

  10. #8530
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Hot'Lanta... home of the Falcons!
    Just wondering... what is so polarizing about Harris that is not about Warren or Klobuchar?

    I fully agree that Abrams does not have the experience to be under serious consideration. Biden's pick will have a very real chance of being the first female vice president and will likely be the early front-runner for President in 2024 (when Biden steps side). I'm a fan of her's but Abrams background is just not appropriate for so lofty a position.
    Why are you wasting time here when you could be wasting it by listening to the latest episode of the DBR Podcast?

  11. #8531
    Quote Originally Posted by JasonEvans View Post
    Just wondering... what is so polarizing about Harris that is not about Warren or Klobuchar?

    I fully agree that Abrams does not have the experience to be under serious consideration. Biden's pick will have a very real chance of being the first female vice president and will likely be the early front-runner for President in 2024 (when Biden steps side). I'm a fan of her's but Abrams background is just not appropriate for so lofty a position.
    I mean, I agree, but one need not look far (i.e. the current President) that apparently a large portion of the electorate doesn't care about political experience and instead is evaluating on other qualities. And of course, Obama had fairly limited political experience as well if you go by number of years in politics.

    Although you could certainly easily argue that you think relevant experience is helpful to do a good job as president. Perhaps there are certain segments that care more about relevant experience than others (i.e. maybe the current Republican base cares less than the Democratic base, I don't know..could be the reverse for all I know).

    I simply state this to suggest that perhaps posters on DBR care more about experience than the vast majority of voters. My guess is that those highly trained/educated care more because they see it as a prerequisite to do their own jobs and then reasonably conclude that if it's the case for their job, then surely that should be the case for the most powerful person in the United States.
       

  12. #8532
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Norfolk, VA
    Quote Originally Posted by JasonEvans View Post
    Just wondering... what is so polarizing about Harris that is not about Warren or Klobuchar?
    Warren is equally polarizing. Harris and Warren could hurt Biden with his base. With either on the ticket, folks could throw their hands up in frustration and stay home on November 3.

    Klobuchar is a moderate who appeals to Biden’s base. But she is most likely out of the picture now due to current events.
    Bob Green

  13. #8533
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    New Bern, NC unless it's a home football game then I'm grilling on Devil's Alley
    Quote Originally Posted by Bluedog View Post
    I mean, I agree, but one need not look far (i.e. the current President) that apparently a large portion of the electorate doesn't care about political experience and instead is evaluating on other qualities.
    One of the reasons that Trump won is because he touted himself as NOT being a politician. Obviously, that worked out well for him. It's a reason that Ross Perot did so well in his campaigns.
    I don't think that voters are going to climb on board for the same idea in a VP pick. They will want someone that knows the ropes and has proven it.
    Q "Why do you like Duke, you didn't even go there." A "Because my art school didn't have a basketball team."

  14. #8534
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Vermont

    Palin video

    If you have 55 seconds to spare, this video is a pretty enlightening: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=teWo2rKuLH0

  15. #8535
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Outside Philly
    Quote Originally Posted by budwom View Post
    If you have 55 seconds to spare, this video is a pretty enlightening: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=teWo2rKuLH0
    Sounds representative of a large swath of the American public, which was part of her appeal I assume.

    There are a lot of folks who are just anti-expert for whatever reason and don’t want to or can’t engage in complex issues. Just is what it is.
       

  16. #8536
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Vermont
    Quote Originally Posted by bundabergdevil View Post
    Sounds representative of a large swath of the American public, which was part of her appeal I assume.

    There are a lot of folks who are just anti-expert for whatever reason and don’t want to or can’t engage in complex issues. Just is what it is.
    yes, however it's probably in our best interest that none of them becomes the vice president of the United States.

  17. #8537
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Colorado
    Quote Originally Posted by Bob Green View Post
    I disagree. Kamala Harris is polarizing. Biden doesn’t need a VP to get him votes, he needs a VP who will not lose him votes. Harris would be a bad choice.
    Bob, I'm not looking to argue your conclusion but am curious. Why do you think Kamala Harris is polarizing?

  18. #8538
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Steamboat Springs, CO
    Quote Originally Posted by MartyClark View Post
    Bob, I'm not looking to argue your conclusion but am curious. Why do you think Kamala Harris is polarizing?
    People who know her much better than I do think the world of her. I find her political speech a little off-putting. My issue with her and a bunch of the other candidates is that she doesn't have a lot of experience -- only two years in the Senate when she announced her campaign. You say, just like Barack Obama -- but really, everyone thinks they can be Barack Obama, but it's harder than it looks.
    Sage Grouse

    ---------------------------------------
    'When I got on the bus for my first road game at Duke, I saw that every player was carrying textbooks or laptops. I coached in the SEC for 25 years, and I had never seen that before, not even once.' - David Cutcliffe to Duke alumni in Washington, DC, June 2013

  19. #8539
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Outside Philly
    Quote Originally Posted by budwom View Post
    yes, however it's probably in our best interest that none of them becomes the vice president of the United States.
    Singing to the choir. I like my doctors to have gone to a reputable medical school, you know?

    Quote Originally Posted by MartyClark View Post
    Bob, I'm not looking to argue your conclusion but am curious. Why do you think Kamala Harris is polarizing?
    My two cents --- I think polarizing and divisive get thrown around a lot, mostly to describe our political adversaries. Pence, for example, is polarizing if you're not an evangelical but, if you are, he's as inclusive as can be. Obama had more people vote for him than any other presidential candidate in history but millions of Americans still call him the most divisive president in history. The cycle of election usually goes with the opponent calling the incumbent polarizing and not representative of the whole population then, if they win, calling for unity. We're not unified and never have been. That being said, polarizing figures definitely exist. Usually they need to have been in the national spotlight for quite some time so the public can form strong opinions about them.

    I'm not sure how much the public has formed an opinion about Harris --- I personally thought she didn't articulate her political vision well at all --- so I don't know she's such a national figure as to be truly polarizing. She is a well-educated, California (San Francisco) liberal Democrat and she is an aggressive African American woman. I think some of her perceived divisiveness can be attributed to how some people perceive those things.
    Last edited by bundabergdevil; 05-30-2020 at 12:12 PM.

  20. #8540
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Tennessee

    Biden able to finish first term?

    Do many of you feel Biden will be able to complete the first term? I am concerned that whoever is the VP will de facto become the President when he is declared incapable to continue.
    Last edited by JasonEvans; 05-30-2020 at 01:38 PM.

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