MBB: Gonzaga 89, Duke 87 Post-Game Thread

[jipops]

ESPN already starting the Zags may be the best team in America narrative. Duke is back in the pack. Could the Zags beat the Cavs?

That’s not hype enough. We already know Duke can beat the Cavs. Therefore the Zags can beat the Raptors.

The espn hype machine is truly moronic. If you bought into this clown show then you would be extremely disappointed by today. Apparently it was some foregone conclusion that we would be undefeated this season simply because of the UK outcome. But in reality this a team dominated by freshmen, playing in its 3rd game in 3 days, still a long ways from figuring it out defensively, and still struggling to score in halfcourt. I think we’re really good but I’m not at all convinced we’re a top 5 team. I still think we may just be the 3rd best team in the conference. But it’s November and a lot can change.

[proelitedota]

5 pages already. Must have been a loss.

[simplyluvin]

Not unreasonable given the Zags didn't have Tillie, who would have given us even more fits if he had been healthy. With that said, we barely saw Cam Reddish in this game, not to mention the best versions of not just some of the players, but of the entire *team* playing as a unit. I feel good about this Duke team growing from this experience.

Interesting from ESPN Stats & Info: "Duke allowed Gonzaga to shoot 52.3%, its worst defensive field goal percentage in a game in the last two seasons". Considering how last year's team had to go to zone to overcome its defensive deficiencies, that's saying something. Plenty of room for improvement.

This team has a little bit of the feel of 2015. Two things the kids need to and I believe will learn that clicked for 2015: 1) team defense and 2) fluidity of the offense. This team personality-wise is different from 2015, but I really like what our two captains have done. Jack may be like what Justise was on the defense and rebounding side.

[OldPhiKap]

5 pages already. Must have been a loss.

It’s over.

[devildeac]

And if Zion gets the ball in the high post or low blocks and goes hard to the rim and gets mauled like RJ did with no call, then what are we discussing? I still we're lamenting the horrid *efense for 30-35 minutes, a couple other fouls in the last couple minutes that were really looked like jump balls (with the possession arrow pointing to Duke), a touch foul on Jack in the last couple minutes, a couple 2 foot put-backs we missed late and the missed dunks already posted above. Hopefully we learn a lot from this.

[jv001]

Some early stats:

Zion= 22 points on 8-17, 6-6 Fts, 10 rebounds, 2 assists, 4 blocks. 2 turnovers. Excellent game.

RJ= 23 point on 9-25, 4-8 FTs, 7 rebounds, 3 assists, 1 block, 1 turnover. Ok game.

Tre= 17 points on 7-14, 2-2 FTs, 4 rebounds, 3 assists, 2 turnovers. Great game except the missed dunk. Lay it in young man when you are that open.

Cam= 10 points on 3-9, 2-2 Fts, 2 rebounds, 0 assists, 4 turnovers. Bad game all around.


Javin= 6 points on 1-1 and 4-6 FTs, 6 rebounds and 3 fouls in 15 minutes. Very good game but once again it shows that if he played the most of the game, he would not be around for the important finish. Quit fouling young man.

Captain Jack= only took 2 shots from the field and made 1, 3 points, 5 rebounds. Played very good defense but he fouled out. He had the toughest challenge with playing the Japanese Super Star.

I'm looking for Cam to snap out of his foul prone playing and plays up to his ability and I'm hoping Coach K shows RJ the recording of where it all broke down on those last 3 plays. Then I hope Coach K puts him in a better position to make better plays. GoDuke!

[Wildling]

Haven’t had a chance to watch a replay yet, but my in-real-time sense was that we weren’t running a coordinated offense that had all four others in the right space and with the same plays/options in mind. Those things come with time. We will see on the replay. If one of those shots falls, or a foul is called, we might not have the same view.

They are young. Two missed uncontested dunks. One experienced team that had years playing together and knew where teammates would/should be. We gave up lots of point blank shots - that’s generally on our bigs and our understanding of how to rotate or backfill on defense.

You may come out on the wrong end of the score in the last minute, but it’s a 40 minute game with lots of opportunities and streaks. We have a young team that doesn’t know how to own all those opportunities for the first 35-38minutes. They have probably never had to. We will have some struggles against older teams that have experience together even when we have a clear physical advantage. It’s the ups and downs with watching young one-and-done talent. Don’t blame them. It’s the system. We have won titles with less physically talented teams.

If you were a Duke undegrad, did you come in as a freshman with the ability to out-perform juniors, seniors and graduate students in your major? You might have been hot stuff in your high school, but it took you a while to adjust to the bigger stage and perform. Same for these guys. We have to live with that. Meanwhile, I just think we shouldn’t blame a loss on any one player. We should be better than that. I am sure RJ will have his share of great games.

I can't argue with what you are saying. However, my point still stands, should RJ continue to play hero ball (tonight was not the only night he's taken ill advised shots) at the end of a game and isn't getting positive results, you better get used to the heat coming his way.

[Skydog]

With this set of incredible players K has talked a lot about "just letting them play" (not calling plays for them). Works great against teams we can beat on pure athleticism and individual skill. But against well coached teams like the Zags we need more than that. It looked to me from the outset that our freshmen were short on ideas in half-court offense. I can't read their minds but I think they would have welcomed a bit of guidance in the form of a little bit more play calling from the sidelines.

I remember when Duke was a team who - even when our offense was struggling in regular play - were expected to score out of timeouts. Coach K would draw up a great play with a couple of built-in options, everyone knew what they had to do and they just concentrated on executing. But I don't remember seeing any chalk boarding tonight. And it seemed especially called for with this very young team during the last minute of a one possession game. We had at two or three timeouts when the coaching staff could have put in a well practiced play to free up a shooter. But it looked like it our only plan was to give it to RJ and hope. Even Jones looked perplexed what to do on the very last play and just ended up tossing it to RJ and watched him just repeat the completely predictable drive into the crowd. In fact I would have loved the last play being initiated/taken by Jones. His decision making is far superior at this point.

Final thought - if RJ is going to play iso at the end he needs to learn to take what the D gives him. The clogged lane was screaming for a pull up jumper.

[Devilwin]

I can't argue with what you are saying. However, my point still stands, should RJ continue to play hero ball (tonight was not the only night he's taken ill advised shots) at the end of a game and isn't getting positive results, you better get used to the heat coming his way.

Amen. He's not that great of a shooter either. We would have been better served with Cam or Zion taking a couple of those shots.

[jv001]

With this set of incredible players K has talked a lot about "just letting them play" (not calling plays for them). Works great against teams we can beat on pure athleticism and individual skill. But against well coached teams like the Zags we need more than that. It looked to me from the outset that our freshmen were short on ideas in half-court offense. I can't read their minds but I think they would have welcomed a bit of guidance in the form of a little bit more play calling from the sidelines.

I remember when Duke was a team who - even when our offense was struggling in regular play - were expected to score out of timeouts. Coach K would draw up a great play with a couple of built-in options, everyone knew what they had to do and they just concentrated on executing. But I don't remember seeing any chalk boarding tonight. And it seemed especially called for this mostly freshman team during the last minute of a one possession game. We had at two or three timeouts when the coaching staff could have put in a well practiced play to free up a shooter. But it looked like it our only plan was to give it to RJ and hope. Even Jones looked perplexed what to do on the very last play and just ended up tossing it to RJ and watched him just repeat the completely predictable drive into the crowd. In fact I would have loved the last play being initiated/taken by Jones. His decision making is far superior at this point.

Final thought - if RJ is going to play iso at the end he needs to learn to take what the D gives him. The clogged lane was screaming for a pull up jumper.

And he went ISO on a zone defense. GoDuke!

[dukelifer]

That’s not hype enough. We already know Duke can beat the Cavs. Therefore the Zags can beat the Raptors.

The espn hype machine is truly moronic. If you bought into this clown show then you would be extremely disappointed by today. Apparently it was some foregone conclusion that we would be undefeated this season simply because of the UK outcome. But in reality this a team dominated by freshmen, playing in its 3rd game in 3 days, still a long ways from figuring it out defensively, and still struggling to score in halfcourt. I think we’re really good but I’m not at all convinced we’re a top 5 team. I still think we may just be the 3rd best team in the conference. But it’s November and a lot can change.

We are better than I thought but I am not sure how we match up against the veteran ACC teams. But this team has the chops to play D. They need to work on their O in the half court. They are elite on the breaks.

[jipops]

Some early stats:


I'm looking for Cam to snap out of his foul prone playing and plays up to his ability and I'm hoping Coach K shows RJ the recording of where it all broke down on those last 3 plays. Then I hope Coach K puts him in a better position to make better plays. GoDuke!

Not exactly banner play calling made by K at the end either. Calling for an iso play at the end is something we can all do. And it led to yet another low percentage shot. I’d like to see K call for more ball screens and cuts or really anything to generate some ball movement to force the defense to shift. But sadly I think K has fallen in love with iso ball as much as Barrett has.

[curtis325]

Anybody know where to go to get a tattoo removed?

[Pghdukie]

Anybody know where to go to get a tattoo removed?

At the UNDO TATTOO parlor.

[WHOneedsSOX]

Not exactly banner play calling made by K at the end either. Calling for an iso play at the end is something we can all do. And it led to yet another low percentage shot. I’d like to see K call for more ball screens and cuts or really anything to generate some ball movement to force the defense to shift. But sadly I think K has fallen in love with iso ball as much as Barrett has.

Almost every coach will let his best player get a mismatch and go 1 on 1. Barrett beat his man and was open about 15 feet out. It's on him to make a play from there. He had an easier 13 foot pull up but didn't want it and drove into 2 guys waiting for him.

[Duke76]

Good job to hang in there, but Barrett got way too selfish at the end. Driving into traffic every time. Youth showed throughout the game, but really showed at the end

may have been said already but he was wide open in the lane and should have put up a little runner before he rammed into the defender that blocked his shot...thats a shot Tre has down pat...surely he will learn that

[jv001]

At the UNDO TATTOO parlor.

Must spread some sporks. I needed that laugh. Thanks and GoDuke!

[jv001]

may have been said already but he was wide open in the lane and should have put up a little runner before he rammed into the defender that blocked his shot...thats a shot Tre has down pat...surely he will learn that

He better. That's a shot most NBA players have because you need it against the size of those players. Hey, the Zags have the size of some NBA teams. GoDuke!

[LSanders]

My $0.02:

- Can't remember the exact 1st half %, but Zags shot something like 60-65% I believe. That ended up at 52% for both 3s and total. So, our D got better.

- Bolton's red cape never made it back from the dry cleaners after Auburn.

- We outrebounded them 44-36 and 22-13 on offensive boards.

- We shot 26 FTs to their 19.

- We got stronger at the end, and they were running on fumes.

- Down by 17 and could have quit --> and never did.

All that, and we came within one shot of tying or beating the #3 team in the country which is loaded with juniors and seniors.

I don't see any doom 'n gloom here. Sure, we always want to win. But, the heart the freshmen showed - yes, including RJ - and the toughness Jack showed make me pretty sure this is going to be one very dangerous team in March. Home-&-Home with VA and the Cheats made us very unlikely to go undefeated anyway. So, a 2-pt loss in November to #3 ... Who cares?

We can all be living room coaches and point to things that could have been done differently. But, I see way more positive than negative. And, I think, based on the effort, these guys will work and learn to make sure this doesn't happen again.

As each 1&done team comes through, we watch early defensive struggles every year. Have any of them had this much heart? The only possible contender is the 2015 group, and they had Quinn, Amile, and Matt to prop them up.

I'm prouder and more excited about this team now than I was yesterday. As far as all the teaching that needs to be done ... In K we trust.

Last ... If I'm Gonzaga, I'm praying like fiends not to meet this team again in March or April.

[Skydog]

KP's Adj Offensive Efficiency, % Possessions Used

Tonight:
Barrett 105, 29%
Jones 125, 18%
Zion 130, 26%
Reddish 85, 23%
Bolden 174, 12%
White 194, 4%
DeLaurier 128, 18%

Season:
Barrett 107, 33.5%(!)
Jones 125, 16%
Zion 135, 29%%
Reddish 122, 26%
Bolden 141, 13%
White 149, 11%
DeLaurier 115, 15%

Reddish had an off night but Barrett's efficiency was pretty close to his season average of 107. That is way too low and significantly lower than that of his teammates. Given his inefficiency & very high possession usage rate it is amazing our team still has the #1 OE of 120pts/100!

I know RJ will bring that # up - he's too talented not to. He just needs to work on shot selection and reducing unforced turnovers. And free throws!