NBA Regular season thread 2019

[phaedrus]

Set record for 3’s in a game tonite (14). Assume he’s finished as he broke Curry’s previous record.

And he did it in barely half a game (26 minutes).

[accfanfrom1970]

Nice to see Quinn make buckets in the blowout.

[darthur]

The 50-40-90 club is the exclusive club of NBA players that have shot 50% from the field, 40% from three and 90% from the foul line for an entire season. Seven players have achieved this level of shooting; Price,Miller, Bird, Nowitzki, Durant, Nash and Curry. Of those seven, only 2 have done it more than once. Bird did it twice and Nash 4 times. Nash missed a fifth season by a single missed free throw which left him at 89.9% for the year. Only two players have been 5 percentage points higher in any one category during their 50-40-90 season, both Nash and Curry shot 45% from three once. Nash is ridiculously underrated as a shooter.

Steve Nash is the reason I got into the NBA. I love him and he is underrated as a shooter. He's still a very clear step below Steph IMO though, and 50-40-90 is misleading.

Curry has higher 2P% and higher 3P% than Nash, and blows him out of the water on TS%. The only reason Curry is not 50-40-90 all the time is he shoots waaay more 3s (including regularly leading the league in half-course heaves!) and that brings down overall FG%. And that's not even talking about degree-of-difficulty. If you watch old videos, you'll see people usually go under screens against Nash in pick-and-roll for example because the 3 was never Nash's main weapon. Nobody does that against Steph, either go over or even double-team.

I get why people don't like the Warriors but man, they're just so fun to watch if you like em.

[WillJ]

Steve Nash is the reason I got into the NBA. I love him and he is underrated as a shooter. He's still a very clear step below Steph IMO though, and 50-40-90 is misleading.

Curry has higher 2P% and higher 3P% than Nash, and blows him out of the water on TS%. The only reason Curry is not 50-40-90 all the time is he shoots waaay more 3s (including regularly leading the league in half-course heaves!) and that brings down overall FG%. And that's not even talking about degree-of-difficulty. If you watch old videos, you'll see people usually go under screens against Nash in pick-and-roll for example because the 3 was never Nash's main weapon. Nobody does that against Steph, either go over or even double-team.

I get why people don't like the Warriors but man, they're just so fun to watch if you like em.

Much of the Nash/Curry difference is mindset. Nash really thought of himself as a pass-first/shoot-last player, whereas Curry thinks to score first. Clearly, Curry's strategy was better, and Nash, as he has admitted, did not have the imagination/attitude/cojones to do what Curry has done. It would be interesting, however, to somehow transplant Curry's attitude on to Nash's 2004 skill set...I really think Nash could have been almost as good as Curry is now if he had shot more.

[Acymetric]

Steve Nash is the reason I got into the NBA. I love him and he is underrated as a shooter. He's still a very clear step below Steph IMO though, and 50-40-90 is misleading.

Curry has higher 2P% and higher 3P% than Nash, and blows him out of the water on TS%. The only reason Curry is not 50-40-90 all the time is he shoots waaay more 3s (including regularly leading the league in half-course heaves!) and that brings down overall FG%. And that's not even talking about degree-of-difficulty. If you watch old videos, you'll see people usually go under screens against Nash in pick-and-roll for example because the 3 was never Nash's main weapon. Nobody does that against Steph, either go over or even double-team.

I get why people don't like the Warriors but man, they're just so fun to watch if you like em.

Umm...where are you getting your numbers? 2P% is basically the same (Nash is just slightly higher). 3P% is slightly lower, overall FG% is higher. Curry gets the edge in eFG and TS percentage, but not in a way that blows Nash out of the water. Of course (and I know this is unrelated to shooting) Nash had a significant advantage in assist %.

Also worth pointing out that Nash's last 3-5 years were way past his prime and riddled with injuries which he tried to play through, bringing his career totals way down. For a more fair comparison, it would probably be appropriate at this point to compare Nash's career with the Suns (his "prime") with Curry's career so far (his "prime" more or less). Interestingly, their points per game are pretty similar. Also remember that, although it was improved, Nash did not benefit from some of the more recent defensive changes that opened things up for offenses.

	Curry	Nash (career)	Nash (Suns)
2P%	51.4%	51.8%	53.5%
3P%	43.8%	42.8%	43.5%
FG%	47.8%	49.0%	50.4%
FT%	90.4%	90.4%	90.7%
eFG%	58.0%	55.6%	57.1%
TS%	62.3%	60.5%	61.7%
Assist %	32.2%	41.5%	46.4%

[AGDukesky]

When assessing the best shooters, should shot selection be a criterion? Clearly, Curry seems to take and make the most difficult shots. I’d be curious what his % is on those long distance and/or blanket-defended shots. Maybe shooting % ultimately balances out good shooting with shot selection, I’m just wondering if Curry only took traditionally good shots, would his % make a more objective case for his shooting prowess...

[Duke79UNLV77]

When assessing the best shooters, should shot selection be a criterion? Clearly, Curry seems to take and make the most difficult shots. I’d be curious what his % is on those long distance and/or blanket-defended shots. Maybe shooting % ultimately balances out good shooting with shot selection, I’m just wondering if Curry only took traditionally good shots, would his % make a more objective case for his shooting prowess...

Nash was a very underrated, fantastic shooter. He hit a great percentages on 3's, even though, as noted, that wasn't his focus. Curry is the best shooter ever, in my opinion. I think if Curry got to shoot only Draymond Green 3's (i.e., no one within 5 feet, plenty of time to read the paper and square up, right by the 3-point line), he'd make about 80%.

[jimsumner]

Curry sometimes looks like he's just flinging the ball in the general direction of the basket. And it still goes in.

I think he met the Devil at the Crossroads on a moonless night and sold his soul.

Or perhaps he just practices a lot.

[NSDukeFan]

Curry sometimes looks like he's just flinging the ball in the general direction of the basket. And it still goes in.

I think he met the Devil at the Crossroads on a moonless night and sold his soul.

Or perhaps he just practices a lot.

And has great genetics.

And practices a lot.

And practices effectively.

If we’re talkin’ ‘bout practice.

[JasonEvans]

Jimmy Butler is going to sit out tonight's game as part of his strategy to demand a trade. He appears ready to do this every so often until the TWolves deal him. I don't know why the team is allowing this to fester. They are making themselves into desperation sellers and hurting their ability to get max value for one of the 10 best players in the league. I think they should take the Houston offer of 4 first rounders (provided none of the picks have any protection on them). I would not be at all surprised if 2 or 3 of those picks turn into lottery picks.

-Jason "how about this deal... Eric Gordon plus Houston's 2020, 2022, and 2024 first rounders" Evans

[devildeac]

Curry sometimes looks like he's just flinging the ball in the general direction of the basket. And it still goes in.

I think he met the Devil at the Crossroads on a moonless night and sold his soul.

Or perhaps he just practices a lot.

Somehow, I don't think Jim is fiddling around with this post.

[kAzE]

Umm...where are you getting your numbers? 2P% is basically the same (Nash is just slightly higher). 3P% is slightly lower, overall FG% is higher. Curry gets the edge in eFG and TS percentage, but not in a way that blows Nash out of the water. Of course (and I know this is unrelated to shooting) Nash had a significant advantage in assist %.

Also worth pointing out that Nash's last 3-5 years were way past his prime and riddled with injuries which he tried to play through, bringing his career totals way down. For a more fair comparison, it would probably be appropriate at this point to compare Nash's career with the Suns (his "prime") with Curry's career so far (his "prime" more or less). Interestingly, their points per game are pretty similar. Also remember that, although it was improved, Nash did not benefit from some of the more recent defensive changes that opened things up for offenses.

	Curry	Nash (career)	Nash (Suns)
2P%	51.4%	51.8%	53.5%
3P%	43.8%	42.8%	43.5%
FG%	47.8%	49.0%	50.4%
FT%	90.4%	90.4%	90.7%
eFG%	58.0%	55.6%	57.1%
TS%	62.3%	60.5%	61.7%
Assist %	32.2%	41.5%	46.4%

It's not really fair to compare their stats, because Curry puts up way more shots (meaning his similar efficiency is more impressive) , and most of them are way more difficult shots. Steph takes shots that would be considered terrible shots if they were by any other player. Off the dribble from 35 feet is a pretty normal shot for him when he's really going. Steve never had the range that Steph has. Nobody does.

Steve was an all-time great shooter, but Steph is the greatest shooter of all time.

[Acymetric]

It's not really fair to compare their stats, because Curry puts up way more shots, and most of them are way more difficult shots. Steph takes shots that would be considered terrible shots if they were by any other player. Off the dribble from 35 feet is a pretty normal shot for him when he's really going.

Steve was an all-time great shooter, but Steph is the greatest shooter of all time.

I agree with everything you're saying, my point was just that darthur was incorrect about the stats they mentioned. I probably wouldn't have said anything for most players, but I think Nash is criminally underrated so I thought it was appropriate to point out that the stats (which do not tell the whole story, clearly) are actually pretty darn close and in some cases favor Nash.

I'm also still a little bit mad at the NBA for handing the Spurs a finals appearance by suspending Amare/Diaw and get slightly triggered whenever anything Suns related is brought up (despite not actually being a Suns fan).

[elvis14]

Nash was a very underrated, fantastic shooter. He hit a great percentages on 3's, even though, as noted, that wasn't his focus. Curry is the best shooter ever, in my opinion. I think if Curry got to shoot only Draymond Green 3's (i.e., no one within 5 feet, plenty of time to read the paper and square up, right by the 3-point line), he'd make about 80%.

I'm just curious, why would Nash be considered an underrated shooter. If you watch NBA, and you watched it when Nash was playing, you know he was a great shooter. Saying that Curry is better isn't a knock on Nash...Curry is considered the best ever at this point. Curry is my favorite current player (which is a hard label to get if you didn't go to Duke) but there was a time where it was Nash...two MVP awards don't just happen.

[Acymetric]

I'm just curious, why would Nash be considered an underrated shooter. If you watch NBA, and you watched it when Nash was playing, you know he was a great shooter. Saying that Curry is better isn't a knock on Nash...Curry is considered the best ever at this point. Curry is my favorite current player (which is a hard label to get if you didn't go to Duke) but there was a time where it was Nash...two MVP awards don't just happen.

I think there is a tendency for people to think of Nash more for his distributing and forget how deadly he was from outside. He also (wrongly, especially when compared to modern players) sometimes gets pigeon-holed as a "system" guy from playing in D'Antoni's offense. Underrated is not the same as completely unappreciated (and it doesn't mean that literally every fan or media personality underrates him, just that some do and that he gets lost in discussions of past greats). The way his career ended also hurt him a little bit, I think.

[elvis14]

I think there is a tendency for people to think of Nash more for his distributing and forget how deadly he was from outside. He also (wrongly, especially when compared to modern players) sometimes gets pigeon-holed as a "system" guy from playing in D'Antoni's offense. Underrated is not the same as completely unappreciated (and it doesn't mean that literally every fan or media personality underrates him, just that some do and that he gets lost in discussions of past greats). The way his career ended also hurt him a little bit, I think.

I was so bummed with the way his career ended. When he went to LA, it could have been so much fun to watch if his health hadn't failed him.

[Indoor66]

I think he met the Devil at the Crossroads on a moonless night and sold his soul.

Was that down in Georgia?

[Acymetric]

Was that down in Georgia?

Nah, that was that stupid fiddle contest. If you want the Robert Johnson experience you go to Mississippi.

[JasonEvans]

Nah, that was that stupid fiddle contest. If you want the Robert Johnson experience you go to Mississippi.

The Devil Went Down to Georgia is just a silly song (though an enjoyable one to which I know every word). It isn't real.

But Robert Johnson absolutely, 100% went down to the crossroads and sold his soul to the devil. I'm certain of that.

[MChambers]

Curry sometimes looks like he's just flinging the ball in the general direction of the basket. And it still goes in.

I think he met the Devil at the Crossroads on a moonless night and sold his soul.

Or perhaps he just practices a lot.

You think he’s really Robert Johnson?