Dukies in the NBA 2018-19

[UrinalCake]

As a Chicago fan who has followed this front office for the last 15 years, I can say you are giving them too much credit.

Didn’t they trade away Elton Brand two years after drafting him so they could draft Eddy Curry? Man, that had to rank up there with the biggest dumb moves.

[Furniture]

https://mobile.twitter.com/DukeNBA/s...33041096863744


Why does @LukeKennard5
look like he’s happy to see his former teammate dunking?

[Furniture]

https://mobile.twitter.com/UpTheThun...06635427131392

Didnt like this guy. Have to change my mind now. Very nice indeed.

[moonpie23]

wow....coulda been ugly

[DavidBenAkiva]

Didn’t they trade away Elton Brand two years after drafting him so they could draft Eddy Curry? Man, that had to rank up there with the biggest dumb moves.

One of the all-time dumb moves by a front office in sports history. They could have paired a young Elton Brand with a young Tyson Chandler, held onto Ron Artest and Jamal Crawford when they had both broken into the league. They even had a young Brad Miller on that team so that Chandler had time to grow and adjust to the NBA. All they needed was a point guard to compete in the Eastern Conference for a decade. But no, they wanted to roll the dice on Eddy Curry because he was, I don't know, big or something. He looked really dominant in high school. Elton was dominant in college and was already averaging 20 and 10 in the NBA, but imagine what Eddy Curry could do if he, like, could learn to dribble, and shoot, and defend, and...

[thedukelamere]

One of the all-time dumb moves by a front office in sports history. They could have paired a young Elton Brand with a young Tyson Chandler, held onto Ron Artest and Jamal Crawford when they had both broken into the league. They even had a young Brad Miller on that team so that Chandler had time to grow and adjust to the NBA. All they needed was a point guard to compete in the Eastern Conference for a decade. But no, they wanted to roll the dice on Eddy Curry because he was, I don't know, big or something. He looked really dominant in high school. Elton was dominant in college and was already averaging 20 and 10 in the NBA, but imagine what Eddy Curry could do if he, like, could learn to dribble, and shoot, and defend, and...

Luckily that decision was documented in cartoon form:

[JasonEvans]

Didn’t they trade away Elton Brand two years after drafting him so they could draft Eddy Curry? Man, that had to rank up there with the biggest dumb moves.

One of the all-time dumb moves by a front office in sports history. They could have paired a young Elton Brand with a young Tyson Chandler, held onto Ron Artest and Jamal Crawford when they had both broken into the league. They even had a young Brad Miller on that team so that Chandler had time to grow and adjust to the NBA. All they needed was a point guard to compete in the Eastern Conference for a decade. But no, they wanted to roll the dice on Eddy Curry because he was, I don't know, big or something. He looked really dominant in high school. Elton was dominant in college and was already averaging 20 and 10 in the NBA, but imagine what Eddy Curry could do if he, like, could learn to dribble, and shoot, and defend, and...

Actually, the Brand trade was not for Eddie Curry, it was for the draft rights to Tyson Chandler. The Bulls already had the #4 pick, which they had used on Curry. They became enamored of Chandler though and they dealt Brand for his draft rights. Plus, Brand and Curry were thought to be very similar players and once the Bulls took Curry it made created a logjam in the front-court that trading Brand alleviated.

It was a truly awful deal as Brand went on to become an All-Star in LA for the Clippers (widely considered the worst franchise in basketball at the time, Brand and Maggette lead the Clips to the playoffs for the first time in 347 years... or something like that... in the mid-2000s and the franchise has been respectable ever since) while Curry and Chandler never did all that much for the Bulls (though Chandler went on to become a nice player for Dallas and the Knicks about a decade after being drafted.

-Jason "here is an article that talks a bit more about how awful this trade was" Evans

[CDu]

Didn’t they trade away Elton Brand two years after drafting him so they could draft Eddy Curry? Man, that had to rank up there with the biggest dumb moves.

Actually, the Brand trade was not for Eddie Curry, it was for the draft rights to Tyson Chandler. The Bulls already had the #4 pick, which they had used on Curry. They became enamored of Chandler though and they dealt Brand for his draft rights. Plus, Brand and Curry were thought to be very similar players and once the Bulls took Curry it made created a logjam in the front-court that trading Brand alleviated.

It was a truly awful deal as Brand went on to become an All-Star in LA for the Clippers (widely considered the worst franchise in basketball at the time, Brand and Maggette lead the Clips to the playoffs for the first time in 347 years... or something like that... in the mid-2000s and the franchise has been respectable ever since) while Curry and Chandler never did all that much for the Bulls (though Chandler went on to become a nice player for Dallas and the Knicks about a decade after being drafted.

-Jason "here is an article that talks a bit more about how awful this trade was" Evans

Jason is sort of correct. The trade was Brand for Chandler, and the Bulls then drafted Curry. However, it wasn't a post-tense trade. The trade was agreed upon on draft night. So the Bulls knew they were getting Chandler when they drafted Curry. It's just NBA rules that made the trade "not official" until after the draft. But, in effect, the Bulls traded an All Star caliber player for the right to bring two 18 year frontcourt players in together, on a bad team.

It's actually fairly interesting. Chandler was, at the time, considered a "can't miss" prospect. He had played summer ball with NBA players since he was 15, and had looked the part of being the next Kevin Garnett: a two-way superstar. For whatever reason, though, his offensive game never materialized. The Chandler/Curry pairing was a scout's dream (and that's what Krause really was: a scout); Curry's brute force and athleticism (he could do a standing back flip in high school at 275lbs) inside paired with Chandler's perimeter skills and athleticism outside. Unfortunately, Curry lacked the work ethic and Chandler's offensive skills never developed.

That being said, that was a different Bulls' front office that made that trade. Jerry Krause was the one that made that move. My diatribe was focused on the duo of Paxson and Forman. Paxson was Krause's replacement. Paxson WAS, however, responsible for trading Chandler away right at the point that he was developing into a useful defensive stalwart in the middle.

[DukieInBrasil]

Tyus Jones with by far his best statistical output for the season tonight, a double double! 10 assists and 10 pts on 5-7 FGs, + 2 steals and 3 rebs.
Overall, TJ has seen a big drop in his productivity, particular shooting %s. He's still got a tight handle and good a/turn ratio, but he's not gonna get many offers to be starting PG the way he's played so far.

[Troublemaker]

It's possible the Jazz are interested in trading for Jabari: https://www.google.com/search?q=jabari+jazz&tbm=nws

I've always viewed that as the perfect fit since Utah has great defenders to protect him but lack scoring, which he could provide. If Gobert can't cover for his defensive deficiencies, no one can. Plus, Jabari is Mormon.

[phaedrus]

It's actually fairly interesting. Chandler was, at the time, considered a "can't miss" prospect. He had played summer ball with NBA players since he was 15, and had looked the part of being the next Kevin Garnett: a two-way superstar. For whatever reason, though, his offensive game never materialized. The Chandler/Curry pairing was a scout's dream (and that's what Krause really was: a scout); Curry's brute force and athleticism (he could do a standing back flip in high school at 275lbs) inside paired with Chandler's perimeter skills and athleticism outside. Unfortunately, Curry lacked the work ethic and Chandler's offensive skills never developed.

Curry's offensive talent paired with Chandler's defense, hustle, and rebounding would have made an outstanding player. It's too bad they were two people.

[Troublemaker]

Dave Joerger's a good coach but not great with public comments and seemingly doesn't have a good relationship with Kings management.

Joerger more or less suggested that the Kings should've drafted Doncic over Bagley: https://www.sbnation.com/2018/12/17/...2018-nba-draft

[sagegrouse]

Nice game for Tyus Jones is a win last night against Sacramento: In 23:34 mins. he had 10 pts., 3 RBs, 10 assists, only one TO, and 2 steals. Bagley did not play due to a lingering injury but Harry Giles had 13 points in 21:44.

[yancem]

Dave Joerger's a good coach but not great with public comments and seemingly doesn't have a good relationship with Kings management.

Joerger more or less suggested that the Kings should've drafted Doncic over Bagley: https://www.sbnation.com/2018/12/17/...2018-nba-draft

Based solely on their roster, he's right. Factor in how good Doncic isand he doubly right. Nothing against Bagley, he should be really good too.

[Troublemaker]

Based solely on their roster, he's right. Factor in how good Doncic isand he doubly right. Nothing against Bagley, he should be really good too.

I mean, Doncic probably should've been the #1 overall draft pick. The Suns goofed most of all.

But still, even if it's the truth, a coach should never be saying stuff like that. You always support your player publicly.

[sagegrouse]

I mean, Doncic probably should've been the #1 overall draft pick. The Suns goofed most of all.

But still, even if it's the truth, a coach should never be saying stuff like that. You always support your player publicly.

Here's his quote. It was BEFORE a game with Dallas, when coaches always build up the opponent.

“You know, he’s got a lot of different skills, and I think he’s gonna become a heck of a shooter, and when that happens it’s gonna make him quicker. He’s got good ball-handling sets and he knows how to play.”

And then — deep breath — Joerger said this:

“I think perhaps there was an idea that there was a ceiling on him? I don’t see it, unfortunately for us. But he’s great for them, and he’s great for our league.”

He should have been sensitive about his star rookie, Marvin Bagley, when he made the comments.

[CDu]

I mean, Doncic probably should've been the #1 overall draft pick. The Suns goofed most of all.

But still, even if it's the truth, a coach should never be saying stuff like that. You always support your player publicly.

He did. See the follow-up quotes from Joerger here:

"When we drafted Marvin at 2, we were high-fiving like crazy. We got the right guy for us. This isn't going to be a story in 3 days and it'll be definitely buried 5 yrs from now when we have the next Durant-Westbrook. That's how good they're gonna be."

Joerger was asked a question about how good Doncic will be. He answered positively about Doncic, not negatively toward anyone in his organization. As clarified by his subsequent comment pasted above.

Joerger's comments should not be taken as a slap at Bagley.

[Troublemaker]

He did. See the follow-up quotes from Joerger here:

"When we drafted Marvin at 2, we were high-fiving like crazy. We got the right guy for us. This isn't going to be a story in 3 days and it'll be definitely buried 5 yrs from now when we have the next Durant-Westbrook. That's how good they're gonna be."

Joerger was asked a question about how good Doncic will be. He answered positively about Doncic, not negatively toward anyone in his organization. As clarified by his subsequent comment pasted above.

Joerger's comments should not be taken as a slap at Bagley.

Yeah, those were part of the backpedal the next day.

A lot of people interpreted Joerger's original comments -- especially the "unfortunately for us" -- as a slap at the Kings' front office for not drafting Doncic. While it's possible the original comments were completely innocuous -- no one can be 100% sure -- and Joerger didn't understand how his comments would be perceived, that's not the way I'd bet.

Here's ESPN discussing it:

[CDu]

Yeah, those were part of the backpedal the next day.

Certainly possible that the second quote was only a backpedal. Also possible that he really meant what he said in the second comment. We'll never know. But I would tend to give guys the benefit of the doubt for their off-hand remarks in a media session.

Worth noting that, for all the love Doncic is getting, Bagley is putting up slightly better efficiency numbers than Doncic. He's having a really nice rookie season himself.

[DavidBenAkiva]

Jason is sort of correct. The trade was Brand for Chandler, and the Bulls then drafted Curry. However, it wasn't a post-tense trade. The trade was agreed upon on draft night. So the Bulls knew they were getting Chandler when they drafted Curry. It's just NBA rules that made the trade "not official" until after the draft. But, in effect, the Bulls traded an All Star caliber player for the right to bring two 18 year frontcourt players in together, on a bad team.

It's actually fairly interesting. Chandler was, at the time, considered a "can't miss" prospect. He had played summer ball with NBA players since he was 15, and had looked the part of being the next Kevin Garnett: a two-way superstar. For whatever reason, though, his offensive game never materialized. The Chandler/Curry pairing was a scout's dream (and that's what Krause really was: a scout); Curry's brute force and athleticism (he could do a standing back flip in high school at 275lbs) inside paired with Chandler's perimeter skills and athleticism outside. Unfortunately, Curry lacked the work ethic and Chandler's offensive skills never developed.

That being said, that was a different Bulls' front office that made that trade. Jerry Krause was the one that made that move. My diatribe was focused on the duo of Paxson and Forman. Paxson was Krause's replacement. Paxson WAS, however, responsible for trading Chandler away right at the point that he was developing into a useful defensive stalwart in the middle.

Just going down memory lane on this draft. Kwame Brown, infamously, went 1st to the Wizards. The Bulls should have traded up to nab Chandler OR the #3 pick, Pau Gasol. A Gasol/Chandler pairing would have been really something.

Other notables in that draft:
Jason Richardson, 5th
Shane Battier, 6th
Joe Johnson, 10th
Richard Jefferson, 13th
Zach Randolph, 19th
Gerald Wallace, 25th
Gilbert Arenas, 31st

By VORP (Value Over Replacement Player), Eddy Curry logged the lowest rating of guys that played in the NBA at -5.0. Battier, FWIW, was #2 behind Gasol. What a draft night for Memphis!