University of Maryland Football allegations

[uh_no]

I don't think that type of abuse is as likely to happen at University of Maryland because there isn't the same mentality of winning at all costs.

just because they are horrid at it doesn't mean the mentality doesn't exist.

While it could happen at an ACC school, it hasn't happened yet.

or more correctly, nobody has been caught at it yet.

What I referred to as "ACC-type" incidences are more likely to involve cheating in recruitment (money, prostitutes), unallowable gifts, or academic fraud (UNC) to keep players eligible.

the list of incidences that are more likely seems to grow longer by the year. the ACC is nothing special.

[Tom B.]

Re: coaching techniques -- I think it's a bit myopic to focus narrowly on yelling, cursing, challenging manhood, etc. Lots of coaches do that. But not all know how to do it effectively.

The first year I played high school basketball, we had a coach who yelled and cursed some, but not what I'd call an excessive amount. He was a bad coach, though, mainly because his attitude stunk. The best word to describe him would be petulant. He'd belittle guys, played passive-aggressive mind games, and almost never had anything positive to say. He was one of those guys who just seemed to go through life mad and resentful at the world, and took it out on the teenagers he was charged with coaching. We had a reasonably talented team, but ended up with a losing record. Two or three guys quit during the season. Team chemistry sucked. After our next-to-last game of the season (a loss, natch), two teammates got into a fight in the locker room. Just a miserable experience.

Fast forward to the next year. New coach. Definitely more of a yeller -- in fact, he told us point blank on the first day of practice that if we didn't want to get yelled at, we'd come to the wrong place. Cursed plenty. Would get in your face and challenge you. BUT...and this was key...he knew how to mix his intensity with positive reinforcement, teaching, and even humor at times. He knew how to break guys down, then build them back up (whereas our prior coach knew only how to grind people down). He knew how to push you to your limit, but leave you at the end of the day wanting to come back for more tomorrow. And to my knowledge, he never knocked food out of anyone's hands.

We had less athletic talent on that team than the year before, but our chemistry was light-years better. We gelled, our play improved, and we finished with six more wins than the previous season and a winning record. And the coach? He coached for 15 more years after I graduated, went to six state finals, won three state championships, and built a program that's now a state basketball power and sends guys to play college ball most years.

There's a real art to coaching, to knowing how to challenge and push people without crossing the line to jerkishness (the filter wouldn't let me use the word I wanted to use here) and abuse. And it's not easy. If you figure it out, you can have a long and successful career. If you don't -- and it sounds like Durkin and his gang haven't, or didn't care -- that's a recipe for toxicity and trauma.

[dukelifer]

Re: coaching techniques -- I think it's a bit myopic to focus narrowly on yelling, cursing, challenging manhood, etc. Lots of coaches do that. But not all know how to do it effectively.

The first year I played high school basketball, we had a coach who yelled and cursed some, but not what I'd call an excessive amount. He was a bad coach, though, mainly because his attitude stunk. The best word to describe him would be petulant. He'd belittle guys, played passive-aggressive mind games, and almost never had anything positive to say. He was one of those guys who just seemed to go through life mad and resentful at the world, and took it out on the teenagers he was charged with coaching. We had a reasonably talented team, but ended up with a losing record. Two or three guys quit during the season. Team chemistry sucked. After our next-to-last game of the season (a loss, natch), two teammates got into a fight in the locker room. Just a miserable experience.

Fast forward to the next year. New coach. Definitely more of a yeller -- in fact, he told us point blank on the first day of practice that if we didn't want to get yelled at, we'd come to the wrong place. Cursed plenty. Would get in your face and challenge you. BUT...and this was key...he knew how to mix his intensity with positive reinforcement, teaching, and even humor at times. He knew how to break guys down, then build them back up (whereas our prior coach knew only how to grind people down). He knew how to push you to your limit, but leave you at the end of the day wanting to come back for more tomorrow. And to my knowledge, he never knocked food out of anyone's hands.

We had less athletic talent on that team than the year before, but our chemistry was light-years better. We gelled, our play improved, and we finished with six more wins than the previous season and a winning record. And the coach? He coached for 15 more years after I graduated, went to six state finals, won three state championships, and built a program that's now a state basketball power and sends guys to play college ball most years.

There's a real art to coaching, to knowing how to challenge and push people without crossing the line to jerkishness (the filter wouldn't let me use the word I wanted to use here) and abuse. And it's not easy. If you figure it out, you can have a long and successful career. If you don't -- and it sounds like Durkin and his gang haven't, or didn't care -- that's a recipe for toxicity and trauma.

My question is why do we want this in our coaches but not in our bosses or school teachers. Should teachers challenge “manhood” or “womanhood” to get students to learn math? Should bosses curse and get in your face to get you to finish your work? What gives coaches the ability to behave this way, when it is not acceptable in most places. I do not believe this is the only way to get excellence from athletes. We just have allowed it to continue.

[gep]

My question is why do we want this in our coaches but not in our bosses or school teachers. Should teachers challenge “manhood” or “womanhood” to get students to learn math? Should bosses curse and get in your face to get you to finish your work? What gives coaches the ability to behave this way, when it is not acceptable in most places. I do not believe this is the only way to get excellence from athletes. We just have allowed it to continue.

My thought is that if bosses need to resort to this tactic, they hired the wrong person. As for school teachers, they can only do what they are allowed to do... it's really all on the parents.

[HereBeforeCoachK]

My thought is that if bosses need to resort to this tactic, they hired the wrong person.

I think you made his point for him....

[Tripping William]

The doo-doo gets deeper.

Money quote:

Loh explained that he and athletic director Damon Evans met with McNair's family in Baltimore earlier on Tuesday to apologize for the circumstances that led to McNair's death in June. Loh also added that the training staff "basically misdiagnosed the situation. No vital signs were taken. Other safeguarding actions were not taken."

Evans said the staff never took McNair's temperature and did not give him cold water immersion after he collapsed during an official team workout in May. He also said the team's head of strength and conditioning Rick Court is no longer with the program. Pete Thamel of Yahoo Sports reports Court resigned from his position on Monday, and he finalized a financial settlement with the university on Tuesday.

[PackMan97]

My question is why do we want this in our coaches but not in our bosses or school teachers. Should teachers challenge “manhood” or “womanhood” to get students to learn math? Should bosses curse and get in your face to get you to finish your work? What gives coaches the ability to behave this way, when it is not acceptable in most places. I do not believe this is the only way to get excellence from athletes. We just have allowed it to continue.

That depends, I want my defensive lineman to play angry. Mad. Spitting mad. I want them to think that guy lined up against them beat up their little sister and stole her lunch money and kicked the family dog just for fun!

I may want my quarterback to be a bit more emotionally stable

[devildeac]

That depends, I want my defensive lineman to play angry. Mad. Spitting mad. I want them to think that guy lined up against them beat up their little sister and stole her lunch money and kicked the family dog just for fun!

I may want my quarterback to be a bit more emotionally stable

I want your quarterback to be suspended 4 games. Oh, wait, wrong "school."

[PackMan97]

I want your quarterback to be suspended 4 games. Oh, wait, wrong "school."

State and Duke don't play each other again until 2082, and given that Duke is on a two game winning streak...I don't really think jokes are appropriate.

[HereBeforeCoachK]

State and Duke don't play each other again until 2082, and given that Duke is on a two game winning streak...I don't really think jokes are appropriate.

2082? Maybe 2028?

[Bob Green]

State and Duke don't play each other again until 2082, and given that Duke is on a two game winning streak...I don't really think jokes are appropriate.

Actually the next game between Duke and State is in 2020.

[Pghdukie]

Who was the basketball coach that got fired a few years ago for mentally and physically abusing his players. I remember his rages and rants were on video, but his name and school escape me. What a jerk he was. Similar to Durkin.

[BigWayne]

Who was the basketball coach that got fired a few years ago for mentally and physically abusing his players. I remember his rages and rants were on video, but his name and school escape me. What a jerk he was. Similar to Durkin.

Rutgers/Mike Rice.

[cato]

Who was the basketball coach that got fired a few years ago for mentally and physically abusing his players. I remember his rages and rants were on video, but his name and school escape me. What a jerk he was. Similar to Durkin.

Ben Howland? Although I think he was really fired for not winning enough, and I do not recall any allegations of physical abuse by the coaches.

[BigWayne]

Who was the basketball coach that got fired a few years ago for mentally and physically abusing his players. I remember his rages and rants were on video, but his name and school escape me. What a jerk he was. Similar to Durkin.

BTW - Rice seems to have rehabilitated himself a fair bit. Patrick school is the successor to St. Patrick, where Kyrie played.

[BigWayne]

Back to the thread topic...

UMD has parted ways with the conditioning coach, Rick Court

According to preliminary findings from a university-hired external investigation led by Walters Inc., the Maryland staff did not take McNair's temperature at the workout, did not apply a cold-water immersion treatment and did not follow the emergency response plan appropriately.

"The care provided was not consistent with best practices, and heat illness was not properly identified or treated," Evans said Tuesday.

The preliminary findings of the independent review come among a whirlwind of fallout from an ESPN report detailing allegations of verbal abuse, bullying and a general disregard for the players' well-being that centered on Court and were enabled by head coach DJ Durkin.

Court, in his resignation letter, said he was "stepping down to allow the team to heal and move forward."

[Pghdukie]

Back to the thread topic...

UMD has parted ways with the conditioning coach, Rick Court

Thanks.

[jimsumner]

I cannot think of a single time in my life when someone belittling me, cursing me, or forcing me to do something until I passed out worked to my benefit.

Positive reinforcement? Now, that's a different story.

Perhaps I never had the good fortune of having coaches who perfected the art of making teenagers better by cursing at them.

But I suspect not.

[fidel]

I cannot think of a single time in my life when someone belittling me, cursing me, or forcing me to do something until I passed out worked to my benefit.

Positive reinforcement? Now, that's a different story.

Perhaps I never had the good fortune of having coaches who perfected the art of making teenagers better by cursing at them.

But I suspect not.

Amen.

[BigWayne]

Calls for more heads at UMD are heating up.

This tragedy happened on Evans’ watch, too, and when he walked to the podium and introduced himself as the “new” athletic director, he forgot to mention that he used to be the deputy athletic director under Kevin Anderson with oversight of the football program. He didn’t just walk in the door.