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  1. #21
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Richmond, VA
    I think Zion can give David his change back. (Obscure reference for us old timers)

  2. #22
    If Zion is a legit 6'7" 285, he is unicornish. There is noone in basketball to use as a comparison. Julius Peppers comes to mind, but I don't like to count him. Zion is a monster DE in the NFL. As a basketball player, he is the ultimate freak. Usually you see 285, you think that kid needs to lose a bunch of weight, but that is far from the case. Unreal. Wasn't Bolden always listed at 6'10" previously?

  3. #23
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Rocky Mount, NC
    Quote Originally Posted by Jackson View Post
    If Zion is a legit 6'7" 285, he is unicornish. There is noone in basketball to use as a comparison. Julius Peppers comes to mind, but I don't like to count him. Zion is a monster DE in the NFL. As a basketball player, he is the ultimate freak. Usually you see 285, you think that kid needs to lose a bunch of weight, but that is far from the case. Unreal. Wasn't Bolden always listed at 6'10" previously?
    When I played against Peppers in High School he was 215 pounds as a senior. Zion is bigger than him at that age, and a better leaper. Its quite amazing.

  4. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Jackson View Post
    If Zion is a legit 6'7" 285, he is unicornish. There is noone in basketball to use as a comparison. Julius Peppers comes to mind, but I don't like to count him. Zion is a monster DE in the NFL. As a basketball player, he is the ultimate freak. Usually you see 285, you think that kid needs to lose a bunch of weight, but that is far from the case. Unreal. Wasn't Bolden always listed at 6'10" previously?
    I think he was always listed at 6'11".

  5. #25
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    raleigh
    Cam Newton is 6'5" and 245#

    let that sink in...
    "One POSSIBLE future. From your point of view... I don't know tech stuff.".... Kyle Reese

  6. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by jimsumner View Post
    FWIW, I was told a few years back that Carmen Wallace had the highest vertical of any Duke player in K's tenure. Didn't have an exact number, however. Wallace graduated in 1997, btw.


    And yes, some of these numbers can be a bit iffy. I'm sure I'm not the only person who recalls DeMarcus Nelson suddenly becoming 6-4 as a senior.
    And not only was Demarcus listed at 6'4 as a senior, he measured in at 6'1" w/o shoes at the combine (link) and 6'2.25" with shoes.

    I would agree that "some of these numbers can be a bit iffy" although to be honest I might even call that an understatement. It seems like EVERY year there seem to be a couple measurements that are (deliberately?) modified and always seem to be a ways off from comes out at the combines/USA camps where the measurements tend to be very accurate.

    So let's assume Zion is a smidge over 6'6 in shoes--I still think 6'6 with his weight, length, and leaping ability (and quickness off the floors) is big enough to play PF for Duke. Not sure if he can get off the floor as quickly as Marvin, but if the can approach that level of springiness then he'll be just fine. Demarcus played PF at times and it turns out he was only 6'1 or 6'2.

    Quote Originally Posted by MarkD83 View Post
    I think Zion can give David his change back. (Obscure reference for us old timers)
    My father (also an old timer on this board) has made this reference to me several times--the story of David Thompson taking quarters off the backboard and then potentially jumping again and putting them back? This sounds like an old wives tale--is there any video evidence of this?

  7. #27
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Raleigh
    Quote Originally Posted by SilkyJ View Post
    And not only was Demarcus listed at 6'4 as a senior, he measured in at 6'1" w/o shoes at the combine (link) and 6'2.25" with shoes.

    I would agree that "some of these numbers can be a bit iffy" although to be honest I might even call that an understatement. It seems like EVERY year there seem to be a couple measurements that are (deliberately?) modified and always seem to be a ways off from comes out at the combines/USA camps where the measurements tend to be very accurate.

    So let's assume Zion is a smidge over 6'6 in shoes--I still think 6'6 with his weight, length, and leaping ability (and quickness off the floors) is big enough to play PF for Duke. Not sure if he can get off the floor as quickly as Marvin, but if the can approach that level of springiness then he'll be just fine. Demarcus played PF at times and it turns out he was only 6'1 or 6'2.



    My father (also an old timer on this board) has made this reference to me several times--the story of David Thompson taking quarters off the backboard and then potentially jumping again and putting them back? This sounds like an old wives tale--is there any video evidence of this?
    I wouldn't be a bit surprised if Jim Sumner had some 8 mm reels of this in his archives.
    [redacted] them and the horses they rode in on.

  8. #28
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Undisclosed
    Quote Originally Posted by devildeac View Post
    I wouldn't be a bit surprised if Jim Sumner had some 8 mm reels of this in his archives.
    You should see his slide show,

  9. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by SilkyJ View Post
    story of David Thompson taking quarters off the backboard and then potentially jumping again and putting them back? This sounds like an old wives tale--is there any video evidence of this?
    From Thompson's lips:
    The legend was I could take a quarter off and leave two dimes and a nickel. I didn't have quite that much hangtime, but I could get the top of the backboards
    Source (not a particularly exciting video clip. But, if the lame cliffhanger gets to you, here is the full version

  10. #30
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Raleigh, NC
    Quote Originally Posted by OldPhiKap View Post
    You should see his slide show,
    Nah. I put all that stuff on Beta Max.

  11. #31
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    NC
    Quote Originally Posted by SilkyJ View Post
    My father (also an old timer on this board) has made this reference to me several times--the story of David Thompson taking quarters off the backboard and then potentially jumping again and putting them back? This sounds like an old wives tale--is there any video evidence of this?
    Quote Originally Posted by bedeviled View Post
    From Thompson's lips:
    Source (not a particularly exciting video clip. But, if the lame cliffhanger gets to you, here is the full version
    Like the Chamberlain “free throw dunk”, this is also a myth. The top of a regulation backboard is 13 feet high. So to even reach the top, someone with a 9 foot standing reach would need a 48+ inch vertical. Nobody has achieved a 48” vertical in the history of the NBA combine, and only a small proportion of folks have a 9’ standing reach. The heighest recorded max reach at the combine is 12’4”, which is comfortably (8”) shy of the top of the glass. Not everyone participates at the combine (especially more recently), but that should give a sense of how unlikely/impossible it is.

  12. #32
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Raleigh, NC
    Quote Originally Posted by CDu View Post
    Like the Chamberlain “free throw dunk”, this is also a myth. The top of a regulation backboard is 13 feet high. So to even reach the top, someone with a 9 foot standing reach would need a 48+ inch vertical. Nobody has achieved a 48” vertical in the history of the NBA combine, and only a small proportion of folks have a 9’ standing reach. The heighest recorded max reach at the combine is 12’4”, which is comfortably (8”) shy of the top of the glass. Not everyone participates at the combine (especially more recently), but that should give a sense of how unlikely/impossible it is.
    Yes, but Herman the Helicopter never went to the NBA combine.

  13. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by proelitedota View Post
    http://www.goduke.com/SportSelect.db...45&SPSID=22727

    1 Zion Williamson F 6-7 285 Fr. Spartanburg, S.C. (Spartanburg Day School)
    2 Cam Reddish F 6-8 218 Fr. Norristown, Pa. (Westtown School)
    3 Tre Jones G 6-2 183 Fr. Apple Valley, Minn. (Apple Valley)
    5 R.J. Barrett F 6-7 202 Fr. Mississauga, Ont. (Montverde Academy [Fla.])
    12 Javin DeLaurier F 6-10 234 Jr. Shipman, Va. (Saint Anne's-Belfield)
    13 Joey Baker F 6-7 200 Fr. Fayetteville, N.C. (Trinity Christian School)
    14 Jordan Goldwire G 6-2 181 So. Norcross, Ga. (Norcross)
    15 Alex O'Connell G 6-6 176 So. Roswell, Ga. (Milton)
    20 Marques Bolden C 6-11 250 Jr. DeSoto, Texas (DeSoto)
    30 Antonio Vrankovic C 7-0 269 Sr. Zagreb, Croatia (Pine Crest School [Fla.])
    41 Jack White F 6-7 222 Jr. Traralgon, Victoria, Australia (Australian Institute of Sport)
    50 Justin Robinson F 6-10 202 Jr. San Antonio, Texas (San Antonio Christian Academy)
    51 Mike Buckmire G 6-2 173 So. Blue Bell, Pa. (Germantown Friends School)
    53 Brennan Besser G 6-5 190 Sr. Chicago, Ill. (Latin School)
    We have for years been given measurements with sneakers on and that is okay if accurate but we usually find out the results from the NBA Chicago pre-draft camp measurements that the posted numbers here are not reliable and may be self reported. Cases to make the point include Reddick who was reported as being 6'4" and actually meaured that with shoes off while Dante Jones was listed at 6'4" and measured at 6'2 3/4". We don't get all the players measurements as they don't get invited to camp but those that do from not just Duke but from other teams are also sometimes significantly at variance with the university posted amount. It doesn't matter much in the scheme of things for Duke and our play in the ACC, but it does matter to the NBA as they go through a lot of effort to obtain accurate measurements in a lot of categories.

    Now, do I think Zion at 6'7" and 285 # and jumps that high is a freak of nature. Definitely, but I wonder also if carrying all that weight is a good thing for his legs and joints in the long term. I hope the coaching staff will visit this question and work with him to do what is right for Zion's career and long term interest

  14. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by CDu View Post
    Like the Chamberlain “free throw dunk”, this is also a myth. The top of a regulation backboard is 13 feet high. So to even reach the top, someone with a 9 foot standing reach would need a 48+ inch vertical. Nobody has achieved a 48” vertical in the history of the NBA combine, and only a small proportion of folks have a 9’ standing reach. The heighest recorded max reach at the combine is 12’4”, which is comfortably (8”) shy of the top of the glass. Not everyone participates at the combine (especially more recently), but that should give a sense of how unlikely/impossible it is.
    Thank you. The hyperbole that permeates these discussions is ridiculous.

  15. #35
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Steamboat Springs, CO
    Quote Originally Posted by Saratoga2 View Post
    We have for years been given measurements with sneakers on and that is okay if accurate but we usually find out the results from the NBA Chicago pre-draft camp measurements that the posted numbers here are not reliable and may be self reported. Cases to make the point include Reddick who was reported as being 6'4" and actually meaured that with shoes off while Dante Jones was listed at 6'4" and measured at 6'2 3/4". We don't get all the players measurements as they don't get invited to camp but those that do from not just Duke but from other teams are also sometimes significantly at variance with the university posted amount. It doesn't matter much in the scheme of things for Duke and our play in the ACC, but it does matter to the NBA as they go through a lot of effort to obtain accurate measurements in a lot of categories.

    Now, do I think Zion at 6'7" and 285 # and jumps that high is a freak of nature. Definitely, but I wonder also if carrying all that weight is a good thing for his legs and joints in the long term. I hope the coaching staff will visit this question and work with him to do what is right for Zion's career and long term interest
    If "Dante Jones" is meant to be "Dahntay Jones," then I don't understand your numbers. Dahntay has always been listed as 6-6; I can't find the 2003 Draft Combine results to see what actual measurements were.
    Sage Grouse

    ---------------------------------------
    'When I got on the bus for my first road game at Duke, I saw that every player was carrying textbooks or laptops. I coached in the SEC for 25 years, and I had never seen that before, not even once.' - David Cutcliffe to Duke alumni in Washington, DC, June 2013

  16. #36
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    NC
    Quote Originally Posted by sagegrouse View Post
    If "Dante Jones" is meant to be "Dahntay Jones," then I don't understand your numbers. Dahntay has always been listed as 6-6; I can't find the 2003 Draft Combine results to see what actual measurements were.
    I am assuming he or she subconsciously meant Nelson. Jones measured 6’4.75” without shoes in the 2003 combine.

  17. #37
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Hot'Lanta... home of the Falcons!
    Quote Originally Posted by CDu View Post
    I am assuming he or she subconsciously meant Nelson. Jones measured 6’4.75” without shoes in the 2003 combine.
    Yeah, I also figured the poster was talking about DeMarcus Nelson. Nelson was always listed as 6-4 at Duke but I saw him standing next to Sean Dockery and it was clear they were essentially the same height.
    Why are you wasting time here when you could be wasting it by listening to the latest episode of the DBR Podcast?

  18. #38
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Raleigh, NC
    Quote Originally Posted by JasonEvans View Post
    Yeah, I also figured the poster was talking about DeMarcus Nelson. Nelson was always listed as 6-4 at Duke but I saw him standing next to Sean Dockery and it was clear they were essentially the same height.
    Nelson actually wasn't always listed as 6-4. That was the strange part. He was listed as 6-2 up until his senior year, when he magically jumped to 6-4.

    Players can get taller in college. Kenny Dennard and Mike Dunleavy are examples. And I'm still waiting for a growth spurt that just never comes.

    Well, a vertical growth spurt. I'm not having much trouble with the horizontal part.

    But it's rare for a college senior to grow two inches.

    Back in the 1970s, NC State had a publicity stunt where they had all of their (basketball) players weighed and measured at the State Fairgrounds, under the auspices of longtime NC Commissioner of Agriculture (and huge State fan) Jim Graham. Lots of media coverage.

    It turned out everyone was shorter than listed. Usually by an inch or. IIRC, Phil Spence went from 6-8 to 6-6.

  19. #39
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Chicago
    Quote Originally Posted by OZZIE4DUKE View Post
    And then there was David Thompson. 44"? 48"? 50"? Depends which video you watch after Googling DT. Here's the 44" video.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uQPVKQIFxVk

    He's still the greatest college player I've ever seen.
    Same for me. Watching DT is what got me hooked on basketball as a middle schooler. 48" is the figure I always remember being quoted for his vertical, but can't say I recall the exact source(s).

  20. #40
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Cary, NC
    My understanding was that Demarcus Nelson had some sort of severe scoliosis that caused his spine to contort. It helped account for his really long wingspan, because he was essentially a 6’6-6’7 player whose spine was several inches too short, thus he measured 6’3-6’4. Maybe it started to resolve in his later years, leading to the increased height measurement?

    I also think that the days of players just verbally declaring their heights are behind us. These guys get measured at the various summer all star games, at AAU events, etc. The combine preparation stuff that the team does over the summer looks pretty legit. So I’m inclined to trust the numbers that the team just put out.

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