Movie sequels

[Udaman]

Interestingly, both Alien and Aliens are in my Top 5 lists.

Alien in Top 5 scary movies:

5. The Ring
4. Alien
3. Jaws
2. The Exorcist
1. Halloween

Aliens in Top 5 greatest sequels:

5. X-men 2
4. Spider-Man 2
3. Aliens
2. Star Trek - Wrath of Khan
1. Empire Strikes Back

[chriso]

Interestingly, both Alien and Aliens are in my Top 5 lists.

Alien in Top 5 scary movies:

5. The Ring
4. Alien
3. Jaws
2. The Exorcist
1. Halloween

Aliens in Top 5 greatest sequels:

5. X-men 2
4. Spider-Man 2
3. Aliens
2. Star Trek - Wrath of Khan
1. Empire Strikes Back

Nice. Empire is my favorite film ever. My top 10 1. ESB 2. Star Wars 3. Raiders 4. Aliens 5. Shawshank Redemption 6. Godfather 7. Alien 8. Jaws 9. Vertigo 10. Superman

[NashvilleDevil]

Interestingly, both Alien and Aliens are in my Top 5 lists.

Alien in Top 5 scary movies:

5. The Ring
4. Alien
3. Jaws
2. The Exorcist
1. Halloween

Aliens in Top 5 greatest sequels:

5. X-men 2
4. Spider-Man 2
3. Aliens
2. Star Trek - Wrath of Khan
1. Empire Strikes Back

Shocked Godfather II is not on your greatest sequels list.

[Olympic Fan]

Shocked Godfather II is not on your greatest sequels list.

Could Udaman be talking only about comic book/scifi movies (even so, I would argue that The Dark Knight has to be in the top 5)?

But, I agree, Godfather II is the greatest sequel ever. I'd also have a place near the top for Silence of the Lambs and A Shot in the Dark.

[Udaman]

This is what is great about this Board - the people are damn smart. I was going to explain these two omissions in my initial post, but thought I would wait to see if someone asked first.

The Dark Knight is definitely one of my top movies. But I don't really think of it as a sequel. It's more of a series. Like Lord of the Rings or The Hunger Games. Now, I admit that Star Trek was also a series as are the X-Men. But The Wrath of Khan was the second overall movie there and so was X-Men 2. The Dark Knight was really the 6th Batman movie. So yeah, I'm kind of flexible when it comes to what I call a sequel - but using my definition I keep out The Dark Knight.

As for Godfather 2. Clearly a sequel. But I just didn't love it. OK I LOVED the part with DeNiro. And the death of Fredo. But I found the first 1/3rd to be boring and the Cuba section to last forever, and the Senate hearings to make little sense (and be boring). I fell asleep twice the first time I saw it. And yes I realize I'm in the minority here. But I rank it below all 5 of those listed above. Probably would make my top 10 list just for the DeNiro parts.

[davekay1971]

Shocked Godfather II is not on your greatest sequels list.

I have much respect for Udaman's list, as well as his clarification of his thought process.

But I'd include Godfather II, and a couple others.

In order

1) Godfather II - hard to improve much on Godfather, but I found this to be an improvement - more entertaining overall, watching Michael's growth as a gangster was riveting, and Robert DeNiro's addition was stellar.
2) Empire Strike Back - again, improving on an instant classic is tough, but Empire did. Better, darker, and deeper than A New Hope
3) Aliens - benefitted from being a completely different movie than the first, so actually hard to compare the two. Aliens was wildly entertaining, a great action/sci-fi/horror romp.
4) The Dark Knight - since it's part 2 of a reboot, I'll count it as second in the (new) Batman series. A great movie all the way around, with the best comic book villain performance of all time delivered by Ledger
5) Captain America: The Winter Soldier - also arguably movie number ? in a big series, but the 2nd Captain America standalone movie. Much better than the first Captain America (which I enjoyed quite a bit), and, IM(h)O, the best of the Marvel movies. Wildly entertaining start to finish and endlessly rewatchable.
6) Star Trek 2
7) Terminator 2
8) Spider Man 2
9) X2
10) 2 Fast 2 Furious






Just kidding on the last one. Couldn't think of a clear 10th place sequel and had to get back to work.

[JasonEvans]

This is what is great about this Board - the people are damn smart. I was going to explain these two omissions in my initial post, but thought I would wait to see if someone asked first.

The Dark Knight is definitely one of my top movies. But I don't really think of it as a sequel. It's more of a series. Like Lord of the Rings or The Hunger Games. Now, I admit that Star Trek was also a series as are the X-Men. But The Wrath of Khan was the second overall movie there and so was X-Men 2. The Dark Knight was really the 6th Batman movie. So yeah, I'm kind of flexible when it comes to what I call a sequel - but using my definition I keep out The Dark Knight.

As for Godfather 2. Clearly a sequel. But I just didn't love it. OK I LOVED the part with DeNiro. And the death of Fredo. But I found the first 1/3rd to be boring and the Cuba section to last forever, and the Senate hearings to make little sense (and be boring). I fell asleep twice the first time I saw it. And yes I realize I'm in the minority here. But I rank it below all 5 of those listed above. Probably would make my top 10 list just for the DeNiro parts.

So, what is your explanation for leaving out Toy Story 2, Silence of the Lambs (which goes alongside Godfather II as the only sequels to win Best Picture), Captain America: The Winter Soldier, The Bourne Supremacy, Terminator 2: Judgement Day, Superman II, LOTR: The Two Towers (ROTK won Best Picture, but you are only counting the second film in the series as a sequel, right?), and Mad Max 2: The Road Warrior?

-Jason "I think we've played this game before in other threads in the past. Nice diversion. Maybe we should do a poll some time to determine the DBR's best sequel of all time... we would need a definition of sequel though" Evans

[davekay1971]

So, what is your explanation for leaving out Toy Story 2, Silence of the Lambs (which goes alongside Godfather II as the only sequels to win Best Picture), Captain America: The Winter Soldier, The Bourne Supremacy, Terminator 2: Judgement Day, Superman II, LOTR: The Two Towers (ROTK won Best Picture, but you are only counting the second film in the series as a sequel, right?), and Mad Max 2: The Road Warrior?

-Jason "I think we've played this game before in other threads in the past. Nice diversion. Maybe we should do a poll some time to determine the DBR's best sequel of all time... we would need a definition of sequel though" Evans

Jason's post just made me feel deeply ashamed. The Bourne Supremacy is still the best Bourne, Silence was fantastic (never think of it as a sequel though, since Manhunter was done years before and had a totally different cast), and The Road Warrior is one of the great movies of my childhood. I'd leave out Toy Story 2, however, since it was my least favorite Toy Story movie. Same for Two Towers which was great, but less compelling for me than Fellowship and less breathtaking as a spectacle than ROTK.

[PackMan97]

I agree we need to define sequel. MW seems to think it's anything after the first.

https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/sequel

Definition of sequel
1
: consequence, result
2
a : subsequent development
b : the next installment (as of a speech or story); especially : a literary, cinematic, or televised work continuing the course of a story begun in a preceding one

To that end I submit:

Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade
Toy Story 3

[chriso]

I have much respect for Udaman's list, as well as his clarification of his thought process.

But I'd include Godfather II, and a couple others.

In order

1) Godfather II - hard to improve much on Godfather, but I found this to be an improvement - more entertaining overall, watching Michael's growth as a gangster was riveting, and Robert DeNiro's addition was stellar.
2) Empire Strike Back - again, improving on an instant classic is tough, but Empire did. Better, darker, and deeper than A New Hope
3) Aliens - benefitted from being a completely different movie than the first, so actually hard to compare the two. Aliens was wildly entertaining, a great action/sci-fi/horror romp.
4) The Dark Knight - since it's part 2 of a reboot, I'll count it as second in the (new) Batman series. A great movie all the way around, with the best comic book villain performance of all time delivered by Ledger
5) Captain America: The Winter Soldier - also arguably movie number ? in a big series, but the 2nd Captain America standalone movie. Much better than the first Captain America (which I enjoyed quite a bit), and, IM(h)O, the best of the Marvel movies. Wildly entertaining start to finish and endlessly rewatchable.
6) Star Trek 2
7) Terminator 2
8) Spider Man 2
9) X2
10) 2 Fast 2 Furious

How about worst sequels? For me I'm placing emphasis on disappointment, as no one really expected Pumpkinhead 2 to be that good. And I'm cheating and including third entries and on. So for me it's Return of the Jedi (it's ok but Empire is my fav. movie ever and I'm still trying to recover from Ewoks) Alien 3, Beverly Hills Cop 3, Batman and Robin, Godfather 3, the second Matrix, Superman 3, and that's all I can think of at the moment. Oh Indy 4 too.

[Udaman]

So, what is your explanation for leaving out Toy Story 2, Silence of the Lambs (which goes alongside Godfather II as the only sequels to win Best Picture), Captain America: The Winter Soldier, The Bourne Supremacy, Terminator 2: Judgement Day, Superman II, LOTR: The Two Towers (ROTK won Best Picture, but you are only counting the second film in the series as a sequel, right?), and Mad Max 2: The Road Warrior?

-Jason "I think we've played this game before in other threads in the past. Nice diversion. Maybe we should do a poll some time to determine the DBR's best sequel of all time... we would need a definition of sequel though" Evans

Wow JE coming in with a solid right cross! My answers:

* Didn't love Toy Story 2. Thought it was good, but not as good as the first. Toy Story 3 was my favorite of the three, by far...but the third doesn't really count as a sequel to me. If it did, I would have it #2 on my list.

* Silence of the Lambs? Come on! That's not a sequel. First movie was obscure and with different people.

* Consider Captain America part of the Avengers storyline. Also, I'm one of the few who didn't love that movie. I really liked it...but don't have it in my top 10 all-time comic book movie.

* Bourne Supremacy was great. Would have it in Top 10

* Terminator 2 would be 6th on my list. Great, great movie, just not as good as the others.

* Superman 2 would be in top 10 list as well. Maybe 7th.

* The Two Towers, I consider really just one long movie. Kind of like Hunger Games. Not a sequel but a stand alone movie as part of a Three Part Story. And, it was the worst of the three movies to me (though the attack scene was unreal). Probably doesn't help that I saw that in a huge theater in the very first row (because we got there late) and I think my neck still hurts from watching it.

* Mad Max 2 would be in Top 10 as well. So top 10 would be

10. Mad Max
9. Bourne Supremacy
8. Godfather 2
7. Superman 2
6. Terminator 2
5-1 listed above

Incidentally, worst sequels is more interesting. If you stuck with the same rules as above (ie has to be the 2nd movie), that takes out a lot of bad ones (Superman IV, Spiderman 3, X-Men 3). Haven't thought too much about it, but #2 would be The Matrix Reloaded and #1 (in a class by itself) is Caddyshack 2.

[Troublemaker]

Silence was fantastic (never think of it as a sequel though, since Manhunter was done years before and had a totally different cast)

Right, and different directors, producers, everything.

Moreover, Red Dragon was then made, which is Manhunter in the SOTL franchise/universe. The way I look at that franchise/universe is that Lambs was the original. Red Dragon was the prequel. Hannibal was the sequel, and Hannibal Rising was never made. Manhunter is standalone and not part of that franchise/universe.

[JasonEvans]

Everyone hates Matrix Reloaded. I thought it was ok... much better than Matrix Revolutions, that's for sure!

Caddyshack 2 was truly terrible. The only cast member they got back was Chevy and I think he was on cocaine the entire time he was shooting that film. Blue Brothers 2000 minus Belushi (dead). Speed 2:Cruise Control minus Keanu. Grease 2 without Olivia Newton-John and Travolta. Do we see a pattern here?

-Jason "side note: I agree that Silence of the Lambs is not a sequel... but I have no idea why we would exclude the 3rd, 4th, or 8th film in a series and only consider 2nd films" Evans

[chriso]

Everyone hates Matrix Reloaded. I thought it was ok... much better than Matrix Revolutions, that's for sure!

Caddyshack 2 was truly terrible. The only cast member they got back was Chevy and I think he was on cocaine the entire time he was shooting that film. Blue Brothers 2000 minus Belushi (dead). Speed 2:Cruise Control minus Keanu. Grease 2 without Olivia Newton-John and Travolta. Do we see a pattern here?

-Jason "side note: I agree that Silence of the Lambs is not a sequel... but I have no idea why we would exclude the 3rd, 4th, or 8th film in a series and only consider 2nd films" Evans

I forgot about Speed 2. Yikes. If that took off Jason Patric would have had a completely different career. Neverending Story 2 was bad. I really liked the first. One review said Neverending movie haha.

[Udaman]

Everyone hates Matrix Reloaded. I thought it was ok... much better than Matrix Revolutions, that's for sure!

Caddyshack 2 was truly terrible. The only cast member they got back was Chevy and I think he was on cocaine the entire time he was shooting that film. Blue Brothers 2000 minus Belushi (dead). Speed 2:Cruise Control minus Keanu. Grease 2 without Olivia Newton-John and Travolta. Do we see a pattern here?

-Jason "side note: I agree that Silence of the Lambs is not a sequel... but I have no idea why we would exclude the 3rd, 4th, or 8th film in a series and only consider 2nd films" Evans

Grease 2!!! Now I'll have those songs in my head all day

"We're gonna score tonight. We're gonna score tonight. We're gonna rock, we're gonna roll, we're gonna bop, we're gonna bowl. We're gonna score tonight."

and of course

"I need a cool rider. A cool rider. If he's cool enough, he can burn me through and through."

The fact that Michelle Pfeiffer survived that movie and had the career that she did is a testament to her skill as a thespian!

FYI...(and pulling this thread back to the Top 5 Theme of 2017)...my 13 year old son wants to see the new Alien movie, so I told him he needed to see Alien and Aliens before doing that. He watched Alien yesterday. After it was over he said "That was really good. I mean really good. Great special effects. But...it wasn't scary at all." Somehow I think watching at home in the middle of the day with me there as opposed to in a movie theater at night...made a difference. He's watching Aliens tonight. Hard to imagine a better action movie for a 13 year old boy.

[Deslok]

Some notably bad sequels:
Highlander2
Staying Alive
Cars 2

and some movies that failed to meet already low expectations
Weekend at Bernies 2
Deuce Bigelow: European Gigilo

[davekay1971]

SW II: Attack of the Clones.

I submit this among the most crushing sequels. Not because it followed a great movie. It didn't. It followed SW I: Lets Make Some Money; which was a very disappointing movie. But after SW I, I still had hope. Okay, maybe they had some bad ideas but it's still the Star Wars universe, the special effects are killer, it's got Natalie Portman and Ewan McGregor and Samuel Jackson, and if they can just focus on the coolness they achieved with the Darth Maul scene...

SW II killed that hope. Killed it dead. Lucas had lost it, and this new trilogy was just going to suck.

[Gooch]

FYI...(and pulling this thread back to the Top 5 Theme of 2017)...my 13 year old son wants to see the new Alien movie, so I told him he needed to see Alien and Aliens before doing that. He watched Alien yesterday. After it was over he said "That was really good. I mean really good. Great special effects. But...it wasn't scary at all." Somehow I think watching at home in the middle of the day with me there as opposed to in a movie theater at night...made a difference. He's watching Aliens tonight. Hard to imagine a better action movie for a 13 year old boy.

You have that right...I snuck in to see Aliens when my friend and I were supposed to see Ferris Bueller's Day Off. Amazing movie plus the "thrill" of seeing an R-rated movie at that age. Top Ten movie for sure.

[Olympic Fan]

Everyone hates Matrix Reloaded. I thought it was ok... much better than Matrix Revolutions, that's for sure!

Caddyshack 2 was truly terrible. The only cast member they got back was Chevy and I think he was on cocaine the entire time he was shooting that film. Blue Brothers 2000 minus Belushi (dead). Speed 2:Cruise Control minus Keanu. Grease 2 without Olivia Newton-John and Travolta. Do we see a pattern here?

-Jason "side note: I agree that Silence of the Lambs is not a sequel... but I have no idea why we would exclude the 3rd, 4th, or 8th film in a series and only consider 2nd films" Evans

Good picks ...


I would add Kick*ss 2 -- I thought the first one was the second best comic book movie ever ... the sequel is unwatchable.

From the Marvel universe, add Thor 2 (the first wasn't very good, but this one was awful) and Avengers: Age of Ultron (a BIG dropoff from the original)

[Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15]

...my 13 year old son wants to see the new Alien movie, so I told him he needed to see Alien and Aliens before doing that. He watched Alien yesterday. After it was over he said "That was really good. I mean really good. Great special effects. But...it wasn't scary at all." Somehow I think watching at home in the middle of the day with me there as opposed to in a movie theater at night...made a difference. He's watching Aliens tonight. Hard to imagine a better action movie for a 13 year old boy.

The effects really are superb. So many sci-fi or action movies from the 70's and 80's just look horrible in the effects department. I think the reason Alien avoids that, is that it really doesn't try and do all that much. The monster lurks in the shadows, and when you do finally see it, it is slimy, in motion, and terrifying.