Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 44

Thread: Ryder Cup

  1. #1

    Ryder Cup

    Alright, gang. Starts tomorrow; morning pairings are out, with Phil/Keegan vs. Rory/Sergio the marquee matchup.

    I've sprinkled my thoughts throughout a couple other threads, so won't fully rehash:

    - cautiously optimistic, huge Tom Watson fan and think he'll instill the grittiness we need
    - think course design may help even out one of the biggest disadvantages when playing in Europe
    - worried about how we get W's in singles vs. any of McIlroy, Rose, Stenson, Poulter or Garcia
    - our young guys have by and large not been playing their best coming in, which is a worry. Too bad we couldn't have waited another two weeks for the captain's picks 'cause I'd sure love to have Billy Horshel on this team right about now.

    I'll go Europe 15 1/2, U.S. 13 1/2, with Fowler as U.S. MVP but it's not enough.

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Deeetroit City
    Quote Originally Posted by Mal View Post
    ... Starts tomorrow; ...
    Well, kind of. Tee off 2:30 AfreakinM

    Live on the Golf Channel

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    New York City
    Quote Originally Posted by BD80 View Post
    Well, kind of. Tee off 2:30 AfreakinM

    Live on the Golf Channel
    So tonight on the west coast.

    I love the initial pairings for the US, especially the Reed/Spieth combo. The last of the morning matches with Keegan/Phil vs. Rory/Sergio should be awesome. I'm also excited to see Fowler in his second Ryder Cup, I think he is going to lead the team this time around (and I love what he did with the hair by the way). The challenge for Europe is keeping the fire and can't lose attitude that sometimes comes with being an underdog even though they are considered a pretty big favorite. The home crowd will help, but I don't think the European team is as strong as people think. Rory, Justin Rose, Stenson and Sergio are playing well, but McDowell, Bjorn, Westwood and Poulter haven't been playing their best of late (of course with Poulter, you can probably throw that out the window). I'm curious to see how Dubuisson and Gallacher (lone Scotsman) respond to the pressure. I think the US counters the European well with a nice balance of youth and experience. Nobody (other than Horschel and Kirk maybe) has played better in the playoffs than Fowler (McIlroy may be on par) and Furyk is right behind. I expect Bubba, Zach Johnson, Phil and Bradley to play well on this course. I think it will be very tight on Sunday, and I have a feeling it will come down to the rookies on both sides - and I think the US rookies are better than the European rookies. 15-13 USA.
    Singler is IRON

    I STILL GOT IT! -- Ryan Kelly, March 2, 2013

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    Rent free in tarheels’ heads
    Quote Originally Posted by BD80 View Post
    Well, kind of. Tee off 2:30 AfreakinM

    Live on the Golf Channel
    At least my insomnia will finally be a positive.
    “Coach said no 3s.” - Zion on The Block

  5. #5
    Not going so well in alternate shot. I sort of feel like Spieth should be out there all the time. While I understand Furyk/Kuchar as two steady, straight hitting guys who theoretically should be putting for birdie 90% of the time, I think you need a little more than that, and I don't trust either of them on the green. Not surprised they lost. Phil/Keegan running on fumes, perhaps, as well. Huge win this morning, though. That eagle on 16 by Bradley was money.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    New York City
    Quote Originally Posted by Mal View Post
    Not going so well in alternate shot. I sort of feel like Spieth should be out there all the time. While I understand Furyk/Kuchar as two steady, straight hitting guys who theoretically should be putting for birdie 90% of the time, I think you need a little more than that, and I don't trust either of them on the green. Not surprised they lost. Phil/Keegan running on fumes, perhaps, as well. Huge win this morning, though. That eagle on 16 by Bradley was money.
    Terrible second session for the US, which was worse than it appeared it would be for most of the session when Garcia and Rory rallied for a half. I too am surprised Watson didn't play Spieth/Reed in the second session. I agree that Phil and Keegan maybe ran out of gas. After going to the wire in a tight fourball match, I think Watson should have rested Phil and Keegan and let Spieth and Reed play - they only played 14 holes and were out a little earlier so would have had plenty of time to rest. Furyk and Kuchar losing was an upset for the US even though I don't love them as a pairing for alternate shot. Watson and Simpson were just abysmal in the first session - they didn't get beat by great play. They just played horribly. I think Watson may have a different partner tomorrow.
    Singler is IRON

    I STILL GOT IT! -- Ryan Kelly, March 2, 2013

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Richmond, Va
    I would've kept Spieth out there and sat Phil, maybe same for both partners. Prefer to have Bubba out there unless he's lost.

    Afternoon wouldn't have been too bad except Rory/Sergio birdied last three for the halve. That hurt, big time.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Steamboat Springs, CO

    You Too Can Coach the Ryder Cup

    ... and be an improvement over both Tom Watson and last time's disaster, Tar Heel Davis Love III.

    Two big mistakes:

    1. The selection of Webb Simpson, Hunter Mahan and Keegan Bradley as captain's choices was not particularly inspired. None were playing well toward the end of the season and Tom Watson had to by-pass 14 other players to get to Mahan.
    2. The decision to play Mickelson and Keegan Bradley Friday afternoon after their morning victory was a big mistake. Phil can't play 36 holes in a day in this format, and the pair lost to GMac and Dubuisson. Watson ended up sitting Phil both sessions on Friday. The better choice for Friday PM would have been Spieth and Reed, who won Friday AM and then got 1.5 points on Saturday.


    Davis Love did not change any of the pairings throughout the 2013 Ryder Cup collapse. Stricker, for example, should not have been playing 36 holes, even though he was Tiger's preferred partner. He played terribly for the tournament and, when he couldn't go on Saturday, Tiger had to sit. Really, Davis?

    There is a move afoot for 2016 to draft Paul Azinger as coach. Zinger had a system in 1999 that seemed to work: creating three pods of four compatible players for practice rounds and workouts and forming teams from within each pod.
    Sage Grouse

    ---------------------------------------
    'When I got on the bus for my first road game at Duke, I saw that every player was carrying textbooks or laptops. I coached in the SEC for 25 years, and I had never seen that before, not even once.' - David Cutcliffe to Duke alumni in Washington, DC, June 2013

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Deeetroit City
    Watson was too much about ... Watson.

    Yes, maybe a bit elementary, but he seemed mostly concerned about enhancing his brand, trying to fire off as many quotable sound bites as he could.

    Making Phil play twice on Friday when he was clearly having trouble getting warm during the morning round (he wore the full jacket and gloves on both hands) was shear folly. The guy is a poster boy for arthritis, literally. A condition aggravated by the cold, a condition not generally an issue for a professional golfer. Further, the track has a total elevation of over 200 feet, and was reported to be a demanding course to even walk. Why play him twice the first day?

    I think Walker and Reed really made names for themselves. So did Duboisson

  10. #10
    At this point, what are the collective thoughts about the importance of the Ryder Cup?

    I beginning to think they need a Jerry Colangelo/Coach K type transformation.

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Steamboat Springs, CO
    Quote Originally Posted by YmoBeThere View Post
    At this point, what are the collective thoughts about the importance of the Ryder Cup?

    I beginning to think they need a Jerry Colangelo/Coach K type transformation.
    The US Ryder Cup team needs 12 guys like Patrick Reed, who really wants to be there and really, really wants to win. Coming down the stretch, Spieth, Reed and Mahan were all in position to win, and only Patrick did.
    Sage Grouse

    ---------------------------------------
    'When I got on the bus for my first road game at Duke, I saw that every player was carrying textbooks or laptops. I coached in the SEC for 25 years, and I had never seen that before, not even once.' - David Cutcliffe to Duke alumni in Washington, DC, June 2013

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Nashville, TN
    Quote Originally Posted by sagegrouse View Post
    ... and be an improvement over both Tom Watson and last time's disaster, Tar Heel Davis Love III.

    Two big mistakes:

    1. The selection of Webb Simpson, Hunter Mahan and Keegan Bradley as captain's choices was not particularly inspired. None were playing well toward the end of the season and Tom Watson had to by-pass 14 other players to get to Mahan.
    2. The decision to play Mickelson and Keegan Bradley Friday afternoon after their morning victory was a big mistake. Phil can't play 36 holes in a day in this format, and the pair lost to GMac and Dubuisson. Watson ended up sitting Phil both sessions on Friday. The better choice for Friday PM would have been Spieth and Reed, who won Friday AM and then got 1.5 points on Saturday.


    Davis Love did not change any of the pairings throughout the 2013 Ryder Cup collapse. Stricker, for example, should not have been playing 36 holes, even though he was Tiger's preferred partner. He played terribly for the tournament and, when he couldn't go on Saturday, Tiger had to sit. Really, Davis?

    There is a move afoot for 2016 to draft Paul Azinger as coach. Zinger had a system in 1999 that seemed to work: creating three pods of four compatible players for practice rounds and workouts and forming teams from within each pod.
    Azinger was the captain in 08. Crenshaw was the captain in 99. It seems like every post-Azinger captain has gone out of their way to not learn from Azinger's system.

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Steamboat Springs, CO
    Quote Originally Posted by NashvilleDevil View Post
    Azinger was the captain in 08. Crenshaw was the captain in 99. It seems like every post-Azinger captain has gone out of their way to not learn from Azinger's system.
    Thanks for the clarification.
    Sage Grouse

    ---------------------------------------
    'When I got on the bus for my first road game at Duke, I saw that every player was carrying textbooks or laptops. I coached in the SEC for 25 years, and I had never seen that before, not even once.' - David Cutcliffe to Duke alumni in Washington, DC, June 2013

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    The City of Brotherly Love except when it's cold.
    Quote Originally Posted by sagegrouse View Post
    The US Ryder Cup team needs 12 guys like Patrick Reed, who really wants to be there and really, really wants to win. Coming down the stretch, Spieth, Reed and Mahan were all in position to win, and only Patrick did.
    I would add Walker and Spieth. The rookies Reed and Spieth earned 6 of the 11.5 U.S. points. The two top U.S. qualifiers Watson and Fowler earned 1.5 points with Bubba putting up the big 0. Rickie can thank Walker.

    Hopefully Zinger will be asked and accept.

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    The City of Brotherly Love except when it's cold.
    Quote Originally Posted by sagegrouse View Post
    ... and be an improvement over both Tom Watson and last time's disaster, Tar Heel Davis Love III.

    Davis Love did not change any of the pairings throughout the 2013 Ryder Cup collapse. Stricker, for example, should not have been playing 36 holes, even though he was Tiger's preferred partner. He played terribly for the tournament and, when he couldn't go on Saturday, Tiger had to sit. Really, Davis?

    There is a move afoot for 2016 to draft Paul Azinger as coach. Zinger had a system in 1999 that seemed to work: creating three pods of four compatible players for practice rounds and workouts and forming teams from within each pod.
    I don't think you can fault Love's parings. The U.S. had a commanding 10-6 lead after Saturday and collapsed in singles. And Wood was awful in 2012. Sitting him was not a problem.

  16. #16
    Well, that wasn't very fun. Bottom line: we didn't play well enough - not enough darts thrown into greens, and not enough putts made.

    I'm disappointed with some of Watson's moves, especially because I was high on him as a captain. I don't feel like he connected emotionally with his team. It's easy when watching from afar, but it seemed obvious to me that Spieth and Reed needed to be out there Friday afternoon, and Mickelson and Bradley should have been saved for Saturday morning in best ball again.

    But at the end of it all, the players have to play. And our players didn't come through. The number of half or even full points we coughed up on 16-18 over the three days was more than enough to win this thing.

    As much as everyone's retrospectively gushing over Azinger's design back in 2008, one needs to remember a couple of things, in addition to the fact that we were at home and at a venue that's very well suited to the American style of play. More than that, their top guy, Padraig Harrington, played horribly. Sergio was mediocre and got rolled by Anthony Kim in singles. Westwood garnered two halves and two losses in four matches. Kim, Boo Weekley and JB Holmes, on the other hand, had the weeks of their lives, a la Jamie Donaldson this past week. For all the criticism that Faldo took for backloading on Sunday, he had Garcia, Rose, Stenson and Paul Casey (who was about to have his best season and would finish runnerup in the next two Accenture Match Play World Championships) going out early in singles. But the American players just steamrolled, with Kim, Weekley, Holmes and Kenny Perry all beating comparably or even higher rated guys.

    Some of that is confidence instilled by the captain. Some of it's home field advantage. Some of it's the ordering in singles. But at the end of the day, our guys played better. And at the end of yesterday, their guys played better. The guy I thought would break through this week, Fowler, straight up just didn't play well. Phil was terrible on Friday and Keegan carried him until his own fatigue settled in, and then he was bad. I don't know how he turned it around yesterday, but Matt Kuchar was awful the first two days. Bubba was utterly worthless. Simpson and Mahan and Furyk were mostly indifferent. How predictable was Mahan's dumpster fire on 18 yesterday, with thoughts of his muffed chip in 2010 ringing around his head after he'd already blown a 4 up lead after 7 by losing 4 holes in a row? All credit to our rookies, but even so, Spieth and Reed left half a point out there Saturday when they should have been done by 16, and Spieth collapsed yesterday when, had he won, it may have inspired everyone behind him. Frankly, we should have won 4 of the first 5 out, and 5 1/2 of 8. Would have put a whole different feeling on the end.

  17. #17
    Honestly, if you want the Americans to play better, offer them some prize money. Offer something like 500K for each point won. The Ryder Cup has gone from something that almost died 30 years ago to one of the biggest events in golf, and it brings it tens of millions of dollars for the PGA of America and the European tour. In fact, IIRC, the Ryder Cup income basically keeps the European tour viable. That may give the Euros a little more incentive than the Americans.

  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by 77devil View Post
    I don't think you can fault Love's parings. The U.S. had a commanding 10-6 lead after Saturday and collapsed in singles. And Wood was awful in 2012. Sitting him was not a problem.
    It's somewhat in contradiction to my previous post, but I do fault Love's inability to break up Woods/Stricker, and his singles order, wherein he put three Ryder Cup rookies with games and/or temperaments poorly suited to match play up front, when the entire world could have predicted that Ollie was going with some combination of Poulter/McIlroy/Donald/Rose. Why not counter with a bulldog like Zach Johnson, or even load up with Mickelson and/or Tiger? If we get just a half point out of the first three pairings, the wind comes out of their sails a little and it's a different day.

    That said, yes, the players still own the collapse. Furyk and Mickelson not getting even half a point between them, given where they sat after 16 holes, is still almost inconceivable (credit to Justin Rose's putter, but still).

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by chris13 View Post
    Honestly, if you want the Americans to play better, offer them some prize money. Offer something like 500K for each point won. The Ryder Cup has gone from something that almost died 30 years ago to one of the biggest events in golf, and it brings it tens of millions of dollars for the PGA of America and the European tour. In fact, IIRC, the Ryder Cup income basically keeps the European tour viable. That may give the Euros a little more incentive than the Americans.
    Interesting idea. I'd hate to try this and have it work, though.

    Given that over half the European team plays half the year or more in the U.S. these days, I don't know about the argument that they're more incentivized by monetary reasons to play well in the Ryder Cup. They make most of their money over here, anyway. My sense would be that what keeps the European Tour viable is (a) Tiger Woods' game falling off, and (b) having Rory and co. play enough tourneys over there that they can keep people's interest. Both of those have helped slow the expansion of purse differential between the two tours. If McIlroy, Rose and Stenson, et. al. were to go full-time on the PGA, the European Tour would become Europe's version of the web.com tour, and both would be just feeders for the PGA. I don't think that would change the Ryder Cup much, though, other than we wouldn't be so surprised when guys like Victor Dubuisson come along and knife us.

  20. #20
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Steamboat Springs, CO
    Quote Originally Posted by 77devil View Post
    I don't think you can fault Love's parings. The U.S. had a commanding 10-6 lead after Saturday and collapsed in singles. And Wood was awful in 2012. Sitting him was not a problem.
    Quote Originally Posted by Mal View Post
    It's somewhat in contradiction to my previous post, but I do fault Love's inability to break up Woods/Stricker, and his singles order, wherein he put three Ryder Cup rookies with games and/or temperaments poorly suited to match play up front, when the entire world could have predicted that Ollie was going with some combination of Poulter/McIlroy/Donald/Rose. Why not counter with a bulldog like Zach Johnson, or even load up with Mickelson and/or Tiger? If we get just a half point out of the first three pairings, the wind comes out of their sails a little and it's a different day.

    That said, yes, the players still own the collapse. Furyk and Mickelson not getting even half a point between them, given where they sat after 16 holes, is still almost inconceivable (credit to Justin Rose's putter, but still).
    Well, my capacity for (self-)flagellation when it comes to U.S. Ryder Cup matters knows no bounds. I was totally strung out during the 2012 match because Davis Love seemed to prefer 40-somethings to young firebrands and because he let Stricker onto the course after the first match. Somehow, the "chemistry" between Stricker and Tiger was supposed to overcome the fact that Steve couldn't even make par at Medinah. Moreover, Davis Love never changed a pairing in the course of the entire event, as though he had brought them down from Mt. Sinai.

    BTW I completely absolve Mickelson for the fact that Justin Rose made three 25-footers in a row to catch up and win, including one on 16 that would have been a really good two-putt. And BTW Mickelson never quit smiling. World-to-Johnny-Miller: golf is a game and is supposed to be fun.
    Sage Grouse

    ---------------------------------------
    'When I got on the bus for my first road game at Duke, I saw that every player was carrying textbooks or laptops. I coached in the SEC for 25 years, and I had never seen that before, not even once.' - David Cutcliffe to Duke alumni in Washington, DC, June 2013

Similar Threads

  1. 2014 Ryder Cup
    By sagegrouse in forum Off Topic
    Replies: 10
    Last Post: 09-06-2014, 11:37 AM
  2. Replies: 50
    Last Post: 10-04-2012, 12:51 PM
  3. 2008 Ryder Cup Matches - US 16.5, EU 11.5 - US wins Cup
    By throatybeard in forum Off Topic
    Replies: 60
    Last Post: 09-30-2012, 09:26 PM
  4. Great Ryder Cup Fiinish
    By NYC Duke Fan in forum Off Topic
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 10-06-2010, 08:35 AM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •