Wally Wade changes

[grossbus]

noted in the front page article that field will be lowered. anyone know how much? hope they include good drainage system.

[Gargoyle]

Here is a write-up from the News and Record.

http://www.news-record.com/blogs/spo...a4bcf6878.html

[Duvall]

Duke release on the addition of 311 restrooms, as well as other cosmetic changes.

Duke University will launch three projects to enhance Wallace Wade Stadium following the current season, Vice President and Director of Athletics Dr. Kevin White announced on Wednesday. This past weekend, the Duke Board of Trustees approved design and granted construction authorization for the three initiatives, which are being funded entirely by private gifts specifically for the renovation.

The three developments include a new tower to replace the Finch-Yeager Building on the west side of the stadium, a new video board and speaker arrangement to be located in the south end zone as well as concourse enhancements on the North and West Gates of the facility, which opened in 1929 as Duke Stadium and was renamed for Hall of Fame coach Wallace Wade in 1967.

[fogey]

noted in the front page article that field will be lowered. anyone know how much? hope they include good drainage system.

Hope they lower it plenty, to allow for construction of new seating much closer to the field (where the track is?) that do not impede views of established seats! Give it unique feel, a la Cameron! Really exciting.

[mattman91]

noted in the front page article that field will be lowered. anyone know how much? hope they include good drainage system.

I remember reading they originally were going to lower it 10 feet. This was considered when they were planning to close the bowl. Now, I believe the new plan calls to only lower it 5 feet, which doesn't make a whole lot a sense to me.

[Zeb]

Now, I believe the new plan calls to only lower it 5 feet, which doesn't make a whole lot a sense to me.

I have heard we planned to lower the field so we could eliminate the track and add new seats. Given the attendance we've seen so far this season, I could understand if we decided that additional seating is not a priority and instead we're trying to make the current capacity more alluring. But if we're not adding new seats (and this article doesn't mention any), why lower the field now?

[BigWayne]

I have heard we planned to lower the field so we could eliminate the track and add new seats. Given the attendance we've seen so far this season, I could understand if we decided that additional seating is not a priority and instead we're trying to make the current capacity more alluring. But if we're not adding new seats (and this article doesn't mention any), why lower the field now?

This press release covers the next phase of what has been approved by the BOT. The lowering of the field and seat addition was already approved earlier.

http://www.goduke.com/ViewArticle.dbml?ATCLID=209543028

Duke’s project will add approximately 3,000 seats to Wallace Wade — an extra 8-10 rows closer to the field. Many of those seats will be new, individual seats with backs. In fact, a large number of seats in the bowl will be converted from bleachers to individual seats — eventually seven sections on both the East and the West sides.

The first conversions are already going in, as the seven East side sections are being installed this summer. That will be the only significant change to Wade Stadium for the coming season.
The real work — and it will be massive — begins as soon as the 2014 Devils play their final home game (Nov. 29 vs. Wake Forest).

The first stage — the track removal, the lowering of field and the extension of the stands — has already been approved by the Board of Trustees. That part of the timetable is set.

[Jarhead]

I have heard we planned to lower the field so we could eliminate the track and add new seats. Given the attendance we've seen so far this season, I could understand if we decided that additional seating is not a priority and instead we're trying to make the current capacity more alluring. But if we're not adding new seats (and this article doesn't mention any), why lower the field now?

Making room for more fans is certainly one of the hopes for the new plan, as is a better view of the playing field. Another hope is that improvements in the football program will continue. As the team improves its record people in the triangle who have no connection to Duke will begin buying tickets to the home games. I am one of the few posters on this board that have been in our stadium with nearly 60,000 fans. That's an astounding bunch of folks when one considers the fact that the entire student body numbered somewhere around 6,000 students. Those crowds were populated buy the people of Durham and the surrounding counties. There were alumni too, but they were also small in number. The Durham folks, the tobacco and textile workers, and Duke Hospital employees probably made up about half of the over 50K fans. As bad as the program has been the last bunch of years, it will take some time to bring the crowds back.

We don't have many tobacco or textile workers anymore, but the students and alumni are more than doubled. The population of the Triangle area has gotten up beyond seven figures. It was barely over 5 figures back then The goal is to attract some percentage of them to see Duke Football. Aside from the improvements in the team and coaching, another thing that will help is to improve the viewing experience. Lowering the field is one way of doing that. I don't know the precise geometry of a lowered field, but it will move the stands as much as ten feet closer to the playing field. Sitting in those rows is an attraction in itself, but my seats, on about the 48th yard line about thirty rows up in the stands have a very poor view over sidelines. All of those players, coaches, water boys and girls, officials, and news media standing around, don't you know. Any view of action within 5 to 10 yards of the sideline is obstructed from my view.

Lowering the field 5 feet, the probable figure, will help a lot. In fact, I'd like them to make it somewhat lower, but I'm not an engineer. I don't have a clue as to how many rows of seats that will get us, but I'll have a better view.

[duke79]

I have heard we planned to lower the field so we could eliminate the track and add new seats. Given the attendance we've seen so far this season, I could understand if we decided that additional seating is not a priority and instead we're trying to make the current capacity more alluring. But if we're not adding new seats (and this article doesn't mention any), why lower the field now?

Yea, no doubt the stadium could use a major upgrade (although from I can see on TV, it looks about 400% better than when I was a student in the late 70's and early 80's. It was truly down in the dumps in those days. I vaguely remember wooden, splinter-filled, vintage-1962 benches for seats). I have to admit from watching a couple of the games on TV this year and games in the past few years, the attendance looks pathetic (and I realize the camera angle is facing towards the visitor side of the field but even still. The stadium looks about 30% full when they show a full shot of the whole stadium). I truly feel sorry for Coach Cut, the rest of the coaching staff and the players. I think they REALLY deserve better from the fans. I sometimes wonder if Coach Cut longs for the days at Tennessee or Ole Miss when he was coaching in front of 60,000 or 70,000 screaming fans? It has to be somewhat depressing.

I'm no marketing expert but I wonder if there isn't a better way to attract fans to the games (including students. I mean, heck, aren't there 15,000 students at Duke now. What else is there to do on Saturday afternoons? Study for the LSAT's?). I think maybe they should just give away tickets to some of the less attractive games to get bodies into the seats. They can make some money on concessions and other stuff. In a sense, the marginal cost is almost negligible to letting more people come to the games. I suppose the other alternative is try to schedule more marquee games, a la Alabama, Notre Dame, Stanford, USC, Tennessee, etc. They would bring more people out to the games but wouldn't help the win/loss record much.

I'm glad the university (or the donors really) is stepping up to the plate to renovate the stadium. The football program deserves it. Let's hope they can figure out how to get more bodies in the stadium on game days.

[uh_no]

I'm no marketing expert but I wonder if there isn't a better way to attract fans to the games (including students. I mean, heck, aren't there 15,000 students at Duke now. What else is there to do on Saturday afternoons? Study for the LSAT's?). I think maybe they should just give away tickets to some of the less attractive games to get bodies into the seats.

They already do

employee day
military day
etc.

plus student tickets are free. Also, there are only 6500 undergrads...and many of the grad students a) live off campus and what grad student is gonna pony up bucks for parking (and then walk). b) have a bazillion other things on their plate, so spending big chunks of time getting to and from the game, plus the game time itself is a big ask. c) they don't sell ramen noodles at the game :P

[Olympic Fan]

Making room for more fans is certainly one of the hopes for the new plan, as is a better view of the playing field. Another hope is that improvements in the football program will continue. As the team improves its record people in the triangle who have no connection to Duke will begin buying tickets to the home games. I am one of the few posters on this board that have been in our stadium with nearly 60,000 fans. That's an astounding bunch of folks when one considers the fact that the entire student body numbered somewhere around 6,000 students. Those crowds were populated buy the people of Durham and the surrounding counties. There were alumni too, but they were also small in number. The Durham folks, the tobacco and textile workers, and Duke Hospital employees probably made up about half of the over 50K fans. As bad as the program has been the last bunch of years, it will take some time to bring the crowds back.

You must be older than me to remember crowds that big ...

The stadium attendance record is 57,500 -- for a visit by Choo Choo Justice and UNC in 1949. Until the mid-1970s, that was the largest crowd to see a football game in the state of North Carolina.

Two years earlier, in 1947 Duke-UNC drew 56,500 -- the second largest crowd. The Rose Bowl was third on Jan. 1, 1942 -- 56,000.

Duke has topped 50,000 just once since 1951 -- 51,500 for the 1971 Duke-UNC game.

Soon after that, Duke removed the 10,000 or so "temporary" bleachers around the top of the concourse (which had been there since the 1930s). For big games in the 30s and 40s, they also added real temporary bleachers in the end zone and around the inside of the lower wall of the horseshoe.

I could have missed one, but since 1971, the two biggest home football crowds I can find are the 1975 Duke-UNC game (42,100) and the 1989 Duke-State game (41,200). There may have been a concert or graduation with bigger crowds, but I did check the big track and field meets Duke hosted in the '70s and the largest single day crowd was 38,500 for the second day of the USA-USSR Meet in 1974 (that's the second largest non-Olympic track crowd in US history).

The biggest home crowd in the Cut era appears to be 33,941 -- that was the announced attendance for both the 2009 opener against Elon and the 2012 Duke-UNC game.

[Duvall]

Video displaying renderings of the next set of Duke facilities upgrades.

Kevin White's presentation from this morning, which includes the video above.

[Bluedog]

You must be older than me to remember crowds that big ...

The stadium attendance record is 57,500 -- for a visit by Choo Choo Justice and UNC in 1949. Until the mid-1970s, that was the largest crowd to see a football game in the state of North Carolina.

Two years earlier, in 1947 Duke-UNC drew 56,500 -- the second largest crowd. The Rose Bowl was third on Jan. 1, 1942 -- 56,000.

Duke has topped 50,000 just once since 1951 -- 51,500 for the 1971 Duke-UNC game.

Soon after that, Duke removed the 10,000 or so "temporary" bleachers around the top of the concourse (which had been there since the 1930s). For big games in the 30s and 40s, they also added real temporary bleachers in the end zone and around the inside of the lower wall of the horseshoe.

I could have missed one, but since 1971, the two biggest home football crowds I can find are the 1975 Duke-UNC game (42,100) and the 1989 Duke-State game (41,200). There may have been a concert or graduation with bigger crowds, but I did check the big track and field meets Duke hosted in the '70s and the largest single day crowd was 38,500 for the second day of the USA-USSR Meet in 1974 (that's the second largest non-Olympic track crowd in US history).

The biggest home crowd in the Cut era appears to be 33,941 -- that was the announced attendance for both the 2009 opener against Elon and the 2012 Duke-UNC game.

Actually, the attendance for the Alabama at Duke game in 2010 was the most in the Cut era at 39,042. They brought in extra stands to be able to fit all the fans coming from Alabama. So, that was within spitting distance of those 1975 and 1989 crowds. Not often does one get to correct Olympic Fan! But, seriously, thanks for all the great historical insight into these things.

[Tom B.]

The biggest home crowd in the Cut era appears to be 33,941 -- that was the announced attendance for both the 2009 opener against Elon and the 2012 Duke-UNC game.

If I'm not mistaken, 33,941 is the "official" capacity for the stadium, meaning those two games were sellouts. Of course, that doesn't necessarily mean that every game with that announced attendance has exactly that many butts in seats. It could be less (if, for instance, some season ticket holders don't show up and their seats go unused -- I think those are still counted as occupied seats because they're paid for), or it could be more, depending on how many folks get squeezed in while the fire marshal's not looking. Just like the announced attendance for games in Cameron is always 9,314, even for early-season games against Podunk U. (when there are clearly empty seats upstairs and often gaps in the student section), or the Carolina game (when every seat upstairs is filled and the student section is packed at maximum density).

I was in Wally Wade when Carolina played Duke in 1994 (Fred Goldsmith's first year as head coach, which was Duke's last decent team pre-Cut), and the place was full. The announced attendance was 40,103.

[sagegrouse]

You must be older than me to remember crowds that big ...

The stadium attendance record is 57,500 -- for a visit by Choo Choo Justice and UNC in 1949. Until the mid-1970s, that was the largest crowd to see a football game in the state of North Carolina.

Two years earlier, in 1947 Duke-UNC drew 56,500 -- the second largest crowd. The Rose Bowl was third on Jan. 1, 1942 -- 56,000.

Duke has topped 50,000 just once since 1951 -- 51,500 for the 1971 Duke-UNC game.

Soon after that, Duke removed the 10,000 or so "temporary" bleachers around the top of the concourse (which had been there since the 1930s). For big games in the 30s and 40s, they also added real temporary bleachers in the end zone and around the inside of the lower wall of the horseshoe.

I could have missed one, but since 1971, the two biggest home football crowds I can find are the 1975 Duke-UNC game (42,100) and the 1989 Duke-State game (41,200). There may have been a concert or graduation with bigger crowds, but I did check the big track and field meets Duke hosted in the '70s and the largest single day crowd was 38,500 for the second day of the USA-USSR Meet in 1974 (that's the second largest non-Olympic track crowd in US history).

The biggest home crowd in the Cut era appears to be 33,941 -- that was the announced attendance for both the 2009 opener against Elon and the 2012 Duke-UNC game.

A decade earlier, we had 40,000+ crowds for one or two games every year: Navy in 1960 (the Navy goat game w/ Joe Bellino) and 1963 (w/ Roger Staubach); UNC in 1961 and 1963; Georgia Tech in 1960 and 1962, which was from the '40s through the mid-60's a very big regional match-up in the South.

[fuse]

http://acc.blogs.starnewsonline.com/...s-for-alabama/

Article says under 38k capacity for Duke-Alabama.
My memory is not the best, I was at that game and thought attendance was announced at 49k.

Everyone was shoulder to shoulder in the stands, and the concourse was also almost impossible to navigate.

I tried to find a more official record, this link says 39k.
http://www.northcarolinahistory.org/...edia/468/entry

[uh_no]

Ithink we can get there. It takes time...and hard to judge based on ooc games...which have been either hot or rainy so far. Win this next one and well see some big crowds the rest of the way...also maybe time to stop charging stupid amounts for food...


That said...snapped a few pics of the new track last week. Ill post later

[lucybluebear]

I remember being at a Duke - Clemson game in the late 60's . I was sitting in temporary seating. Duke lost 9 - 3. Seemed like more than 40,000

[Son of Jarhead]

I have heard we planned to lower the field so we could eliminate the track and add new seats. Given the attendance we've seen so far this season, I could understand if we decided that additional seating is not a priority and instead we're trying to make the current capacity more alluring. But if we're not adding new seats (and this article doesn't mention any), why lower the field now?

From what I heard, the number of feet lower is indeed 5, and they will be adding seats. New seating will be added below the current wall around the track (thus the need to lower the field and remove the track), as well as in the new tower in the form of luxury box seating and box seating hanging from the front of the tower. Not sure how many that will add, but if I had to guess, I'd say a few thousand at least. I would be glad if it is enough to hit 40,000.

You must be older than me to remember crowds that big ...

The stadium attendance record is 57,500 -- for a visit by Choo Choo Justice and UNC in 1949. Until the mid-1970s, that was the largest crowd to see a football game in the state of North Carolina.

Duke has topped 50,000 just once since 1951 -- 51,500 for the 1971 Duke-UNC game.

Soon after that, Duke removed the 10,000 or so "temporary" bleachers around the top of the concourse (which had been there since the 1930s).

Well, Jarhead is getting up there, but... he's well preserved. ... I think 57,500 qualifies as "nearly 60,000" and, well, he was there for that game.

When Jarhead first came to Duke, Wallace Wade was still the coach. I know this because, as The Son of Jarhead, he has told me at least 100 times, usually including a tidbit about Wade sitting on the bench during the game with his players staying behind the bench so he could see the field (which had the added bonus of improving the fans view as well).

I'm pretty certain I was at the '71 unc game, I remember the huge crowd... and I remember finding all sorts of interesting things under those bleachers around the top of the stadium when going under them to retrieve the small blue plastic football Jarhead had given to me and The Other Sons of Jarhead to toss about (as if either of them could throw the darn thing in the ocean while floating in it!). Oh, and the unc fans were every bit as rude then, even to a 7-yr old kid.

Great memories! Still blessed to be able to go to games with my Pops, even if I have heard his stories many times over, I still love them with every telling.

We will likely never get back to the big crowds of Jarhead's memories, but if we keep winning and can attract in some folks from the community at large, something near 40,000 is a reasonable size. I will miss those big shade trees under which we on the away side escape the sun pregame & at halftime which appear from the drawings to be going bye-bye, but I am looking forward to seeing the finished product... and many, many more wins! Go Duke!!!!

[uh_no]

From what I heard, the number of feet lower is indeed 5, and they will be adding seats. New seating will be added below the current wall around the track (thus the need to lower the field and remove the track), as well as in the new tower in the form of luxury box seating and box seating hanging from the front of the tower. Not sure how many that will add, but if I had to guess, I'd say a few thousand at least. I would be glad if it is enough to hit 40,000.

I think 40k would be a stretch. the plans i've seen only show the new rows of seats behind the endzone and along the sidelines...not ALL the way around...so only another thousand or 2 at MOST. The new tower probably won't support more than 1k more than today.

so i'd say next year's capacity will be ~36k

empty seats are worse than a sellout IMO...so i'm okay with playing conservative with the expansions...especially when they don't inhibit future additions, such as closing the bowl and adding a second deck (as some plans have shown)