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  1. #61
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
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    Deeetroit City
    Quote Originally Posted by JBDuke View Post
    ... For context, the other movie musicals I've given 10's to are: "The Sound of Music", "The King and I", "The Wizard of Oz", "Beauty and the Beast", "Mary Poppins", and "Singin' in the Rain".
    Where do "West Side Story" and "Oliver" rank?

    And we musn't forget 1980 "Can't Stop the Music" - “It's tough to believe any movie that opens with Steve Guttenberg dancing on rollerskates could actually get worse from there, but it does -- and in such spectacular fashion!” wrote Philadelphia Weekly. The movie bears the distinction of being the very first recipient of the Golden Raspberry Awards’ Worst Picture and Worst Screenplay trophies. For perspective, "Can't Stop" beat out "Xanadu" for the Razzie that year.

  2. #62
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Austin, TX
    Quote Originally Posted by JBDuke View Post

    Now, as to Russell Crowe. I don't think Hooper handled him well. Crowe was one of the weaker singers in the cast, IMO. But he's a really good actor, and he did a masterful job of acting Javert. Where he fell short a bit was in singing Javert's songs. But Hooper didn't help him very much, either. Javert's big numbers are "Stars" and "Javert's Suicide". Hooper didn't figure out a way to allow Crowe to sing these songs small, like he did for "I Dreamed a Dream" and "Who Am I?". If he had, I suspect Crowe could have carried them off. But I can't even THINK of a way that you could stage "Stars" in that small fashion. "Stars" is Javert swearing with all his passion that he will pursue Valjean to the end of his days. It really does call for a big, powerful, baritone voice to sing it to the max, and Crowe just wasn't up to it. For "Javert's Suicide", Crowe was able to masterfully act the internal conflict and desperation in Javert as he contemplates a life in the world of Jean Valjean and decides he can't stand it. That allowed him to overcome his vocal limitations and still make that scene an excellent one, IMO. Likewise, I think he did a fine job with Jackman in "The Confrontation". And in the rest of the film, Crowe's superior acting talent and physical power let him inhabit the Javert role with real aplomb.
    I saw it again yesterday. Other than "Stars," I think maybe I was too hard on Crowe ("Stars" still doesn't work at all). The first time I saw it, I was probably subconsciously going to judge him on "Stars", giving him the benefit of the doubt up to that point in the movie. Now that I know "Stars" wasn't that good, when you see the rest of it (the Confrontation, as a spy behind the Barricade) it actually was really good. He played "angry, stern, holier than thou" Javert really well, and was at his best when working off of someone. The suicide wasn't his best, but there was some real emotion there that perhaps I didn't see the first time around.

    Also, on second viewing, the ensemble pieces worked even better. You can also catch Frances Ruffelle with a few lines as the hoors (/Jersey) were huddled around Fantine at the end of Lovely Ladies.

  3. #63
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Forest Hills, NY
    [QUOTE=A-Tex Devil;615412... You can also catch Frances Ruffelle with a few lines as the hoors (/Jersey) were huddled around Fantine at the end of Lovely Ladies.[/QUOTE]

    Wow, I didn't catch that. Originated the role of Eponine on the West End and Broadway. Nice touch...connecting the original cast with the movie (Ruffelle and Wilkinson).

  4. #64
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    raleigh
    and for another viewpoint,,,,,


    http://themattwalshblog.com/2012/12/...to-hate-again/



    lol...poor guy
    "One POSSIBLE future. From your point of view... I don't know tech stuff.".... Kyle Reese

  5. #65
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Southern Pines, NC
    Quote Originally Posted by JBDuke View Post
    ...Acknowledging my love of movie musicals, I'd give this film at least a 9 out of 10 on my IMDB vote, and I might just bump it up to 10/10. For context, the other movie musicals I've given 10's to are: "The Sound of Music", "The King and I", "The Wizard of Oz", "Beauty and the Beast", "Mary Poppins", and "Singin' in the Rain".
    Best review I have read, JB. Thanks. Mrs. Jarhead and I are looking forward to seeing it on screen. I also agree in large part with your list of other musical theater movies. I would add South Pacific to your list, and a level lower I would have Chicago, but Renée Zellweger and Richard Gere were miscast. Catherine Zeta-Jones, Queen Latifah and a few others on the cast were great. Wasn't Singing in the Rain on film before it was on stage? We saw that sometime ago at Wolf Trap in Northern Virginia. Great show in a great venue.

  6. #66
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Raleigh, NC
    Quote Originally Posted by A-Tex Devil View Post
    I saw it again yesterday. Other than "Stars," I think maybe I was too hard on Crowe ("Stars" still doesn't work at all). The first time I saw it, I was probably subconsciously going to judge him on "Stars", giving him the benefit of the doubt up to that point in the movie. Now that I know "Stars" wasn't that good, when you see the rest of it (the Confrontation, as a spy behind the Barricade) it actually was really good. He played "angry, stern, holier than thou" Javert really well, and was at his best when working off of someone. The suicide wasn't his best, but there was some real emotion there that perhaps I didn't see the first time around.

    Also, on second viewing, the ensemble pieces worked even better. You can also catch Frances Ruffelle with a few lines as the hoors (/Jersey) were huddled around Fantine at the end of Lovely Ladies.
    My wife and I finally saw this Saturday night.

    I don't think you were too hard on Crowe. He'd make a great Javert in a non-musical look at Les Miz. But he just doesn't have the singing chops to pull off the musical. I cringed everytime he sang. Not as bad as casting Pierce Brosnan in Mama Mia but a miscast nonetheless.

    Other than that, no quibbles. Three hours well spent. And kudos for casting Colm Wilkinson. A nice touch.

    That said, I don't understand why this ends the way it does. It's primarily the story of the redemption of Jean Valjean. He and Javert are the key figures. Everyone else is ancillary, including the revolutionaries. And, as these things go, this wasn't one of the big French uprisings. But the students are abandoned by their supposed allies and are slaughtered as a result.

    So, why have it end with those same people singing triumphantly about never being slaves again? Where were they when the army stormed the barricades? You can talk the talk . . .

    A minor point to be sure. I can understand ending on stage this way, because it sets up the final curtain calls. But it seems like a disjointented way to wrap up the movie.

    Another aside. My wife and I love visiting the mountains and try to bundle summer trips with musicals at either Barter Theater in Abindgon or Flat Rock Playhouse. Both are showing Les Miserables this summer. Both are state-supported entities and give pretty high quality performances as a general rule.

  7. #67
    Quote Originally Posted by jimsumner View Post
    My wife and I finally saw this Saturday night.

    I don't think you were too hard on Crowe. He'd make a great Javert in a non-musical look at Les Miz. But he just doesn't have the singing chops to pull off the musical. I cringed everytime he sang. Not as bad as casting Pierce Brosnan in Mama Mia but a miscast nonetheless.

    Other than that, no quibbles. Three hours well spent. And kudos for casting Colm Wilkinson. A nice touch.

    That said, I don't understand why this ends the way it does. It's primarily the story of the redemption of Jean Valjean. He and Javert are the key figures. Everyone else is ancillary, including the revolutionaries. And, as these things go, this wasn't one of the big French uprisings. But the students are abandoned by their supposed allies and are slaughtered as a result.

    So, why have it end with those same people singing triumphantly about never being slaves again? Where were they when the army stormed the barricades? You can talk the talk . . .

    A minor point to be sure. I can understand ending on stage this way, because it sets up the final curtain calls. But it seems like a disjointented way to wrap up the movie.

    Another aside. My wife and I love visiting the mountains and try to bundle summer trips with musicals at either Barter Theater in Abindgon or Flat Rock Playhouse. Both are showing Les Miserables this summer. Both are state-supported entities and give pretty high quality performances as a general rule.
    I have never seen Les Mis in any form, and I live in the mountains. I may have to look this up. Thanks for the info!

  8. #68
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Raleigh, NC
    Quote Originally Posted by theAlaskanBear View Post
    I have never seen Les Mis in any form, and I live in the mountains. I may have to look this up. Thanks for the info!
    http://www.bartertheatre.com/shows/

    http://www.flatrockplayhouse.org/201...yhouse-season/

    For clarification purposes, I'm not talking about the Alaskan mountains.

  9. #69
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Austin, TX
    Quote Originally Posted by jimsumner View Post
    That said, I don't understand why this ends the way it does. It's primarily the story of the redemption of Jean Valjean. He and Javert are the key figures. Everyone else is ancillary, including the revolutionaries. And, as these things go, this wasn't one of the big French uprisings. But the students are abandoned by their supposed allies and are slaughtered as a result.

    So, why have it end with those same people singing triumphantly about never being slaves again? Where were they when the army stormed the barricades? You can talk the talk . . .
    My understanding is that the ending, in the movie specifically, is supposed to be, symbolically, the French Revolution of 1848 when that particular monarchy was finally overthrown.

    Also, the lyrics are a bit different at the end, than when sung half way through the play/movie. It's more "uplifting" than angry. But I do get your main point that it takes the focus away from the heart of the story.

    That said -- you can't *not* have the full chorus sing that at the end. It's one of the top 3 parts of the play for me.

  10. #70
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Raleigh, NC
    Quote Originally Posted by A-Tex Devil View Post
    My understanding is that the ending, in the movie specifically, is supposed to be, symbolically, the French Revolution of 1848 when that particular monarchy was finally overthrown.

    Also, the lyrics are a bit different at the end, than when sung half way through the play/movie. It's more "uplifting" than angry. But I do get your main point that it takes the focus away from the heart of the story.

    That said -- you can't *not* have the full chorus sing that at the end. It's one of the top 3 parts of the play for me.
    Thanks. I'm not sure how we were supposed the pick that up. Then again, it was a long movie and I did have a soft drink, so I may have had other things on my mind by that time.

  11. #71
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Steamboat Springs, CO

    The Last Scene -- Don't Sweat It

    I wouldn't apply the test of realism to this tale. Les Mis is not only a musical, but virtually every line is sung. Do people do that in real life? So, why worry about verisimilitude (ooohh!)? Les Mis had a cinematic curtain call with a really big barricade foreshadowing bigger revolutions ahead (1848, as A-Tex noted) and bringing back to life all the dead "Red and Black." Heavens! Fantine came back to life in the previous scene.

    My reaction: the movie was overpowering in comparison to the stage show; it was almost too emotional for me. Memorable.

    sagegrouse

  12. #72
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Raleigh, NC
    Quote Originally Posted by sagegrouse View Post
    I wouldn't apply the test of realism to this tale. Les Mis is not only a musical, but virtually every line is sung. Do people do that in real life? So, why worry about verisimilitude (ooohh!)? Les Mis had a cinematic curtain call with a really big barricade foreshadowing bigger revolutions ahead (1848, as A-Tex noted) and bringing back to life all the dead "Red and Black." Heavens! Fantine came back to life in the previous scene.

    My reaction: the movie was overpowering in comparison to the stage show; it was almost too emotional for me. Memorable.

    sagegrouse
    Well, that applies to every musical, every opera, every ballet. Demented barbers generally don't sing as they cut their victims' throats, Russian maidens don't often dance themselves to death to insure a productive harvest. You make that concession going in.

    But West Side Story doesn't end with Tony coming back and dancing the mambo with Maria in anticipation of the Civil Rights Act.

    I still think it should have ended with Valjean ascending to heaven, redeemed for all eternity.

    But that's me. YMMV.
    Last edited by jimsumner; 01-08-2013 at 10:37 AM.

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