Intel on Ed Davis, UNC commit

[whereinthehellami]

Has anyone here seen Ed Davis play? If so, whats his game like?

I'm not thrilled that UNC landed him but considering they missed out on the guys they really wanted and he is like Roy's fourth option (Roe, Samuels, Aminu), I guess its not such a bad deal.

Most of the recruiting sites have him as a 6-8, 215 LB power froward, who likes to play facing the basket. Interestingly, Scout has "low block scrorer" and "perimter shot" as areas for improvement, I guess hes got a great middle game Ed Davis comes in at #6 in the RSCI Top 100.

I've seen some summer reports recently saying the Davis has played very well this summer and is probably going to move up in the rankings. He played Greg Monroe even when they played about a month ago.

Here is a youtube video of Ed in a dunking contest.

Hopefully Ed Davis will turn out to be more Jawad Willimas than Marvin Williams.

[Patrick Yates]

This could really help UNC offset any potential losses in the post. The kid is anywhere from top 5-top 15, probably closer to the former. UNC, which should be very good this year, now has a comfort zone. Realistically, their two commits, Davis and Drew, are all they need this year. They MAY lose Lawson, Hans, and Ellington this year. Other players are always a possibility of going pro, but that is unlikely. Of the 3 most likely candidates, Lawson is most likely to go, followed by Ellington and Hans (who probably would have gone by now if he was going to go-he is starting to look like a four year stud).

Of course a National Championship might push all three out the door. That said, Drew would allow Frasor to play SG next year should Ellington and Lawson Bolt, so UNC would be a least solid there next year, and should Hans bolt, Davis would provide needed depth at the PF/SF positions, with Thompson/Stephenson really carrying the load in the post. If Hans stays, this would let Davis play more at the three, where he would probably like to end up as in the NBA, and make UNC a real juggernaught next year, even if TL and WE leave, which is no given.

UNC is still involved with some 08 recruits, but I would not be surprised if they stood pat with what they currently have and really started concentrating on the loaded 09 class, where UNC will need some real help on the Wing, as well as bringing in another post player for depth, etc.

Bad day for UNC's rivals.

On the plus side, this does have some miniscule positive implications for Duke.

1) Uconn is deprived of a good recruit, which is nice. Thabeet will probably leave this year, making Uconn thin in the post in 09.

2) This is really devastating to UVA and Leitao. This could be the first nail in his coffin. This probably all but eliminates UVA from the Elliot Williams race. If UVA had gotten Davis, Elliot Wlliams might have joined him at UVA (Leitao was the first coach to recruit Williams, so he was a surprising inclusion on EW's list). With Davis, Willams would have the talent at UVA to make some noise. Now, with Singletary exiting the program and lackluster recruiting classes, I have to think UVA is out of the Williams race. There just is not enough talent for Williams to excell at UVA. Frankly, UVA would be so weak when EW arrived that the opposing defenses would key on him from day 1.

So, overall this is bad for Duke. But, it probably eliminates a major competitor for a key recruit.

Ray of sunshine and all that.

Patrick Yates

[sandinmyshoes]

I heard he will drop in the ranking because he finished the summer on a down note while playing with an ankle injury. I don't know if his high school schedule is strong enough to help him bump back up.

I wonder if he realized his rankings were going to drop and pulled the trigger on the offer out of fear that it might go away? Doubtful, I know, since he isn't likely to fall that far, but who knows what these kids think. It does seem that something caused him to take the offer sooner than most anticipated.

Perhaps because he got wind that UNC had pulled nearly even with Purdue for Zeller? Could UNC have told the two of them that it was one or the other of them? Or would they take both?

[Patrick Yates]

Ed Davis is a 6-8 225lb combo forward, and Zellar is a 7(+?)ft center/forward. If you can get both, you take both. But Zellar is no done deal, and I think that UNC wisely pulled the trigger. Sort of a bird in the hand scenario. Like I said, if UNC could reel in Zeller great, but with Davis and Drew they don't really need any other recruits out of what is a fairly weak class, nationally.

Patrick Yates

[jawk24]

Is there a reason why Duke didn't recruit him, I live in Richmond and I know the school he attends has a good academic reputation. Since when did Duke stop recruiting kids ranked in the top 10 in their class that attend good schools with high academic standards??? Seems like another case of Duke missing out, what will happen if they miss on Monroe, then what?

[Patrick Yates]

Is there a reason why Duke didn't recruit him, I live in Richmond and I know the school he attends has a good academic reputation. Since when did Duke stop recruiting kids ranked in the top 10 in their class that attend good schools with high academic standards??? Seems like another case of Duke missing out, what will happen if they miss on Monroe, then what?

I am completely simpatico as to your questions. But you will get slammed/redacted for questioning K's mistake free guidance of the program/recruiting. However, Davis's dad is apparantly a huge UNC fan, so maybe we did not have a chance with the kid. I do not know. It is somewhat apparant that we never pursued the kid at all.

As to what happens if we do not get Monroe? I don't know. The Dunigan kid has committed to Oregon. Most of the other posts are off the board. Czyz remains our only other target at this point, but he projects as a SF down the road, but could help at PF immediatly (but not dominate. I stress HELP).

If we don't get Monroe? Continued Mediocrity? Who knows?

Patrick Yates

[sandinmyshoes]

Often if a coach doesn't get a good vibe on initial contact they won't waste their time pursuing a player. Maybe Coach K just didn't think Davis was interested in Duke? At least not enough to make him an efficient use of recruiting time and money?

Some people are claiming that Davis was UNC's fourth choice, but also claiming Duke should have been after him hard. The two things don't seem to mesh.

As for Zeller and Davis, I've heard that Zeller's high post game would be a good match for Davis' low post game. I suppose the possibility of UNC trying to take both would depend on how they feel about the players already in their system and what they feel about the '09 class.

[jaimedun34]

Is there a reason why Duke didn't recruit him, I live in Richmond and I know the school he attends has a good academic reputation. Since when did Duke stop recruiting kids ranked in the top 10 in their class that attend good schools with high academic standards??? Seems like another case of Duke missing out, what will happen if they miss on Monroe, then what?

According to scout.com right now, Greg Monroe and Ed Davis are 1 and 2 in the overall rankins, respectively. I think part of it may be that with Thomas and Singler, it would have been very difficult to recruit yet another top 10 post player in that class (and this is not even considering McClure, King and Zoubek in the rotation).

Who knows? Maybe Davis wasn't considering Duke. That is always a possibility.

[whereinthehellami]

The Sabre, UVA's sport's site, is in meltdown mode after losing Davis to UNC. UVA was on this kid hard and he was in their backyard. Leito needed this bigtime.

I'm amazed at how quickly he signed with them considering the fact that UNC got in the game so late. Roy is a helluva recruiter, you got to give him that. Roy has always reminded me of a used car salesman with his tan and good ole boy personna but I guess it works in conjuntion with the UNC brand.

[Patrick Yates]

Outside of Singletary, there is probably not a single kid at UVA who would even be on Duke or UNC's team, or at least, none that would play anything other than mop-up minutes. Last year there were whispers by well known columnists (articles no longer up) that Leitao was a nightmare to play for and that he ran down kids routinely, and that he was abusive on the sidelines.

Much like Bob Knight, it is easy for a player to look past this if the team is winning and talent is flowing into the program. Neither is true at UVA. Leitao may be a heck of a tactician, but his style is more suited to mid majors, where the level of athletes dictate that the players need the school (scholarship, education, etc) more than the school need the players. At high majors, top schools, even Duke and UNC, need the players at least as much as the players need the schools. Lets face it, Davis, Monroe, Singler, Hansborough, etc, could have gone anywhere in America and played, a lot. To keep winning, top schools must bring in top kids. That is hard to do if you constantly abuse the kids. It shows on TV, and I assume it shows on recruiting visits.

As for Davis at UVA, as I said earlier, the talent wasn't there. When Singletary leaves, there is no evidence that UVA will have a capable PG to get Davis the ball, unlike at UNC. Even if Williams had committed to UVA, he seems more suited to SG, at least in the short run. So, given that Davis probably needs a quality PG to feed him the ball, UNC was a better fit. There is enough talent in place that ED can develop as a player without being chained to the low post like at UVA (cause at 6-8 and 225, which may be generous as far as weight, he has no realistic pro career as a PF, not when the 6-9 245lb Hans has his size questioned).

Personally, I thought UVA might squeek it out, but I thought that it would be sentimental and foolhardy choice on ED's part. (I was hoping for UCONN instead).

But, like I said, first nail in Leitao's coffin. VTech is decent, and UVA will start a big slide this year. That seat will be red hot by May of 09.

Patrick Yates

[Classof06]

Outside of Singletary, there is probably not a single kid at UVA who would even be on Duke or UNC's team, or at least, none that would play anything other than mop-up minutes. Last year there were whispers by well known columnists (articles no longer up) that Leitao was a nightmare to play for and that he ran down kids routinely, and that he was abusive on the sidelines.

Much like Bob Knight, it is easy for a player to look past this if the team is winning and talent is flowing into the program. Neither is true at UVA. Leitao may be a heck of a tactician, but his style is more suited to mid majors, where the level of athletes dictate that the players need the school (scholarship, education, etc) more than the school need the players. At high majors, top schools, even Duke and UNC, need the players at least as much as the players need the schools. Lets face it, Davis, Monroe, Singler, Hansborough, etc, could have gone anywhere in America and played, a lot. To keep winning, top schools must bring in top kids. That is hard to do if you constantly abuse the kids. It shows on TV, and I assume it shows on recruiting visits.

As for Davis at UVA, as I said earlier, the talent wasn't there. When Singletary leaves, there is no evidence that UVA will have a capable PG to get Davis the ball, unlike at UNC. Even if Williams had committed to UVA, he seems more suited to SG, at least in the short run. So, given that Davis probably needs a quality PG to feed him the ball, UNC was a better fit. There is enough talent in place that ED can develop as a player without being chained to the low post like at UVA (cause at 6-8 and 225, which may be generous as far as weight, he has no realistic pro career as a PF, not when the 6-9 245lb Hans has his size questioned).

Personally, I thought UVA might squeek it out, but I thought that it would be sentimental and foolhardy choice on ED's part. (I was hoping for UCONN instead).

But, like I said, first nail in Leitao's coffin. VTech is decent, and UVA will start a big slide this year. That seat will be red hot by May of 09.

Patrick Yates

Your argument can be summed up in one word: premature. Despite having two very good college guards in Singletary and Reynolds, Leitao absolutely maxed out the talent on that team last year. Not to mention they were ACC Regular Season Co-Champs, getting a piece of the crown for the first time since 1995...in Leitao's 2nd year. And you're telling me his coaching style is more suited for mid-majors? On what basis? I'm not going to say that missing out on Davis is a non-issue, but UVA has been missing out on in-state talent for a long time, now; when missing out on Davis (and even EW, if that's the case) is measured against the success Leitao has achieved so far, the term "hot seat" shouldn't even come into the equation. First nail in the coffin? You're talking about the reigning ACC Coach of the Year!

In fact, I think UVA even being in the running for these kids is a sign that Leitao's making UVA relevant once again; let's not forget Virginia was on Patterson's list for a while as well. As sad as it sounds, the shooting massacre that occurred at Virginia Tech tips the in-state tug-of-war in favor of UVA; we've already seen at least 2 VTech commits back out since the shooting. This is without even considering academics (UVA superior) and facilities (John Paul Jones arena vs. Cassell Coliseum isn't even comparable--I've been in Cassell and it's a dump).

I'm aware of the many rumors that Leitao is extremely hard on his kids, but I have two things to say in response that. First of all, the kids he has (not his recruits) really aren't that good. Second, regardless of how bad they feel about getting yelled at, they will forever be remembered as ACC regular season conference champions, something I'm sure those kids never imagined when they stepped foot on campus; also something they know is a product of the coach they have.

Your argument seems to imply that because Leitao can't recruit like Roy Will or Krzyzewski, he's going to be on the hot seat. Saying that Leitao will be on the hot seat isn't far off from say the same about Sidney Lowe, which is even more preposterous. Both coaches have their programs going in the right direction for the first time in a while, and wouldn't ya know, both beat Duke last year. They're obviously not where they want to be yet, but Leitao's entering his 3rd year as head coach; coaches might get fired ridiculously quick these days, but Leitao's had more than enough early success to build a cushion for himself. The fact that UVA sold out virtually every home game last year while going 14-2 at home all but ensures that.

[yancem]

I actually agree with most of your assessment but I do have a couple of points. First although UVA won the ACC regular season they had a very favorable schedule and had some help from a several teams that performed below expectations. I'm not trying to say it's not an accomplishment but it might not be career builder you think it is. UVA will certainly see some slippage next year and if they don't bring in ACC caliber recuits then Leitao will soon struggle. He should have at least a couple of years to prove himself though. Second Lowe seems to be recruiting quite well so that might not be a great comparison

[VaDukie]

Is there a reason why Duke didn't recruit him, I live in Richmond and I know the school he attends has a good academic reputation. Since when did Duke stop recruiting kids ranked in the top 10 in their class that attend good schools with high academic standards??? Seems like another case of Duke missing out, what will happen if they miss on Monroe, then what?

Saying Benedictine has high academic standards is a bit of a stretch - it's a good school, but it doesn't send kids Duke's way.

[VaDukie]

I think Leitao's intense style may be a reaction to playing for Pete "No discipline" Gillen. I'd guess that as guys get used to playing hard he will calm down. If he doesn't, then UVA may not make that next leap.

[Classof06]

I actually agree with most of your assessment but I do have a couple of points. First although UVA won the ACC regular season they had a very favorable schedule and had some help from a several teams that performed below expectations. I'm not trying to say it's not an accomplishment but it might not be career builder you think it is. UVA will certainly see some slippage next year and if they don't bring in ACC caliber recuits then Leitao will soon struggle. He should have at least a couple of years to prove himself though. Second Lowe seems to be recruiting quite well so that might not be a great comparison

At some point he will have to start landing these recruits, I agree with that. And true, UVA did have an easy ACC schedule. But how many people (including Duke fans) remember or care that Duke had the hardest ACC schedule? An ACC co-title is an ACC co-title; Duke's 8-8 ACC record is Duke's 8-8 ACC record. I just don't believe that missing out on one big recruit going into the 3rd year of a pretty impressive coaching job is going to reverse the momentum that Leitao has created. Especially when the school wasn't even being considered by elite recruits before he got there.

[jimsumner]

I think the idea that Davis was UNC's 4th choice is a significant reach. Davis and Samuels don't overlap at all and I suspect RW would have found a schollie for Davis and Roe or Davis and Aminu, had such an opportunity presented itself. He is a significant addition.

I also think it's absurd to even entertain the possibility that Davis made a premature decision because he thought he might drop in the rankings. The coaches could not possibly care less about where scout.com or rivals.com or anybody else ranks a recruit.

[ACCBBallFan]

As usual agree with Jim.

In addition, no way Dave Leitao is in any job jeopardy. UVA fans should take key person insurance out on Jim Calhoun, because Dave Leitao is likely his succesor at UCONN in a few years,

And VA Tech lost Coleman Collins, Zabian Dowdell and Jamont Gordon, plus Krabbenden and at least one recruit reneged. they still have Deron Washington and AJ Vassallo but UVA still has Singletary and Diane, and more bigs, though they are not all that good.

My guess is UVA finishes ahead of VA Tech this year but neither in top half of ACC. Hokies likely compete with FSU, Wake and Miami for bottom 4, with UVA a notch ahead jostling with MD and BC for 6th in ACC but likely on outside of the NCAA bubble slot.

He may see some of his lefty self in Sean S, but Elliot Williams can watch the double teaming that happens to Singletary again like it did his first two years, before JR Reynolds relieved some pressure this past year. Such would be his fate at UVA until Leitao stops coming in top 5 but not top one in battles for Patteron, Ed Davis et al.

At least he is in the fight which was not the case with time-out Gillen.

[whereinthehellami]

I think the idea that Davis was UNC's 4th choice is a significant reach. Davis and Samuels don't overlap at all and I suspect RW would have found a schollie for Davis and Roe or Davis and Aminu, had such an opportunity presented itself. He is a significant addition.

Obviously I don't know the ins and outs of whats going on but I do follow UNC and am on IC as much as I'm on DBR and I'm not sure that Davis being UNC's 4th choice is that much a reach. Roy targeted Roe first and thought he had him, lost him, then he offered offered Samuels (maybe a 5). After Samuels went to Lousiville, he put the full court press on Aminu, who then signed with Wake. Then Roy put the full court press on Davis and seemingly landed him within 2 weeks. Would he have taken Davis in addition to those other players, sure he would have but he wanted the others first. Why? Davis's dad is a huge fan of UNC and sceptics would say (viva La Sabre) that this was the overiding reason he signed with UNC, his mother apparently wanted UVA (closer to home). So, why would Roy not target Ed Davis first when he had this very big in? Thats the question. Ed Davis is no doubht very talented but there is a reason that Roy didn't have him as his first option. I'm sure he will do well at UNC and they are definately not crying over there and no one is feeling sorry for UNC landing a top 10 talent but it could have been worse is all I'm saying.

Some Coaches don't always take talented payers. Word is that Tyreke Evans is a huge UNC fan/lean and is a top 5 HS player but apparently Roy didn't like the entourage issues that Evans brings to the table and didn't extend an offer.

[Bob Green]

I'm sure he will do well at UNC and they are definately not crying over there and no one is feeling sorry for UNC landing a top 10 talent but it could have been worse is all I'm saying.

Okay, definitely - the most misspelled word on DBR. I have to agree with Jim Sumner on this one. Scout.com has Ed Davis as the # 2 player in the Class of 2008. UNC wanted him all along and they got him.

Bob Green
Yokosuka, Japan

[phillyheel]

Obviously I don't know the ins and outs of whats going on but I do follow UNC and am on IC as much as I'm on DBR and I'm not sure that Davis being UNC's 4th choice is that much a reach. Roy targeted Roe first and thought he had him, lost him, then he offered offered Samuels (maybe a 5). After Samuels went to Lousiville, he put the full court press on Aminu, who then signed with Wake. Then Roy put the full court press on Davis and seemingly landed him within 2 weeks.

This is inaccurate as far as I understand it. Roy had offers out for Drew(1), Holiday (2), Roe (4/3), and Samuels(5) and this represented his 'dream' class so to speak. Once Roe chose MSU he immediately offered Davis and Aminu both. It is more accurate to call Davis the second option, it just so happens that Aminu made his decision before Davis. Samuels was independent of all of them.

I believe he still has 2 offers out on Zeller and Shumpert. Both of these guys were offered later after Roy deemed they had raised their game to a significant level and his first choices chose other options (Derozan would also fit here but firmed his commitment to SoCal). It remains to be seen whether the Zeller offer remains with the Davis commitment. It may have been a first come offer between Davis/Aminu/Zeller or possibly Zeller is deemed a '4 year' talent as opposed to Davis being a '1 year' talent.