2014 Basketball Recruiting thread

[Ichabod Drain]

Why is everyone assuming Kentucky is not a player here? If anyone has shown the ability to bring multiple big-time studs together at the same time, it is Cal.

-Jason "the Harrisons and Julius Randle are all likely to turn pro after one year so Cal will have time available -- like he always does when his entire roster departs after one year" Evans

Everything I've read has Cal and Kentucky all in on Mudiay, that combined with the fact that it's the only school on both their lists that they aren't taking their official together.

I could see them splitting up before both going to Kentucky... but stranger things have happened.

[NSDukeFan]

I for one prefer sticking more with facts in this thread, since speculation could sometimes be seen as an affront to potential recruits or their families. The facts include, who did we offer, who will visit us and others, when are recruits saying they will decide, what recruits say about how many schools and which schools are on their short list. Speculation is more along the line of someone suggesting a player is leaning one way or another for a variety or usually poorly supported reasons.

Facts in a recruiting thread? There may be lots of facts (e.g. what did Recruit A's brother's friend's cousin's sister say about where Recruit A may be going), but really nothing matters until these 15-18 year old (or 22 year old in Shabazz' case?) kids get to weigh everything out, visit the schools, build relationships with the coaches, change their minds a million times if they want or can't decide and finally make their decisions.
I agree that suggesting a player is leaning one way or another may be supported poorly, but I don't think it is unreasonable (based on the too much I have read about his recruitment) to assume, for example, that Jones is likely to be leaning Duke's way. The problem, of course, is that unofficial and official visits can, and should, influence a player's recruiting decision and a recruit is free to change his/her mind many times when thinking about the great opportunities that he/she is presented with and the great coaches, staffs and players he has met and built relationships with. In the end, who was leading or how much ground did a school make up, doesn't matter.
That said, I will still follow this thread listening to what shoes Recruit B's coach was wearing the other day and whether that is a key to where Recruit B will be going, I just won't expect anything of actual importance until the recruits themselves tweet or pick one hat over the others or announce on ESPN or whatever (no skype, please.)

[sagegrouse]

Facts in a recruiting thread? There may be lots of facts (e.g. what did Recruit A's brother's friend's cousin's sister say about where Recruit A may be going), but really nothing matters until these 15-18 year old (or 22 year old in Shabazz' case?) kids get to weigh everything out, visit the schools, build relationships with the coaches, change their minds a million times if they want or can't decide and finally make their decisions.
I agree that suggesting a player is leaning one way or another may be supported poorly, but I don't think it is unreasonable (based on the too much I have read about his recruitment) to assume, for example, that Jones is likely to be leaning Duke's way. The problem, of course, is that unofficial and official visits can, and should, influence a player's recruiting decision and a recruit is free to change his/her mind many times when thinking about the great opportunities that he/she is presented with and the great coaches, staffs and players he has met and built relationships with. In the end, who was leading or how much ground did a school make up, doesn't matter.
That said, I will still follow this thread listening to what shoes Recruit B's coach was wearing the other day and whether that is a key to where Recruit B will be going, I just won't expect anything of actual importance until the recruits themselves tweet or pick one hat over the others or announce on ESPN or whatever (no skype, please.)

Although not always agreeing with President Reagan, I did like his approach to elections. A typical exchange: A reporter shouts out, "Governor, do you think you'll win the election?" RR: "I don't predict elections, but I am hopeful." Works for me in both recruiting and basketball games.

sagegrouse

[tommy]

Why is everyone assuming Kentucky is not a player here? If anyone has shown the ability to bring multiple big-time studs together at the same time, it is Cal.

-Jason "the Harrisons and Julius Randle are all likely to turn pro after one year so Cal will have time available -- like he always does when his entire roster departs after one year" Evans

In addition to, as another poster noted, Calipari recruiting Mudiay hard, and IMO he is very likely to get him, one big factor is the personality of Tyus Jones. He is not a typical super-elite recruit. He is more quiet, more reserved (off the floor) and he has made it clear that he is not into the recruiting circus, the endless speculation, the interviews, the inordinate attention being paid to this, he's not into the bling and the 'den of luxury' approach exemplified by the likes of Kentucky. Education matters to him. He is a classy kid, a smart kid from a good family whose feet are planted firmly on the ground. If a kid like this reverses course and says, in effect, "screw it. I'm going to Kentucky too" then there's no reason to ever really follow recruiting, because nobody can really know anything. I wouldn't have been shocked had he gone to a program like Michigan State or Ohio State, especially given their proximity to home, but Kentucky or Baylor? They seem to embody everything that Tyus Jones doesn't like about this whole thing.

[roywhite]

In addition to, as another poster noted, Calipari recruiting Mudiay hard, and IMO he is very likely to get him, one big factor is the personality of Tyus Jones. He is not a typical super-elite recruit. He is more quiet, more reserved (off the floor) and he has made it clear that he is not into the recruiting circus, the endless speculation, the interviews, the inordinate attention being paid to this, he's not into the bling and the 'den of luxury' approach exemplified by the likes of Kentucky. Education matters to him. He is a classy kid, a smart kid from a good family whose feet are planted firmly on the ground. If a kid like this reverses course and says, in effect, "screw it. I'm going to Kentucky too" then there's no reason to ever really follow recruiting, because nobody can really know anything. I wouldn't have been shocked had he gone to a program like Michigan State or Ohio State, especially given their proximity to home, but Kentucky or Baylor? They seem to embody everything that Tyus Jones doesn't like about this whole thing.

It's encouraging to hear your observations about Tyus Jones, and it sounds positive for Duke's chances.

I'm wondering, though, if a one-and-done prospect has different criteria than a prospect who expects to be in college for 3 or 4 years?
Even if he's been a serious student, just how much weight does such a prospect put on the education part of the equation?
Might not choose Kentucky for a 4-year stay as a college student/athlete, but might go for a one-year stop on the way to the NBA?

This is more of a hypothetical situation; don't know if it applies to Tyus.

[Duvall]

In addition to, as another poster noted, Calipari recruiting Mudiay hard, and IMO he is very likely to get him, one big factor is the personality of Tyus Jones. He is not a typical super-elite recruit. He is more quiet, more reserved (off the floor) and he has made it clear that he is not into the recruiting circus, the endless speculation, the interviews, the inordinate attention being paid to this, he's not into the bling and the 'den of luxury' approach exemplified by the likes of Kentucky. Education matters to him. He is a classy kid, a smart kid from a good family whose feet are planted firmly on the ground. If a kid like this reverses course and says, in effect, "screw it. I'm going to Kentucky too" then there's no reason to ever really follow recruiting, because nobody can really know anything. I wouldn't have been shocked had he gone to a program like Michigan State or Ohio State, especially given their proximity to home, but Kentucky or Baylor? They seem to embody everything that Tyus Jones doesn't like about this whole thing.

Still, let's be fair - is there anything in that description of Jones that wouldn't also apply to Brandon Knight?

[jimsumner]

Still, let's be fair - is there anything in that description of Jones that wouldn't also apply to Brandon Knight?

Duke didn't prioritize Brandon Knight and make him their only point-guard target.

[flyingdutchdevil]

Still, let's be fair - is there anything in that description of Jones that wouldn't also apply to Brandon Knight?

Wait - Tyus Jones also got destroyed by a DeAndre Jordan dunk and got owned by Kyrie?

In all fairness, you're right. Knight is a stellar guy and seemed like a good student. I'd want him on a Duke team any day.

[Duvall]

Duke didn't prioritize Brandon Knight and make him their only point-guard target.

Oh, sure. I was just pointing out that smart and classy kids go to Kentucky to become one-and-done players.

[johnb]

In addition to, as another poster noted, Calipari recruiting Mudiay hard, and IMO he is very likely to get him, one big factor is the personality of Tyus Jones. He is not a typical super-elite recruit. He is more quiet, more reserved (off the floor) and he has made it clear that he is not into the recruiting circus, the endless speculation, the interviews, the inordinate attention being paid to this, he's not into the bling and the 'den of luxury' approach exemplified by the likes of Kentucky. Education matters to him. He is a classy kid, a smart kid from a good family whose feet are planted firmly on the ground. If a kid like this reverses course and says, in effect, "screw it. I'm going to Kentucky too" then there's no reason to ever really follow recruiting, because nobody can really know anything. I wouldn't have been shocked had he gone to a program like Michigan State or Ohio State, especially given their proximity to home, but Kentucky or Baylor? They seem to embody everything that Tyus Jones doesn't like about this whole thing.

Three major reasons to go to Kentucky (competitive practices, great coaching, national visibility) are major reasons to go to Duke. I'd say many people would put our program alongside Kentucky's in terms of who we recruit (essentially only top 40 players), and I don't see any reason to throw rocks at their players.

One reason to consider Duke a better choice than Kentucky is that we annually have a backbone of really excellent players who will be upperclassmen. The contribution of people like Tyler, Josh, and Andre exceeds their game PT and extends into knowing what to expect, when to turn it on, how to survive a long season, how to study for classes during relentless travel, etc. That's one reason that we have such a long run of being in the top 10, and Kentucky flailed last year. Looking at their roster this year, of course, they should be favored to be the talented team in March, but I'll still take our chances...

[Turtleboy]

Duke didn't prioritize Brandon Knight and make him their only point-guard target.

That's not really answering the question, is it, since there is nothing in the cited description that refers to such?

[jimsumner]

That's not really answering the question, is it, since there is nothing in the cited description that refers to such?

I think it relevant to the implied question, if Knight would go to Kentucky, why wouldn't Jones?

[Turtleboy]

I think it relevant to the implied question, if Knight would go to Kentucky, why wouldn't Jones?

Inferred perhaps. You are on much more shaky ground with "implied".

So what's wrong with answering the actual question? Surely it has priority.

[jimsumner]

Inferred perhaps. You are on much more shaky ground with "implied".

So what's wrong with answering the actual question? Surely it has priority.

Wasn't it rhetorical? For the record, Duke isn't the only school that brings in bright, articulate players. Has anyone suggested to the contrary?

But from the Duke perspective, Knight and Jones have had much different recruitments. Which seems more relevant to a thread on Duke's 2014 recruiting than parsing the difference between implied and inferred.

[Des Esseintes]

Inferred perhaps. You are on much more shaky ground with "implied".

So what's wrong with answering the actual question? Surely it has priority.

Seriously, man. Every thread you participate in, you pick fights for--near as I can tell--no reason at all. Your posture is relentlessly hostile, and more often than not you deploy insulting language on your interlocutors when you've received nothing in kind from them. It's a free country, but I am bewildered by why someone would choose to be so unpleasant all the time.

[JasonEvans]

Seriously, man. Every thread you participate in, you pick fights for--near as I can tell--no reason at all. Your posture is relentlessly hostile, and more often than not you deploy insulting language on your interlocutors when you've received nothing in kind from them. It's a free country, but I am bewildered by why someone would choose to be so unpleasant all the time.

Ok, folks... lets all stay calm here.

Point made... now lets move on and get back to a recruiting discussion.

-Jason "mod much?" Evans

[scottdude8]

For what its worth, I know for a fact that Knight was an exception to the "Kentucky players are thugs or dumb or just looking for money" rule. Knight was an honor student in high school and had a very high GPA at Kentucky, and was a model player while with the Pistons. He's extremely eloquent and well spoken, and my friends who work for the Pistons were nothing but impressed with him as a human being.

So basically what I'm saying here is that there are exceptions to the Kentucky rule, so we can't count them out of anything. That being said I like most people would be shocked if Kentucky got in on Jones.

[tommy]

Craig Victor, a 6'8" forward out of Lousiana (though he plays at Findlay Prep) is going to pop tomorrow. He's ranked in the 20's by most scouts, maybe low 30's by a few. Good, solid high major player. Sure seems like he's going to decide between Arizona and LSU. I'm sure the Winslow household will be watching this closely, as he essentially plays the same position as does Justise. While I'm sure Justise wouldn't be afraid of competing with Victor, from Duke's perspective it can't be bad if Victor heads to Tucson.

[Nugget]

Craig Victor, a 6'8" forward out of Lousiana (though he plays at Findlay Prep) is going to pop tomorrow. He's ranked in the 20's by most scouts, maybe low 30's by a few. Good, solid high major player. Sure seems like he's going to decide between Arizona and LSU. I'm sure the Winslow household will be watching this closely, as he essentially plays the same position as does Justise. While I'm sure Justise wouldn't be afraid of competing with Victor, from Duke's perspective it can't be bad if Victor heads to Tucson.

Is that really true. All the descriptions I've seen of Victor's game are that he is more of a 3/4 player, whereas Justise is 2/3 wing.

[tommy]

Victor to Arizona. Doesn't mean we'll get Winslow, but it don't hurt.